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Kumppa
Posts: 291
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 10:05 am

by Kumppa

JCrider wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:11 pm
Curious what is the max tire size that can be used on this frame.
25mm Michelin Power competition clinchers on 22.4mm wide rim have 26.4 mm actual width. 4.1mm chainstay clearance each side. You can use higher tires like Pirelli without problem.

Got mine AdH built 2 weeks ago and experienced mechanic told me there was only clever solutions and it was really pleasant frame to work with. Rotor BB was like made to the frame and no problem with cable exists, carbon saddle rails, removing rear wheel etc.

Can't really say how much that Aktiv fork help alone but change from 23mm tires (on Parlee Z5sl) to 25mm + Aktiv fork was really impressive. On rough tarmac it's really smooth so perhaps it's not just marketing talk. Propably 28mm tires would do just same thing.

So far zero problems. Riding position is little bit higher than Parlee but with difference stem I can get it pretty close.

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Calnago
Posts: 8608
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by Calnago

Kumppa wrote:
JCrider wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:11 pm
Curious what is the max tire size that can be used on this frame.
25mm Michelin Power competition clinchers on 22.4mm wide rim have 26.4 mm actual width. 4.1mm chainstay clearance each side. You can use higher tires like Pirelli without problem.
22.4mm “external” rim width? So 17mm internal? That’s about as narrow as they come these days I’d say. And the chainstay clearance isn’t usually the issue. It’s the clearance up front of the rear tire, behind the BB and seat tube, that can be an issue when you try to remove the rear wheel without deflating the tire that can be tricky with the Skylon, I don’t know if they’ve carved any more material from behind the BB and seattube to ease this, but in my experience anything over 25mm on the Skylon would be very tight. And throw a wider rim into the equation and you’ve got some issues of inconvenience as a minimum. Personally I’m fine with 25’s but these days people seem to want ever wider, fatter tires on ever increasingly wide rims, so the actual measurements can balloon pretty quickly depending on tire/rim combo. And if it’s comfort you’re after above all, then for sure, why not.
@Kumppa... is your frame rim brake or disc? Mechanical or electric shifting? Battery install, at least for Campy, had to be modified a bit to use the Di2 holder for best results. But if you’re running mechanical, I agree that routing cables is a breeze. Just in one end and out the other. No fishing required. And they have modified the exit port grommets for electrical I think, a major sticking point in prior versions. But as for disc geometry, if they haven’t given a bit of extra length to the chainstays then the chainline is going to be poor, no way around it.
Last edited by Calnago on Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

by Weenie


JCrider
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:22 pm

by JCrider

Kumppa wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:38 pm
JCrider wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:11 pm
Curious what is the max tire size that can be used on this frame.
25mm Michelin Power competition clinchers on 22.4mm wide rim have 26.4 mm actual width. 4.1mm chainstay clearance each side. You can use higher tires like Pirelli without problem.
Thanks. Sounds like 28C might fit depending on rim width and tire brand.

I've switched to 25mm same Michelins that you have on the RXR and made a huge difference compared to riding 23C for decades. Fat tires are the latest rage now by me. Some people I know running 32s. I am not going that crazy but will be happy if 28C fits on the AdH.
I did fine with 25C Conti Gatorskins on an 80 mile ride with 17 miles of it dirt/gravel on the NXR few months ago.
I got 25c and 28c Conti 5K waiting for the AdH.

Kumppa
Posts: 291
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 10:05 am

by Kumppa

Yes 22.4mm external and like 17mm internal. Removing wheel without deflating is really easy with my narrow rims but agree it could be different with wide rims and cause some problem. I would say 25mm clincher with wider rim is max what you can run on AdH. 28mm tubular might be different thing. Iam totally fine with 25mm.
Image

My frame is rim brake and using mechanical so it is pretty basic build. With electronical it would be again very different thing as I don't know if there is Di2 holder available and don't know if you need get different exits for electonic. From Bikeradar you can see their Di2 test bikes came with different exist. I have same Ulteam model.

Bikeradar:
Image

Image

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kgt
Posts: 7943
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:29 am
Location: Athens, Greece

by kgt

25mm - 27mm are the best choice IME. In general this frame was designed for 27mm (actual) max. according to my dealer. The chainstays are still 404mm but it is the design of the seat tube that allows for wider tires. Maybe 28c is too wide, but you don't need to go that wide in this frame just because it is trendy. The frame provides enough comfort by itself.

In terms of ride quality you can read my review at p. 2:
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=155748&hilit=time+ ... z&start=30
IME it is an amazing frame, light, super responsive, stiff and comfortable. A little less stiff than the Skylon but considerably more comfortable.

And when it is about TIME frames just don't hear whatever Calnago says. :smartass:

Kumppa
Posts: 291
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2014 10:05 am

by Kumppa

kgt wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:13 am
IME it is an amazing frame, light, super responsive, stiff and comfortable.
Agree. Mine with aktiv fork isn't that light but I would say it's still decent. Size M 6645g with Red22, Quarq, 45mm ffwd clinchers and nothing fancy and lightweight stuff. Can't feel any noodle effect but I can sprint just ~1100W. And it looks really good, maybe even too bling for my taste as I like look of Parlee and everyone just see black bike. :noidea:

Still have to say Calnago have good points and I respect his view. Tire clearance and chainstays could be different. It's little bit hard to buy these without testing but found out geometry was good for me.

I don't want to pay bigger manufacturers marketing costs when product is made in China. But I wouldn't pay full 5700€ RPR for this frame as I wouldn't pay that amount for any bike frame. Price was good and thats why Iam totally happy to enjoy and ride this bike. And most important thing, this makes me want to ride more.
Last edited by Kumppa on Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:06 am, edited 3 times in total.

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kgt
Posts: 7943
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Location: Athens, Greece

by kgt

Of course it is not a noodle, rather the opposite.
And I know that aktiv is heavy, but it works miracles. In any case you end up with a frameset that is still light. In an era when a 8kg road racing bike is acceptable just because it looks cool and trendy, a 500gr fork is not an issue at all IMHO.
Last edited by kgt on Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

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JKolmo
Posts: 493
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 2:00 pm

by JKolmo

Noodle is just so far off when describing the AdH.

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Calnago
Posts: 8608
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

To be clear, no one said the Adh is a “noodle”. I have not ridden one. I was referring to the older RXR Ulteam, which it appears @JCrider has experience with as well. He said he liked it as it was “comfortable” when he was riding crap roads and asked for opinions on the newer frames, including Skylon. I just mentioned the Skylon is worlds different than the RXR in the stiffness department. So if he was looking for a comfortable frame then the Skylon may not be the best choice.
As for the new Adh, I would hope it’s stiffer than the RXR, but it’s my experience with ultralight frames that they’re just not as solid, how can they be? They can be made with stiffer carbon/resins, but often end up feeling almost brittle to ride. Even TIME’s own marketing babble on their website said that for riders who prefer more “control” (or something to that effect), that the beefy Aktiv fork is a good option. I remember chuckling a bit when I read that during its release. Another reviewer noticed brake rub, and decided to blame it on the wheels. Hmmm... maybe. Until I’m on one myself I don’t know. JCrider is also on an XS frame, so a lot of these issues may not even affect him as they might on a larger frame for a larger rider. But larger tires are important for JCrider as he said (he would like to ride 28’s). If TIME hasn’t changed much in that area then I suspect that could be an issue on even a slightly wider clincher rim than normal. I know it would be in the Skylon. But his is a disc frame as well. If they haven’t given the chainstays some extra length over the 404mm then the chainline is going to be far from optimal.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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kgt
Posts: 7943
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:29 am
Location: Athens, Greece

by kgt

AdH is very stiff. It is not superlight (almost 900gr @ size 56 including seatpost clamp, cable guides etc.) so there are no compromises.
The aktiv fork does give more "control" because it absorbs vibrations and provides confidence, especially when going fast downhill. It goes without saying that the normal fork is excellent too. Very stiff and more comfortable than others because of the use of vectran. According to Raoul Luescher it is maybe the highest quality carbon fork in the market.
The chainline is fine. 404mm is pretty standard and 1 or 2mm more do not matter in practice. A much longer chainstay would compromise responsiveness.

JCrider
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:22 pm

by JCrider

Calnago summed up pretty good I 've posted. We'll find out if I can run 28C Conti GP5000s in few months when I get the frame.
I am pretty happy with 25s at the moment but sometimes I do these rides with friends who do not MTB and want to do 80 mile road ride that has 20 miles of dirt/gravel on it to test their skills. I've done OK ith 25s on those types of rides but 28s would have been better.
Normal day to day 25s are great on tarmac. I have swapped back old GP4000 23s on my NXR because I want to wear them out for training miles and will do a century tomorrow with friends using 23s.
On the topic of chain line; I plan to run 9170 DA di2 on them. Been on di2 since 1st gen 2009(7970 DA) and other bike Ultegra di2 since 2012. No issues at all with chain line and auto trim works great. I was thinking of 12 spd etap but maybe it is better that going with 11 spd di2. Plus still hate those goat horn etap hoods even on the latest etap.

di2 hydro-disc groupset is going to be about 300g heavier than regular di2 so that is one of the reasons for me to avoid Aktiv fork. Few grams here few there and it will be a 17lb expensive bike soon otherwise.

I considered Colnago C64 disc but those frames are even heavier from what I read unless someone can correct me. Considered a custom Parlee disc but can't justify $8.3K on a frame alone!

I am looking to get bikeahead biturbo wheels and also a custom Enve 5.6 disc with DT 180 hubs. What do you guys think about those wheel options? If not biturbos then might go enve 3.4s for the mountains.

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Calnago
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Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

JCrider wrote: I am looking to get bikeahead biturbo wheels and also a custom Enve 5.6 disc with DT 180 hubs. What do you guys think about those wheel options? If not biturbos then might go enve 3.4s for the mountains.
I don’t know anything about the biturbo wheels. The ENVE 5.6’s are 19mm internal width. If this was going on a Skylon with 28mm clinchers there’d be no way. Up until now the Conti 4000sii 25mm has always been my goto clincher for determining safe clearance simply because it sits taller (almost eggshaped) than any other tire of the same nominal size.
But you’ve got the new Conti 5000’s, which have been redone so that a 28mm probably fits closer to what the previous 25mm in the 4000’s would fit like on the same rim. So, you may get away with it with the new 5000’s but I’m not sure, especially with the 19mm internal rims. Just have to try them I guess.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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kgt
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by kgt

Factory visit porn with many hi-res images:
http://www.test4outside.com/en/article_ ... -machines/

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miltmaster3
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by miltmaster3

kgt wrote:Factory visit porn with many hi-res images:
http://www.test4outside.com/en/article_ ... -machines/
Very impressive!


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FredV
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2004 4:03 pm
Location: Lyon, France

by FredV

New colors for 2020? (much nicer IMHO)

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