Are We Getting A New Cannondale Supersix?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
S6ED
Posts: 204
Joined: Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:22 pm

by S6ED

Thanks DG for posting the manual page. Aero makes one's life complicated.

by Weenie


Macallan
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:21 pm

by Macallan

Thanks for your comments, Dan. I had the same thoughts as you, probably not properly installed from factory since the surfaces have to be VERY clean for the tape to hold permanently. But probably an easy fix. Will contact the dealer, he might have to order a spare tape and/or nut from Cannondale.

Had done a lot of greasing / carbon paste as per instructions, but the creaking remained so I think it must be the loose nut. Will report back after it is fixed.

hernejj
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:27 pm

by hernejj

I've having a hard time figuring out how people are getting to <= 17 pound weights with the new Supersix Evo. Here is a chart, On the left is what I belive the stock 105 build to be (with my own pedals/cages/etc). The right is my currently planned build starting from the 105 frame. If anyone can see where I can significantly reduce weight or knows of any inaccuracies please let me know. All component weights are in grams, the final build weights are presented in grams and pounds.

In case image doesn't load inline: https://postimg.cc/1nrx7Fk9
Image

refthimos
Posts: 340
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 6:02 pm

by refthimos

Easiest / cheapest way to save weight would be to go tubeless and lose the butyl tunes. You could also lose a pound with lighter wheels. But not cheap. Hi-Mod frameset, DA rather than Ultegra, SISL2 cranks and a spider PM (SRM or P2Max) anf lighter pedals would all result in weight savings. I'm expecting mine in 56cm to be well under 15 lbs.
EVO1 | 5.37kg
EVO3 | 6.51kg
SystemSix | 8.01kg
P5 | 9070 Di2 | SISL2 SRM | Enve 7.8/FFWD Falcon | Roval 321
T1 | P2Max Type S | Rolf Prima FX58/Zipp Super 9 Disc

bibirider8
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:28 pm

by bibirider8

Mine is finally here! 7,27kg as on the photo.
He's upgraded with Hollowgram sisl2 and spidering 53/39, saddle is an old speedneele without leaser, tire Continental GP 4000 25/700, tube Conti Supersonic, disc alligator starlite. Pedal Dura Ace.
I'm waiting for Ultegra Di2 groupset, Dura Ace cassette, and lighter handlebar
Wheels are heavy with 1600gr but no money for change theme!
Attachments
IMG_20191011_223509.jpg

Jackofallgrades
Posts: 59
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:15 am

by Jackofallgrades

Hi all, first time poster, super info so far... apologies if this info has been stated already but I have tried sifting through the previous 90 pages without finding anything!

Does anybody know the actual weight of the crankset on the higher models with the NGeco PM built in? I know the weight of the PM is around 170g, but struggling to find numbers on the FSA rings and cranks, and the website seems a tad vague... On some models it lists the chainrings as Vision but pretty sure they're still FSA from pics, and Vision don't seem to make them. Typo? It just lists the cranks as "Hollowgram" on some, while on the highest models they have SISL2. Do we think they mean Hollowgram SI on those mid-tier models?

Secondly, I noticed the highest models have what they call KNOT 45 SL wheelsets, as opposed to slightly lower models which have KNOT 45 wheelsets. They use DT Swiss Aerolite spokes as opposed to Formula Grand Forza ones. Any idea on weight difference there? Haven't been able to find specs for the Grand Forza spokes.
Cannondale SSEvo3 'Agaaaaaaaavé' - 7.6kg
...Work in Progress viewtopic.php?f=10&t=161634

S6ED
Posts: 204
Joined: Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:22 pm

by S6ED

bibirider8 wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:32 am
Mine is finally here! 7,27kg as on the photo.
He's upgraded with Hollowgram sisl2 and spidering 53/39, saddle is an old speedneele without leaser, tire Continental GP 4000 25/700, tube Conti Supersonic, disc alligator starlite. Pedal Dura Ace.
I'm waiting for Ultegra Di2 groupset, Dura Ace cassette, and lighter handlebar
Wheels are heavy with 1600gr but no money for change theme!
Nice! Could you also post some close-ups?

bibirider8
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:28 pm

by bibirider8

S6ED wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:25 am
bibirider8 wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:32 am
Mine is finally here! 7,27kg as on the photo.
He's upgraded with Hollowgram sisl2 and spidering 53/39, saddle is an old speedneele without leaser, tire Continental GP 4000 25/700, tube Conti Supersonic, disc alligator starlite. Pedal Dura Ace.
I'm waiting for Ultegra Di2 groupset, Dura Ace cassette, and lighter handlebar
Wheels are heavy with 1600gr but no money for change theme!
Nice! Could you also post some close-ups?
Yes, I will do that when the building is final

User avatar
Dan Gerous
Posts: 1578
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:28 pm

by Dan Gerous

Jackofallgrades wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:00 am
Hi all, first time poster, super info so far... apologies if this info has been stated already but I have tried sifting through the previous 90 pages without finding anything!

Does anybody know the actual weight of the crankset on the higher models with the NGeco PM built in? I know the weight of the PM is around 170g, but struggling to find numbers on the FSA rings and cranks, and the website seems a tad vague... On some models it lists the chainrings as Vision but pretty sure they're still FSA from pics, and Vision don't seem to make them. Typo? It just lists the cranks as "Hollowgram" on some, while on the highest models they have SISL2. Do we think they mean Hollowgram SI on those mid-tier models?

Secondly, I noticed the highest models have what they call KNOT 45 SL wheelsets, as opposed to slightly lower models which have KNOT 45 wheelsets. They use DT Swiss Aerolite spokes as opposed to Formula Grand Forza ones. Any idea on weight difference there? Haven't been able to find specs for the Grand Forza spokes.
Can't help you about the NGeco weight but yes, as far as I can tell, the 'Hollowgram' cranks are the same as the Hollowgram SI of the past few years (the 3D forged SI ones) with a simplified name and updated graphics, so a tad heavier than the SISL2 but not boat anchors as the non-Hollowgram entry-level cranksets on lower end builds, the 'Cannondale 1'. FSA vs Vision chainrings, shouldn't change much it's the same company.

I'm not sure but I think both the KNØT 45 and KNØT 45 SL use the same rims and hubs, but lighter, more expensive spokes on the SL... The good thing is they both use DT internals for the rear hubs unlike the Hollowgram 35 wheels that are just rebranded Hollowgram SI wheels of previous models. These use Formula made hubs I think and it's probably the biggest weakness across all Cannondale bikes, period. I had some Hollowgram SI for rim brakes and I had to replace the rear hub bearings every month or so until I changed the wheels entirely. The hub bore was so tight the bearings could barely be pressed in, they were actually crushed by the hub body itself so the bearings would just explode after a few weeks. I'm hoping the hubs with DT internals are manufactured to tigher tolerances...
Last edited by Dan Gerous on Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
Dan Gerous
Posts: 1578
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:28 pm

by Dan Gerous

Nice, Lachlan Morton's SuperSix in off-season/adventure mode... These are Vittoria Terrano Dry CX/Gravel tires on there! :mrgreen:
Attachments
LachlanEvo.jpg

S6ED
Posts: 204
Joined: Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:22 pm

by S6ED

Dan Gerous wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:36 pm
Nice, Lachlan Morton's SuperSix in off-season/adventure mode... These are Vittoria Terrano Dry CX/Gravel tires on there! :mrgreen:
I definitely wasn't expecting to see a super dooper Evo with tractor tyres :-o

floriansantana
Posts: 139
Joined: Thu Dec 25, 2014 8:57 pm

by floriansantana

hernejj wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 2:27 am
I've having a hard time figuring out how people are getting to <= 17 pound weights with the new Supersix Evo. Here is a chart, On the left is what I belive the stock 105 build to be (with my own pedals/cages/etc). The right is my currently planned build starting from the 105 frame. If anyone can see where I can significantly reduce weight or knows of any inaccuracies please let me know. All component weights are in grams, the final build weights are presented in grams and pounds.

In case image doesn't load inline: https://postimg.cc/1nrx7Fk9
Image
I'd start with a lighter cassette, lighter tubes (or tubeless) and lighter rotors. You can easily save 300 grams just there. I have the same frame set and built it to 7,1kg with Red Etap 11 speed.
Cannondale SuperSix Evo Disc
Cannondale SystemSix HiMod Disc
@floriansantana

Jackofallgrades
Posts: 59
Joined: Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:15 am

by Jackofallgrades

Dan Gerous wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:28 pm
Can't help you about the NGeco weight but yes, as far as I can tell, the 'Hollowgram' cranks are the same as the Hollowgram SI of the past few years (the 3D forged SI ones) with a simplified name and updated graphics, so a tad heavier than the SISL2 but not boat anchors as the non-Hollowgram entry-level cranksets on lower end builds, the 'Cannondale 1'. FSA vs Vision chainrings, shouldn't change much it's the same company.

I'm not sure but I think both the KNØT 45 and KNØT 45 SL use the same rims and hubs, but lighter, more expensive spokes on the SL... The good thing is they both use DT internals for the rear hubs unlike the Hollowgram 35 wheels that are just rebranded Hollowgram SI wheels of previous models. These use Formula made hubs I think and it's probably the biggest weakness across all Cannondale bikes, period. I had some Hollowgram SI for rim brakes and I had to replace the rear hub bearings every month or so until I changed the wheels entirely. The hub bore was so tight the bearings could barely be pressed in, they were actually crushed by the hub body itself so the bearings would just explode after a few weeks. I'm hoping the hubs with DT internals are manufactured to tigher tolerances...
Thanks Dan, any idea what kind of saving I'd get by swapping the HollowGram cranks to SISL2 ones? Sounds like not worth expense.

Good to hear on the 45s, torn between the standard mod Force AXS model and the only-slightly more expensive Hi-mod Dura Ace mechanical version. As well as the Hi-mod frame the better wheels make it look a better deal despite losing out on wireless shifting... and still plenty of scope for gains no?
Cannondale SSEvo3 'Agaaaaaaaavé' - 7.6kg
...Work in Progress viewtopic.php?f=10&t=161634

BagelMaster
Posts: 167
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:13 pm

by BagelMaster

Dan Gerous wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:36 pm
Nice, Lachlan Morton's SuperSix in off-season/adventure mode... These are Vittoria Terrano Dry CX/Gravel tires on there! :mrgreen:
I'm assuming those are the 31s? I know you posted Clement Strada USH 32s that fit, but those Vittorias both look awfully plush BUT have some nice tread.

by Weenie


refthimos
Posts: 340
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 6:02 pm

by refthimos

Jackofallgrades wrote:
Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:00 am
Does anybody know the actual weight of the crankset on the higher models with the NGeco PM built in?
Taken off Ultegra Di2 Hi-Mod bike:

https://flic.kr/p/2hu6jsc
EVO1 | 5.37kg
EVO3 | 6.51kg
SystemSix | 8.01kg
P5 | 9070 Di2 | SISL2 SRM | Enve 7.8/FFWD Falcon | Roval 321
T1 | P2Max Type S | Rolf Prima FX58/Zipp Super 9 Disc

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