Cannondale SuperSix Evo4

[LanceLegstrong]

New 2025 EF team edition.
After last year kind of meh


https://efprocycling.com/culture/our-20 ... e-gallery/

If you’re the right size you can pick up last year’s bike with Dura-Ace for $4500. It’s used but that’s a pretty killer price.

I actually really like this year’s paint. Not as wild as last years for sure but it looks really nice.

[RDY]

Yes

is it possible to confirm ????

They won't ride Lab71 layup ever. Doubtful if they're even on stock hi-mods.

The difference between retailed HM and EF pro HM of 2023-2024 is the glued-in long alu expandar, to increase the stiffness of the delta steerer. Other part of the frame should be stiff enough for the pro.

The stiffness test protocal in the factory is different from Tour magzine: they test frame and fork leg independent of the steerer, resulting in the same stiffness level vs gen 3. So combining the factory results and Tour results, you can know how much influence is the delta steerer to the overall system stiffness.

I knew about the glued in expanders. I didn't know if they were still a thing or if it was just being reinforced now.

Is there a back channel through which to obtain the glue-in expanders?

[cobc11]

Yes

is it possible to confirm ????

They won't ride Lab71 layup ever. Doubtful if they're even on stock hi-mods.

The difference between retailed HM and EF pro HM of 2023-2024 is the glued-in long alu expandar, to increase the stiffness of the delta steerer. Other part of the frame should be stiff enough for the pro.

This is incorrect. It has nothing to do with stiffness.

The bonded in expander was an idea to simplify the system by not using a multi piece expander. It was ultimately abondoned becuase it requires frame size specific forks that lined the compression plug up wit the exposed steertube on each headtube length. Early 2023 supply to teams were produced with the bonded plug before the concept was swapped for a traditional plug.

I rode for a domestic team that got the bonded in plug for our first delivery, then standard forks for the 2nd.

On a related note, We asked about getting Lab71 frames and were basically told there was not enough supply of the fancy carbon to give the pro teams the bikes and still have frames to sell the public.

[alanyu]

I knew about the glued in expanders. I didn't know if they were still a thing or if it was just being reinforced now.

Is there a back channel through which to obtain the glue-in expanders?

I don't know if EF pro cycling shop (they sell retired bikes there) can sell you the expander if you email them.

This is incorrect. It has nothing to do with stiffness.

The bonded in expander was an idea to simplify the system by not using a multi piece expander. It was ultimately abondoned becuase it requires frame size specific forks that lined the compression plug up wit the exposed steertube on each headtube length. Early 2023 supply to teams were produced with the bonded plug before the concept was swapped for a traditional plug.

I rode for a domestic team that got the bonded in plug for our first delivery, then standard forks for the 2nd.

On a related note, We asked about getting Lab71 frames and were basically told there was not enough supply of the fancy carbon to give the pro teams the bikes and still have frames to sell the public.

May or may not be their initial target, but several factory tests show higher stiffness of the steerer with the long solid expander, doesn't need to to be delta steerer.

[johnpuga1982]

I wonder why? Is the Vision cockpit so bad? Heavy? Faulty? Hard to maintain?
I am asking as I'm about to buy one (5d ACR)

It could also be that the Momo bar is narrower. I was looking at the Vision bars in June/July 2023 and they only came in 40cm width.

[sageorguk]

is it possible to confirm ????

They won't ride Lab71 layup ever. Doubtful if they're even on stock hi-mods.

The difference between retailed HM and EF pro HM of 2023-2024 is the glued-in long alu expandar, to increase the stiffness of the delta steerer. Other part of the frame should be stiff enough for the pro.

The stiffness test protocal in the factory is different from Tour magzine: they test frame and fork leg independent of the steerer, resulting in the same stiffness level vs gen 3. So combining the factory results and Tour results, you can know how much influence is the delta steerer to the overall system stiffness.

I knew about the glued in expanders. I didn't know if they were still a thing or if it was just being reinforced now.

Is there a back channel through which to obtain the glue-in expanders?

I am attempting to reverse engineer a glue-in expander. I have a cnc shop making a prototype at the moment. Once I am sure I have the measurements accurate I will happily share the CAD file I created.

For me the stiffness gain is a side benefit. I am attempting to add around 20mm back onto a cut steerer. A good idea? A bonded insert plus a carbon repair should do the job. The lower stem bolt is clamping below the join and 2 filler pieces also span across the join. Stronger than original or flaky?

[mr.wulf]

New Tour Test available for the Supersix Lab71

https://www.tour-magazin.de/rennrae...r ... d-im-test/

Size 56 with Momo Cockpit and Reserve 42/49 wheels / Vittoria Corsa 29c tires tested with 210w




Older Tour Test of SuperSix Highmod size 56 with two piece bar/stem combo was 207w with Hollowgram 50 wheels and Conti 25c tires.

https://www.tour-magazin.de/rennraeder/ ... tour-test/

[pmprego]

New Tour Test available for the Supersix Lab71

https://www.tour-magazin.de/rennrae...r ... d-im-test/

Size 56 with Momo Cockpit and Reserve 42/49 wheels / Vittoria Corsa 29c tires tested with 210w




Older Tour Test of SuperSix Highmod size 56 with two piece bar/stem combo was 207w with Hollowgram 50 wheels and Conti 25c tires.

https://www.tour-magazin.de/rennraeder/ ... tour-test/

is the supersix now being sold with the reserve 42/49 as the stock version (instead of the hollowgram)? That would make my interest in it increase.

Edited: I went to their websire to check and it seems to be the case. Reserve all around now. Nice

[tyoac]

I don't know where exactly you checked but it's only this one specific version that comes with SRAM E1 and the Reserve wheels, the rest of still on the Hollowgrams.

Still interesting that it tested worse in the end though.

[js]

Was it confirmed anywhere if these latest Tour numbers were with Cannondale's flat-sided bottles?

If not, that may be a big part of the difference (not just the wheels) as my memory is that they tested with the flat-sided bottles last time, which were claimed to offer a few watts of advantage.

[alanyu]

Was it confirmed anywhere if these latest Tour numbers were with Cannondale's flat-sided bottles?

If not, that may be a big part of the difference (not just the wheels) as my memory is that they tested with the flat-sided bottles last time, which were claimed to offer a few watts of advantage.

Tour protocal is 1*750 ml round bottle on DT from very early time to now.

[alanyu]

Lab71 is slower than HM tested in 2023, mostly due to wheel+tyre change, even Lab71 is equiped with mono cockpit while HM was not.

Lab71 reserve 42/49 + Corsa Pro 29c
HM Hollowgram 50 R-SL + GP5K 25c

4mm wider is roughly 2-3W. Wheel is shallower/slower, and Corsa Pro performs bad at mid to high yaw, while GP5K performed top in wind tunnel (together with Pro One) before "aero" tyres came out.

[js]

According to subscribers here, they tested with two aero bottles if the brand markets them, otherwise two round bottles (I assume 600 ml "normal ones" used in race)

Trek claims 1.8 Watts saving @ 35 kmh or 3.8 Watts saving @ 45 kmh, while Cannodale claims 2-3 Watts saving @ 45 kmh. These are resonable numbers which I trust, and according to some internal CFD material of other brand, savings even can be 5-8 Watts when they only desgin the bottle for aero w/o considering the easy handling.

I was pretty sure it was mentioned in the Tour Aero Bike Test thread that they measured with the bottles - viewtopic.php?t=154692&start=2490. I hope you're also able to find it a bit funny that you're the one who posted that. Glad this extra post made me look it up though, as you had the claimed advantages too.

Now we just need to know if they maintained that protocol for this latest test.

[alanyu]

According to subscribers here, they tested with two aero bottles if the brand markets them, otherwise two round bottles (I assume 600 ml "normal ones" used in race)

Trek claims 1.8 Watts saving @ 35 kmh or 3.8 Watts saving @ 45 kmh, while Cannodale claims 2-3 Watts saving @ 45 kmh. These are resonable numbers which I trust, and according to some internal CFD material of other brand, savings even can be 5-8 Watts when they only desgin the bottle for aero w/o considering the easy handling.

I was pretty sure it was mentioned in the Tour Aero Bike Test thread that they measured with the bottles - viewtopic.php?t=154692&start=2490. I hope you're also able to find it a bit funny that you're the one who posted that. Glad this extra post made me look it up though, as you had the claimed advantages too.

Now we just need to know if they maintained that protocol for this latest test.

Can you read fully???????

_____________________________

According to subscribers here, they tested with two aero bottles if the brand markets them, otherwise two round bottles (I assume 600 ml "normal ones" used in race)

Trek claims 1.8 Watts saving @ 35 kmh or 3.8 Watts saving @ 45 kmh, while Cannodale claims 2-3 Watts saving @ 45 kmh. These are resonable numbers which I trust, and according to some internal CFD material of other brand, savings even can be 5-8 Watts when they only desgin the bottle for aero w/o considering the easy handling.

Re aerocoach results: that's the TT design or old aero DT design, whose shape is very narrow and truncated little. A normal round bottle on the tail basically destroyed the flow. Modern design aero DT is not that narrow, for the balance of weight/aero/stiffness, and some also consider the fairing for round bottles (e.g. Pina)

Re Tour, tour put a single 750 ml round bottle on DT for all wind tunnel test, and you won't get a 8-11 Watts plenaty by two 600 ml or even two 750 ml bottles.

____________________________________

[mike]

anyone installed campagnolo eps on the supersix? if so, where did you put battery?