My first MTB WW-build is a Ducati ! (almost)
Moderators: MrCurrieinahurry, maxim809, Moderator Team
Grips.
Made in an incredible variety of form and function.
For some almost science.
I like short, firm (not gelly), and "plain" grips, and luckily these are easy to find !
I have tested the Ritchey WCS foam at 44gr. incl caps a pair. -For Me, a bit to soft.
Then I got the KCMC eva foam, they feel very solid, and weighs only 13gr.+5gr.(caps)= 18gr. a pair.
And they look/feel more rubber like (smaller pores in material).
Made in an incredible variety of form and function.
For some almost science.
I like short, firm (not gelly), and "plain" grips, and luckily these are easy to find !
I have tested the Ritchey WCS foam at 44gr. incl caps a pair. -For Me, a bit to soft.
Then I got the KCMC eva foam, they feel very solid, and weighs only 13gr.+5gr.(caps)= 18gr. a pair.
And they look/feel more rubber like (smaller pores in material).
-Will Race for food..
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Tuning of The Red X9 10sp. tp1 med. cage Rear Mech.
The weight of rear mech + shifter w. inner cable (earlier photo) showed 338gr.
The X9 shifter w. in.cable, alone is 128gr. Therefore, rear (w. ti-bolts) was. 210gr.
And, as earlier mentioned, I only know how to tune the rear mech.
I got a German carbon inner cage at 6.2gr.
1x 15mm countersunk M5 ti bolt (upper pulley), 1x 15mm Count.s. M5 hollow alu bolt (lower pulley).
All small limit screws in black M4 alu, and cable-tight. screw w. washer in M5 black alu.
2x Aerozine pulley Wheels ceram. bearings. total weight 11.6gr. a pair
Rear tuned Total 185gr.
-But I will show some small differences that made Me think again.
The Pulley (Jockey) Wheels, have a small diameter (11teeth), and therefore spins the fastest of all Wheels(or bearings if you want), on the hole bike, when pedaled of course !
The rolling-pressure on these bearings are weak (springs in mech. define this force ), but the upper-wheel (Responsible for actually pushing/drawing the chain to a new position "Derailling") brings a lateral force into action.
Please look at size of bearings (in/out-races, and ball size).
The lightest "Aerozine" at 5.8gr a pcs. -Bearing-balls are micro sized !! -Not strong against lateral/angled -forces.
Can only sit as lower Wheel, feeding the "upper" with chain.
I therefore chose the 3gr. heavier, but Full ceramic bearing, AEST for the Upper pulley. -Spins forever in my hands.... at 8.5gr.
-Ending with Rear X9 total weight 189gr.
Racing tip.
Carbon Pulley Wheels looks nice, but the decay can be surprisingly fast (between laps, even).
The weight of rear mech + shifter w. inner cable (earlier photo) showed 338gr.
The X9 shifter w. in.cable, alone is 128gr. Therefore, rear (w. ti-bolts) was. 210gr.
And, as earlier mentioned, I only know how to tune the rear mech.
I got a German carbon inner cage at 6.2gr.
1x 15mm countersunk M5 ti bolt (upper pulley), 1x 15mm Count.s. M5 hollow alu bolt (lower pulley).
All small limit screws in black M4 alu, and cable-tight. screw w. washer in M5 black alu.
2x Aerozine pulley Wheels ceram. bearings. total weight 11.6gr. a pair
Rear tuned Total 185gr.
-But I will show some small differences that made Me think again.
The Pulley (Jockey) Wheels, have a small diameter (11teeth), and therefore spins the fastest of all Wheels(or bearings if you want), on the hole bike, when pedaled of course !
The rolling-pressure on these bearings are weak (springs in mech. define this force ), but the upper-wheel (Responsible for actually pushing/drawing the chain to a new position "Derailling") brings a lateral force into action.
Please look at size of bearings (in/out-races, and ball size).
The lightest "Aerozine" at 5.8gr a pcs. -Bearing-balls are micro sized !! -Not strong against lateral/angled -forces.
Can only sit as lower Wheel, feeding the "upper" with chain.
I therefore chose the 3gr. heavier, but Full ceramic bearing, AEST for the Upper pulley. -Spins forever in my hands.... at 8.5gr.
-Ending with Rear X9 total weight 189gr.
Racing tip.
Carbon Pulley Wheels looks nice, but the decay can be surprisingly fast (between laps, even).
-Will Race for food..
Cutting carbon fibres, is a delicate matter !
Never cut into a structural entity. -The calculated strenght will become unknown (lower) !
Bars in carbon (and non-), reacts the opposite way !! Beacuse the ends are not closed.
If shortend, a tube will always be harder to bend/break !
My WCS bars (585mm) are to wide for My riding style.
56cm is much better! (on all My bikes, for ages.)
-Measure, and mark the lines.
-Tape the area's (transperant tape).
-Hacksaw, fine teeth, slowly, checking the line.
-Very fine sanding paper (500-1000), rounding the inner and outer edges.
Now, a perfect fit, and 9 grams lighter ! (-not much, but I'll take it.) -And stronger too !!
Ritchey 560mm WCS carbon 31,8dia. Real weigth 127gr.
Note, the aluminum seen in the cut-offs are the bar-end reinforcements, still 1cm left in bars. (I never use these "Bull-horns", -gives Me a locked feeling of hand pos.)
Never cut into a structural entity. -The calculated strenght will become unknown (lower) !
Bars in carbon (and non-), reacts the opposite way !! Beacuse the ends are not closed.
If shortend, a tube will always be harder to bend/break !
My WCS bars (585mm) are to wide for My riding style.
56cm is much better! (on all My bikes, for ages.)
-Measure, and mark the lines.
-Tape the area's (transperant tape).
-Hacksaw, fine teeth, slowly, checking the line.
-Very fine sanding paper (500-1000), rounding the inner and outer edges.
Now, a perfect fit, and 9 grams lighter ! (-not much, but I'll take it.) -And stronger too !!
Ritchey 560mm WCS carbon 31,8dia. Real weigth 127gr.
Note, the aluminum seen in the cut-offs are the bar-end reinforcements, still 1cm left in bars. (I never use these "Bull-horns", -gives Me a locked feeling of hand pos.)
-Will Race for food..
- A Little break, -now back in the workshop, -build must go on.
I only have a few more components to show.
Pedals.
As on a Racing-MC, I don't use clamps. In city-traffic, feet leaves pedals a lot !
Big spikey platform-pedals, are nice in the rough nature. (Dirt, mud, leaves and so.)
I like small simple pedals.
I have tuned these, -already light, Xpedo Trekking XCF03AC pedals.
(Claimed 210gr) - Real weight 203gr. a pair.
They come with CrMo spindles 104gr a pair
-And ends with titanium spindles 63gr a pair.
Total weight now : 160gr. a pair.
I now only need the cranks, but I'm still waiting for some bits, -and so, it must be !
Cranking, is the transformation of Up/Down movement to spinning axles.
We tread hard, -Ducati uses exploding gasoline.
I only have a few more components to show.
Pedals.
As on a Racing-MC, I don't use clamps. In city-traffic, feet leaves pedals a lot !
Big spikey platform-pedals, are nice in the rough nature. (Dirt, mud, leaves and so.)
I like small simple pedals.
I have tuned these, -already light, Xpedo Trekking XCF03AC pedals.
(Claimed 210gr) - Real weight 203gr. a pair.
They come with CrMo spindles 104gr a pair
-And ends with titanium spindles 63gr a pair.
Total weight now : 160gr. a pair.
I now only need the cranks, but I'm still waiting for some bits, -and so, it must be !
Cranking, is the transformation of Up/Down movement to spinning axles.
We tread hard, -Ducati uses exploding gasoline.
-Will Race for food..
Tuning the Thomson seatpost, is so easy !
Buy the ti-bolt set, and the CNC'ed alu Yokes... Boom, from 190gr. to : Weight 158gr. ! Wow... or is it ?
The original Thomson bolt set, and the different ti-types, are all attached to a barrel Nut. The bolt heads are rounded (more or less), and contacts a concave washer.
This, gives the bolt axle two pivot-points, to freely angle into the least stressing position.
Tuned with Yokes, the barrel nut is gone ! The bolt enters the yoke in a 90' angle, and when tightened, the yoke will be pulled towards bolt, and not parallel to the SEAT RAIL !!
Look at example, here with Titanium rails (Will not dammage My carb rails)
Notice the front yoke, Not parallel with rail.
Maybe this yoke setup will work. It can also be filed to fit, in locked seat positions, but then only for metal rails ?
I will go back to the Ball titanium bolt w. barrel nut and concave washer, and this big "railplate" from Thomson !
Remember to file a little and sanding the edges of Thomson rail clamps ! they are nice, but can get nicer.
Final Weight for Thomson Masterpiece 350mm, 30.9 w. ti bolt set 181gr.
Buy the ti-bolt set, and the CNC'ed alu Yokes... Boom, from 190gr. to : Weight 158gr. ! Wow... or is it ?
The original Thomson bolt set, and the different ti-types, are all attached to a barrel Nut. The bolt heads are rounded (more or less), and contacts a concave washer.
This, gives the bolt axle two pivot-points, to freely angle into the least stressing position.
Tuned with Yokes, the barrel nut is gone ! The bolt enters the yoke in a 90' angle, and when tightened, the yoke will be pulled towards bolt, and not parallel to the SEAT RAIL !!
Look at example, here with Titanium rails (Will not dammage My carb rails)
Notice the front yoke, Not parallel with rail.
Maybe this yoke setup will work. It can also be filed to fit, in locked seat positions, but then only for metal rails ?
I will go back to the Ball titanium bolt w. barrel nut and concave washer, and this big "railplate" from Thomson !
Remember to file a little and sanding the edges of Thomson rail clamps ! they are nice, but can get nicer.
Final Weight for Thomson Masterpiece 350mm, 30.9 w. ti bolt set 181gr.
-Will Race for food..
- Frankie - B
- Admin - In the industry
- Posts: 6573
- Joined: Mon Jun 02, 2003 8:17 am
- Location: Drenthe, Holland
Wow, super detailed posts, keep up the good work!
If you want to see 'meh' content of me and my bike you can follow my life in pictures here!'Tape was made to wrap your GF's gifts, NOT hold a freakin tire on.'
-Thank You Frankie, -I will.
I actually was a little concerned, if it was too detailed.
I have been Building long-lasting (10-14 kgs) bikes for close friends,and colleagues, for years.
All the bikes have Rim-brake Maguras, and often fitted w. mud-guards.
Very strong bikes ! -Like these :
-We always joke about "what part will fail first ?"- when delivered. - It's hard to guess, and I never guess right, because I choose the parts, Convinced they will "NEVER" fail.
-And they really don't ! When something fails, It's because of wrong use, wrong spare-parts, not serviced, or when We force two(or more) components to Work together -and they complain from start.. !
Same thoughts are in My head with this Light build... It Must Be Very Strong n Safe ! ..(And vey light).
-Sun is shining here, forecast says 25deg. cels. the next days !! Please mr. Postman bring Me my Packets, so I can finish the bike.
I actually was a little concerned, if it was too detailed.
I have been Building long-lasting (10-14 kgs) bikes for close friends,and colleagues, for years.
All the bikes have Rim-brake Maguras, and often fitted w. mud-guards.
Very strong bikes ! -Like these :
-We always joke about "what part will fail first ?"- when delivered. - It's hard to guess, and I never guess right, because I choose the parts, Convinced they will "NEVER" fail.
-And they really don't ! When something fails, It's because of wrong use, wrong spare-parts, not serviced, or when We force two(or more) components to Work together -and they complain from start.. !
Same thoughts are in My head with this Light build... It Must Be Very Strong n Safe ! ..(And vey light).
-Sun is shining here, forecast says 25deg. cels. the next days !! Please mr. Postman bring Me my Packets, so I can finish the bike.
-Will Race for food..
Two more (lighter) City-racers, no mud-guards, sat up by Me.
My good friend "Lundse", a former oval wood-track racer (indoor teams, hour-record-attemps..), rides this lovely Specialized MTB, but as Me, He wanted it more Race... Rebuild with : Slicks, -Modern 10sp. and one of My minty SID's (California thank You Again). Now sub 10kg. He feels 10 years younger after this new setup, He told Me ! (Btw. He always uses Shimano clip in (XT M785 Trail) ..-weirdo .) Please notice the clamp w. bolt. -Chain Keeping device, will not jump off, on bumpy roads/steps.
-And this Little carbon-monster "Sleipner" (Odins eightlegged horse. -Nordic myth.) 10sp. Sub 9kg.(easy with this frame, and DT-Swiss/PACE Carbon forks) .
-Sorry, but I had to show some "Heavy" bikes, just to set things in perspective !
Soon more from Ducati-build.
-hmmm .. the pics went a little crazy...hard to edit correct.
My good friend "Lundse", a former oval wood-track racer (indoor teams, hour-record-attemps..), rides this lovely Specialized MTB, but as Me, He wanted it more Race... Rebuild with : Slicks, -Modern 10sp. and one of My minty SID's (California thank You Again). Now sub 10kg. He feels 10 years younger after this new setup, He told Me ! (Btw. He always uses Shimano clip in (XT M785 Trail) ..-weirdo .) Please notice the clamp w. bolt. -Chain Keeping device, will not jump off, on bumpy roads/steps.
-And this Little carbon-monster "Sleipner" (Odins eightlegged horse. -Nordic myth.) 10sp. Sub 9kg.(easy with this frame, and DT-Swiss/PACE Carbon forks) .
-Sorry, but I had to show some "Heavy" bikes, just to set things in perspective !
Soon more from Ducati-build.
-hmmm .. the pics went a little crazy...hard to edit correct.
-Will Race for food..
---Wow !
I would like that, in My garage..
Very fine. -Forks (V-bosses too), could be Cannondale ?
Low angled head-tube, and the tubular MC-frame-Construction...
Slicks of course, and no front mech... Must be someting different (fun) to ride..
-Any explanation of origin/use ?
Thank You for new inspiration. (I'll save this pic. in My Bike Photo Collection.)
I would like that, in My garage..
Very fine. -Forks (V-bosses too), could be Cannondale ?
Low angled head-tube, and the tubular MC-frame-Construction...
Slicks of course, and no front mech... Must be someting different (fun) to ride..
-Any explanation of origin/use ?
Thank You for new inspiration. (I'll save this pic. in My Bike Photo Collection.)
-Will Race for food..
Ok, I did some research, on this amazing frame.
Peter Laibacher ! -A German Custom Builder. "Pelagro" is the Brand.
One of a kind, Unique builds, True collectors Items.
Here some other Unika's from Peter :
Nice, but maybe too nice to use daily ? ( -still, I'll take one for free, Anytime !)
Peter Laibacher ! -A German Custom Builder. "Pelagro" is the Brand.
One of a kind, Unique builds, True collectors Items.
Here some other Unika's from Peter :
Nice, but maybe too nice to use daily ? ( -still, I'll take one for free, Anytime !)
-Will Race for food..
-Thanks 7ducati.
No I don't own a Real Ducati, But could I choose One free MC, -then it would be a Ducati !
I only try to get the Racing-spirits built into My bike. By using components, that Ducati would choose, if they were just as serious about Bicycles..
Diamond Like Coating (DLC)-
DLC coated parts are the right solution for lubricant-free operations !
These coatings even accommodate the smaller size and lower weight demands of the Racing and automotive industries.
-High wear resistance.
-Low coefficient of friction.
-Corrosion resistance.
-Even two coated surfaces operating against each other, provide optimal performance and reliability.
...-In Jet-engines ?..!! -I Need this, so bad !
-So I got this from My favourite Chain Producer KMC.
I have not cut it yet, so weight later. I think some grams heavier, but let's see. (The colours, and theSuper Smooth surface, can make Me forget the few extra grams !)
No I don't own a Real Ducati, But could I choose One free MC, -then it would be a Ducati !
I only try to get the Racing-spirits built into My bike. By using components, that Ducati would choose, if they were just as serious about Bicycles..
Diamond Like Coating (DLC)-
DLC coated parts are the right solution for lubricant-free operations !
These coatings even accommodate the smaller size and lower weight demands of the Racing and automotive industries.
-High wear resistance.
-Low coefficient of friction.
-Corrosion resistance.
-Even two coated surfaces operating against each other, provide optimal performance and reliability.
...-In Jet-engines ?..!! -I Need this, so bad !
-So I got this from My favourite Chain Producer KMC.
I have not cut it yet, so weight later. I think some grams heavier, but let's see. (The colours, and theSuper Smooth surface, can make Me forget the few extra grams !)
-Will Race for food..
Choosing the right bolt-material, and the art of tightening.
Suprisingly many high-end (not ultra top-end) -brands, use steel bolts as standard, in their components !
-Sometimes because the strenght is needed (calculated or tested) !
-Or because of final Price of product.
Here, the four materials I always use :
-Stainless Steel weight 7.80 gr/cm3 (Derailleur hanger attachment, and Places I can't reach)
-Titanium 4.51 gr/cm3 (Strenght Needed)
-Aluminium 2.70 gr/cm3 (Strenght Wanted)
-Nylon 1.14 gr/cm3 (bottle cages and bell)
Carbon Bolts are intriguing. Carbon weighing 3.51 gr/cm3. Bolts also contain resin, -so, a lower gr/cm3.
Threads are carbon fibres, hard packed in circular arrangement, to obtain strenght... Very complicated, and frequently discussed.
And still -expensive, -discussed durability, and only available in special heads.
Not for Me, -Yet.
<< 5 Nm !!! Important Tighten to 40 Nm... max 2.5Nm ???
We all know this wrench, -and its a fine Tool !
It stops wrenching, when a certain torque (Nm) is reached.
In other Words, -When (eg. 6Nm) is reached, the job is done !..... But is the bolt applying force to the part-assembling, Or is there a great resistance(friction) in the threading ??
Like : -Corrosion, -Wear, -Fabrication precision, -Different materials contact, -Performance lubrication, -Thread lock glue.. Please find more factors, that make this precision Tool, a guide-line for how much 5Nm is, in Your hands, -and 15, -and the 40Nm required for cassette lockring.
The Torque Wrench, is calibrated with Standard Internationale Specified Bolts and nuts... We never see/use these Reference screws !
But We are humans, and so We learn of our experiences.. A trained mechanic, can tighten bolts very close to specs. of Part, and NOT to specs. of BOLT.. Hope it makes sense ?
Always check if parts are in correct contact after assembling..- Don't trust The Torque Wrench ! (But it's good to learn from)
Suprisingly many high-end (not ultra top-end) -brands, use steel bolts as standard, in their components !
-Sometimes because the strenght is needed (calculated or tested) !
-Or because of final Price of product.
Here, the four materials I always use :
-Stainless Steel weight 7.80 gr/cm3 (Derailleur hanger attachment, and Places I can't reach)
-Titanium 4.51 gr/cm3 (Strenght Needed)
-Aluminium 2.70 gr/cm3 (Strenght Wanted)
-Nylon 1.14 gr/cm3 (bottle cages and bell)
Carbon Bolts are intriguing. Carbon weighing 3.51 gr/cm3. Bolts also contain resin, -so, a lower gr/cm3.
Threads are carbon fibres, hard packed in circular arrangement, to obtain strenght... Very complicated, and frequently discussed.
And still -expensive, -discussed durability, and only available in special heads.
Not for Me, -Yet.
<< 5 Nm !!! Important Tighten to 40 Nm... max 2.5Nm ???
We all know this wrench, -and its a fine Tool !
It stops wrenching, when a certain torque (Nm) is reached.
In other Words, -When (eg. 6Nm) is reached, the job is done !..... But is the bolt applying force to the part-assembling, Or is there a great resistance(friction) in the threading ??
Like : -Corrosion, -Wear, -Fabrication precision, -Different materials contact, -Performance lubrication, -Thread lock glue.. Please find more factors, that make this precision Tool, a guide-line for how much 5Nm is, in Your hands, -and 15, -and the 40Nm required for cassette lockring.
The Torque Wrench, is calibrated with Standard Internationale Specified Bolts and nuts... We never see/use these Reference screws !
But We are humans, and so We learn of our experiences.. A trained mechanic, can tighten bolts very close to specs. of Part, and NOT to specs. of BOLT.. Hope it makes sense ?
Always check if parts are in correct contact after assembling..- Don't trust The Torque Wrench ! (But it's good to learn from)
-Will Race for food..
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