A business card is not much, you need smth like a credit card or a bit thicker. Regular printer paper folded 10 times should work well.
Bora WTO
Moderator: robbosmans
Forum rules
The spirit of this board is to compile and organize wheels and tires related discussions.
If a new wheel tech is released, (say for example, TPU tubes, a brand new tire, or a new rim standard), feel free to start the discussion in the popular "Road". Your topic will eventually be moved here!
The spirit of this board is to compile and organize wheels and tires related discussions.
If a new wheel tech is released, (say for example, TPU tubes, a brand new tire, or a new rim standard), feel free to start the discussion in the popular "Road". Your topic will eventually be moved here!
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I don't know what kind of terain you are ridying, but 90% or more of my rides have ascents/descents longer than 2-3km, so for me it ALWAYS ends up with braking noise after a (short) while...
And I repeat, I come from Bontrager Aeolus carbon rims and I NEVER had this kind of issue, my other friends ride Reynolds, DT Swiss and other brands and I didn't noticed this annoying issue with their wheels
And I repeat, I come from Bontrager Aeolus carbon rims and I NEVER had this kind of issue, my other friends ride Reynolds, DT Swiss and other brands and I didn't noticed this annoying issue with their wheels
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Cable/housing length ? More info possible ?Alexandrumarian wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 9:14 pmI have once had it right during any medium braking, not just after hard/descents etc. Strong toein helped but better was to alter the cable/housing length.
Can someone compare the ride quality (harshness) of the Bora 50 vs WTO 60? I've got the 50s on my Time Skylon and take a beating unless the roads are smooth. I'm trying to determine if it's more related to the Skylon frame and/or 50s. I am building up another aero bike (Parlee RZ7) and am considering the WTO 60. Given the deeper profile compared to the 50s, my assumption is they will ride even more harsh, although I am confident the Parlee will help dampen the pounding.
In reality I would expect most deep carbon wheels to feel much the same, with very few outliers. If you find the Bora 50 harsh I doubt you would find the WTO 60 to feel much different.jzinckgra wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 4:56 pmCan someone compare the ride quality (harshness) of the Bora 50 vs WTO 60? I've got the 50s on my Time Skylon and take a beating unless the roads are smooth. I'm trying to determine if it's more related to the Skylon frame and/or 50s. I am building up another aero bike (Parlee RZ7) and am considering the WTO 60. Given the deeper profile compared to the 50s, my assumption is they will ride even more harsh, although I am confident the Parlee will help dampen the pounding.
Find comfortable tyres/pressures.
Giant Propel Advanced SL Red Etap 11s Easton EC90 wheels CeramicSpeed BB Zipp SL70 bars 6.5kg
Vitus ZX1 CRS Campy Chorus 12s Bora WTO 45 disk brake wheels Zipp SL70 bars 7.5kg
Vitus ZX1 CRS Campy Chorus 12s Bora WTO 45 disk brake wheels Zipp SL70 bars 7.5kg
SL8 build with Craft CS5060 Wheels in progress
- zappafile123
- Posts: 656
- Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:24 am
I'd agree that most deep wheels are fairly similar in terms of comfort levels, but I do think there is some healthy variance where you really can feel that some wheels are more comfy than others depending on the spokes used and the stiffness of the rim (whilst controlling for tyre choice and pressure). Boras are pretty smooth IMO and I'd say there is no real difference between WTOs and regular Boras.Nickldn wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 6:51 pmIn reality I would expect most deep carbon wheels to feel much the same, with very few outliers. If you find the Bora 50 harsh I doubt you would find the WTO 60 to feel much different.jzinckgra wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 4:56 pmCan someone compare the ride quality (harshness) of the Bora 50 vs WTO 60? I've got the 50s on my Time Skylon and take a beating unless the roads are smooth. I'm trying to determine if it's more related to the Skylon frame and/or 50s. I am building up another aero bike (Parlee RZ7) and am considering the WTO 60. Given the deeper profile compared to the 50s, my assumption is they will ride even more harsh, although I am confident the Parlee will help dampen the pounding.
Find comfortable tyres/pressures.
The problem is definitely the Skylon - it's an unrelentingly harsh ride from my limited experience riding it. A good rememdy there would be to run tubeless 28s if you dont mind the aero pendalty and the tubless hassle.
BTW I dont rate the WTO s on account of their sluggish rollup - there are better hoops out there.
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Oooh, that's going to be controversial!zappafile123 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:25 amBTW I dont rate the WTO s on account of their sluggish rollup - there are better hoops out there.
What are your suggestions for hoops other than campy in the 55-60mm? From what I've read rovals are bad in crosswinds, enve 5.6 are fair. I'm not interested in going with another Chinese rim as I've already done that once and warranty issue was a turn off. What else should I consider? I'm 70kgzappafile123 wrote:I'd agree that most deep wheels are fairly similar in terms of comfort levels, but I do think there is some healthy variance where you really can feel that some wheels are more comfy than others depending on the spokes used and the stiffness of the rim (whilst controlling for tyre choice and pressure). Boras are pretty smooth IMO and I'd say there is no real difference between WTOs and regular Boras.Nickldn wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 6:51 pmIn reality I would expect most deep carbon wheels to feel much the same, with very few outliers. If you find the Bora 50 harsh I doubt you would find the WTO 60 to feel much different.jzinckgra wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 4:56 pmCan someone compare the ride quality (harshness) of the Bora 50 vs WTO 60? I've got the 50s on my Time Skylon and take a beating unless the roads are smooth. I'm trying to determine if it's more related to the Skylon frame and/or 50s. I am building up another aero bike (Parlee RZ7) and am considering the WTO 60. Given the deeper profile compared to the 50s, my assumption is they will ride even more harsh, although I am confident the Parlee will help dampen the pounding.
Find comfortable tyres/pressures.
The problem is definitely the Skylon - it's an unrelentingly harsh ride from my limited experience riding it. A good rememdy there would be to run tubeless 28s if you dont mind the aero pendalty and the tubless hassle.
BTW I dont rate the WTO s on account of their sluggish rollup - there are better hoops out there.
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- zappafile123
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Can't comment on disc brake wheels cause I dont ride disc. But Zipp 404 FC/NSW, Roval CLX50, Black Inc Eighty, Lightweight Fernweg, Winspace Hyper are some wheels that come to mind which I'd rather ride. The main drawback of the WTO is that they just feel heavy so acceleration and climbing is lacklustre. They are great at everything else.jzinckgra wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 2:06 amWhat are your suggestions for hoops other than campy in the 55-60mm? From what I've read rovals are bad in crosswinds, enve 5.6 are fair. I'm not interested in going with another Chinese rim as I've already done that once and warranty issue was a turn off. What else should I consider? I'm 70kgzappafile123 wrote:I'd agree that most deep wheels are fairly similar in terms of comfort levels, but I do think there is some healthy variance where you really can feel that some wheels are more comfy than others depending on the spokes used and the stiffness of the rim (whilst controlling for tyre choice and pressure). Boras are pretty smooth IMO and I'd say there is no real difference between WTOs and regular Boras.Nickldn wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 6:51 pmIn reality I would expect most deep carbon wheels to feel much the same, with very few outliers. If you find the Bora 50 harsh I doubt you would find the WTO 60 to feel much different.jzinckgra wrote: ↑Tue Sep 28, 2021 4:56 pmCan someone compare the ride quality (harshness) of the Bora 50 vs WTO 60? I've got the 50s on my Time Skylon and take a beating unless the roads are smooth. I'm trying to determine if it's more related to the Skylon frame and/or 50s. I am building up another aero bike (Parlee RZ7) and am considering the WTO 60. Given the deeper profile compared to the 50s, my assumption is they will ride even more harsh, although I am confident the Parlee will help dampen the pounding.
Find comfortable tyres/pressures.
The problem is definitely the Skylon - it's an unrelentingly harsh ride from my limited experience riding it. A good rememdy there would be to run tubeless 28s if you dont mind the aero pendalty and the tubless hassle.
BTW I dont rate the WTO s on account of their sluggish rollup - there are better hoops out there.
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- MrCurrieinahurry
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I've never heard that the wtos don't spin up well. Was potentially looking at a pair due to them also having a quality brake surface.
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Formerly known as Curryinahurry
I now have all three Bora WTOs in the rim brake versions (33, 45 and 60), and that's not my experience at all, whatsoever, in the slightest... I wouldn't have kept buying them otherwise..zappafile123 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:25 amBTW I dont rate the WTO s on account of their sluggish rollup - there are better hoops out there.
Weirdly enough I had the Bora 50 One tubulars (pre-WTO) at one point and did find those a little un-lively / wooden, but then everyone else seems to love them so maybe I just had a weird pair. I love my Bora 35 tubs.
Like all wheels the WTOs have a certain "feel" to them that you notice the first day you first ride them and then become insensitive to. To me the words that came to mind were "planted" and "lively". They feel stiff without feeling wooden. I guess that the "planted" feel comes from the wider rims to some extent but it's not just that because my Reynolds Aeros (pretty much exactly the same internal and external widths) don't feel quite the same (I'm guessing because they aren't quite as stiff).
There's so much subjectivity in the way that wheels feel, and the attributes we attribute to them usually have more to do with the way our brains work (maybe our particular neuromuscular feedback pathways or whatever..) than anything else. The WTOs are light and stiff - why would they be sluggish to rollup? I particularly find that the WTO 60s feel more lively than you would expect from a wheel of that depth.
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Should clarify I have only ridden the 60s. Defintely not saying they are a bad wheel, but the experience I had coming of 404s were that they just felt heavy. Even Caleb Ewan said the same thing when we chatted about them!neeb wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 11:27 amI now have all three Bora WTOs in the rim brake versions (33, 45 and 60), and that's not my experience at all, whatsoever, in the slightest... I wouldn't have kept buying them otherwise..zappafile123 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:25 amBTW I dont rate the WTO s on account of their sluggish rollup - there are better hoops out there.
Weirdly enough I had the Bora 50 One tubulars (pre-WTO) at one point and did find those a little un-lively / wooden, but then everyone else seems to love them so maybe I just had a weird pair. I love my Bora 35 tubs.
Like all wheels the WTOs have a certain "feel" to them that you notice the first day you first ride them and then become insensitive to. To me the words that came to mind were "planted" and "lively". They feel stiff without feeling wooden. I guess that the "planted" feel comes from the wider rims to some extent but it's not just that because my Reynolds Aeros (pretty much exactly the same internal and external widths) don't feel quite the same (I'm guessing because they aren't quite as stiff).
There's so much subjectivity in the way that wheels feel, and the attributes we attribute to them usually have more to do with the way our brains work (maybe our particular neuromuscular feedback pathways or whatever..) than anything else. The WTOs are light and stiff - why would they be sluggish to rollup? I particularly find that the WTO 60s feel more lively than you would expect from a wheel of that depth.
FactorOne|SartoSeta|StorckF.3|Enigma EliteHSS|SworksSL6|ColnagoC60/V3Rs|DeRosa Protos|BianchiXR4/2|BMCSLR01 16|Cdale EvoHM|Focus IzMax|RidleyHe SL/SLX|BH Ulight|BassoDiamante|Scapin DyseysS8|TimeRXRS/ZXRS|TCR SL|RidleyNoah|Look585|CerveloS5/S3
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Which 404s were you riding? What were the tyre setups on each?