New Open Pro for 2012?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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euan
Posts: 1493
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:20 am

by euan

Yeah Mavic has or is losing the rim only market. I'm not sure they are interested in staying in it really. Far more agile companies have arrived responding to market trends. Things like coloured and deep rims, and now wide rims. In the last four or five years Mavic has missed the boat completely.
"Step forward the climber and all those who worship at the altar of lightness" - R. Millar

petromyzon
Posts: 260
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2010 4:14 pm

by petromyzon

I wonder if it is a business decision or just limited R+D time? Opinions on Mavic wheels vary but in a lot of areas, particularly aerodynamics, they are a way behind the cutting edge. They seem to take a long while to bring stuff to market - that new wide carbon tub wheel, the M40 or whatever, seems to have been waiting in the wings for ages.

In terms of money Stan's seems to take simple but useful ideas, build very light rims and sell them for markedly more than an Open Pro would cost. I doubt the market for people who like to spec or spec and build their own wheels is that price-sensitive.

Anyway, my wishlist would be

23 mm at the brake track
low profile for comfort
light (sub 400g) even if it is a bit bendy, with plenty of spokes and decent hubs you can still build a stiff training wheel
stubby bead socket like stans so you get more volume from any given rubber
Exalith treatment
All black, easily removed decals

I'd pay double Open Pro retail for that.....

by Weenie


billspreston
Posts: 367
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:40 pm
Location: CA

by billspreston

HED recently stopped selling their popular hole count C2 rims to builders. There is a $$$$ reason why manufacturers are keeping their popular rims off the market. In HEDs case I think it's a bad business move as they will sell way fewer C2 wheelsets than they would rims.

jooo
Posts: 1510
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 3:48 am

by jooo

@billspreston - where did you hear this Re: C2 rims? Lots of places are still stocking all the drillings, surely that's not just back stock they're trying to get rid of?

andyindo
Posts: 395
Joined: Tue May 12, 2009 10:03 am

by andyindo

euan wrote:Yeah Mavic has or is losing the rim only market. I'm not sure they are interested in staying in it really. Far more agile companies have arrived responding to market trends. Things like coloured and deep rims, and now wide rims. In the last four or five years Mavic has missed the boat completely.

Maybe its just me, but Mavic seem to be losing direction. They dont innovate. They dont offer attractive price points, they are slow to react to market demands, their rims arent THAT great anymore and nor are their hubs. People will still buy Mavic and heck I would too if they werent so expensive, but for example the cosmic carbone slr is one heck of an expensive and unaerodynamic wheel. The ksyrium while stiff, is worse than a 32spoke regular wheel. In pure performance terms, mavic are crap.
What new rims have Mavic developed in the last 10 years? Dont hold your breath for an exalith treatment rim......

ticou
Posts: 459
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 3:31 pm

by ticou

Have to agree on the mavic bearings; Exalith was a good idea. I feel their market is the gentleman rouleur. Back in the day OP was the go to rim, and it is sad they havn't given it at least 1 or 2 genuine facelifts over the last 25 years. Up to last week when my rear Elite showed a crack, I thought they were unmatched in durability; my 07 aksium is still going strong. So excellent starter wheels at least, and they are supporting the ceramic bearing crowd as well, albeit it extremely indirectly.

Is the Stans Alpha as durable as the OP?; if so, i could switch over.

petromyzon
Posts: 260
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2010 4:14 pm

by petromyzon

@ticou Durable is not usually an adjective people apply to stan's rims. They are a clear 80g lighter than O-pro. Plenty of people on here seem to use them without trouble, but everything is relative....

geraintevans
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:46 am

by geraintevans

jooo wrote:@billspreston - where did you hear this Re: C2 rims? Lots of places are still stocking all the drillings, surely that's not just back stock they're trying to get rid of?

32H are not available from Ciclismo in the UK, I've just had an exchange of email with them confirming this. You can still buy 18/20/24/28 from them at £109 per rim.

I've just offered them my opinion on the bare rims vs pre-built wheels issue, doubt it'll make any difference but I felt the need to say something :evil:



[Noob saying 'hi' btw :waving: ]

rruff
Shop Owner
Posts: 2194
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2006 9:12 am
Location: Alto, NM

by rruff

billspreston wrote:HED recently stopped selling their popular hole count C2 rims to builders. There is a $$$$ reason why manufacturers are keeping their popular rims off the market. In HEDs case I think it's a bad business move as they will sell way fewer C2 wheelsets than they would rims.


Nah... they know what they are doing. I was selling C2 custom wheels with clearly better hubs for less than the Hed wheels cost. Even though they charge a lot of $$ for the rims their profit margin on those is what... maybe 10-20% as high as what they make on the wheelsets? So eliminating that direct competition pays off if they can swing 1 out of 5 or 10 customers wanting a C2 custom to their own wheels. Zipp has done the same with their Firecrest rims... can't get them at all. Hed has never sold their carbon rims for customs... at least they are still selling the C2s in 24-32 holecounts (in the US anyway).

ticou
Posts: 459
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 3:31 pm

by ticou

petromyzon wrote:@ticou Durable is not usually an adjective people apply to stan's rims. They are a clear 80g lighter than O-pro. Plenty of people on here seem to use them without trouble, but everything is relative....


Alas yes, it is! They are worth a thought though, I could rotate them with my new rear Elite. But I guess op's it'll have to be- we have plenty of niche wheelbuilders in blighty who continue to use 'em, and I guess with our road conditions we will be Mavic's main market for op style rims if were not already- they really have a stranglehold, and perhaps, just perhaps, I over tightened my spokes while truing, simply by tightening them!

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