Yup... another etap front derailleur thread. Sanity check.

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
jih
Posts: 243
Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2016 12:54 pm

by jih

Regarding wedges, on some aero frames I find there’s no way to fasten the wedge to the derailleur while mounted on the bike.

I had praxis ring’s ok my etap setup. Couldn’t get the front shifting working well at all having spent many hours trying different combinations. Changed to Rotor no-Q (ie, round) rings and they are so much better. Very strange since praxis generally have a good reputation for shifting.

1415chris
Posts: 1266
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:59 am
Location: Surrey UK

by 1415chris

I can see that we are talking about two types of wedges. One type the wedges supplied with derailleur, mounted on the back of FD to fill the gap between derailleur and the frame.
The wedges I was referring to are those you mount between braze-on mount and derailleur.

by Weenie


bikeboy1tr
Posts: 369
Joined: Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:19 am
Location: Southern Ontario Canada

by bikeboy1tr

1415chris wrote: ↑
Tue May 07, 2019 5:20 pm
I can see that we are talking about two types of wedges. One type the wedges supplied with derailleur, mounted on the back of FD to fill the gap between derailleur and the frame.
The wedges I was referring to are those you mount between braze-on mount and derailleur.
Those are more like a spacer block to move the fd into position for TT frames with steeper ST from what I have read.
"Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving"-Albert Einstein
2018 Colnago V2R Rim Brake
2014 Norco Threshold Disc Brake
2012 Time RXRS Ulteam Rim Brake
2008 Time VXR Rim Brake
2006 Ridley Crosswind Rim Brake

gurk700
Posts: 240
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2017 7:40 pm

by gurk700

As much as I love etap/sram, short comings of it in my opinion is the system being too frame dependant and not allow for a wide range of adjustability. I don't know if it's because SRAM doesn't test with enough variety of frames or what but I've had bikes that I've used eTap on that were nightmare to setup (verging on impossible to do it perfectly) while others that were spot on with little to no effort. For example, on a Cervelo R5, eTap was mediocre at best. I couldn't set it up so that the FD easily shifts to big ring but not throw over the chain on the outside. You had to choose one over the other. BMC roadmachine worked noticeably better while Tarmac was pretty much perfect. But on the Tarmac, after a month of use, I lost the ability to shift from 8th to 9th cog smoothly. Whatever I did, including using hanger alignment tool to make sure hanger is straight, didn't help. Then I installed a DuraAce cassette and everything was much better again. Then I installed a full Di2 group which made it PERFECT but that's another story.

TL:DR On some bikes, with eTap, it looks like you're shit out of luck.

RocketRacing
Posts: 691
Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

Interesting.

My bike is size small so chainstay length is 403mm.

I have no wedges aside from the one on the bike. I am not sure what “fits” means, but i am pretty sure the spacer i have falls within the definition.

So... to shave or not to shave the braze on? I will leave as is (hopefully good enough), finish the setup, and see how things go from there. If there are still problems (with a lbs sanity check), i might shave a few mm off the top of the braze on.

RocketRacing
Posts: 691
Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

bikeboy1tr wrote: ↑
Tue May 07, 2019 6:27 pm
1415chris wrote: ↑
Tue May 07, 2019 5:20 pm
I can see that we are talking about two types of wedges. One type the wedges supplied with derailleur, mounted on the back of FD to fill the gap between derailleur and the frame.
The wedges I was referring to are those you mount between braze-on mount and derailleur.
Those are more like a spacer block to move the fd into position for TT frames with steeper ST from what I have read.
Photos?

RocketRacing
Posts: 691
Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

Here is the etap parts kit. Looks like there are 3 wedges. I have never heard of the other type of wedge.
F97D68D5-0665-49F4-A19F-C49AD77A4B53.jpeg

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 3589
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

https://www.google.com/search?q=11.7615 ... 15.011.000

There is a Rotor solution with two different shims too. Keep in mind these shims won’t really solve the overshift problems for most and should only be used with weird seat-tube geometries.

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Kayrehn
Posts: 1220
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 6:06 pm

by Kayrehn

RocketRacing wrote:Here is the etap parts kit. Looks like there are 3 wedges. I have never heard of the other type of wedge.
F97D68D5-0665-49F4-A19F-C49AD77A4B53.jpeg
Does anyone knows where I can get them? I have 2 bikes on etap but only could find one set of them and will need to get it somewhere online.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk


jlok
Posts: 976
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

Litespeed T1sl Disc / BMC TM02 < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

1415chris
Posts: 1266
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:59 am
Location: Surrey UK

by 1415chris

TobinHatesYou wrote:https://www.google.com/search?q=11.7615 ... 15.011.000

There is a Rotor solution with two different shims too. Keep in mind these shims won’t really solve the overshift problems for most and should only be used with weird seat-tube geometries.
I wouldn't call Cervelo S5 weird seat-tube geometrie.
As we don't know what is the exact reason for overshift, it is hard to diminish any suggestion as a potential a good remedy.
It worked perfectly in my case, it may also wokr for others.

Wedges in question. I used the small one.

Image


NickJHP
Posts: 232
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:22 am
Location: Canberra, Australia

by NickJHP

I have eTap 2x11 on a gravel bike with 42-29 chainrings (so considerably smaller rings than the FD is designed for). The FD mount on the frame is bolted on, so that if you run 1x you can remove it, so when I initally installed the FD I loosened the mount bolts and rotated it slightly to get the FD cage to better follow the 42t large chainring. I installed the FD as per the SRAM instructions for height and angle - initially I had the occasional chain throw to the outside, so I changed the outer limit screw by about 1/4 turn, and haven't had the chain throw off since, nor have I had any problems with shifting between chainrings no matter where the chain is on the cassette, though I tend not to use the two largest sprockets with the big chainring or the three smallest with the small chainring.

I'm also not using the SRAM chain - it's a KMC X11SL.

Image

ancker
Posts: 135
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2011 9:29 pm

by ancker

1415chris wrote: ↑
Wed May 08, 2019 11:04 am
TobinHatesYou wrote:https://www.google.com/search?q=11.7615 ... 15.011.000

There is a Rotor solution with two different shims too. Keep in mind these shims won’t really solve the overshift problems for most and should only be used with weird seat-tube geometries.
I wouldn't call Cervelo S5 weird seat-tube geometrie.
As we don't know what is the exact reason for overshift, it is hard to diminish any suggestion as a potential a good remedy.
It worked perfectly in my case, it may also wokr for others.

Wedges in question. I used the small one.
It's less about the seat tube itself, more about where the FD hanger is mounted in relation to the chainrings. Being off even 1 or 2 degrees drastically changes the angle of the FD cage. Sometimes, specifically on TT bikes, the hanger is mounted in a way that makes the cage tilt upwards too much. The small shim angles it down where it should be.

bcmf
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 5:00 pm

by bcmf

Having had etap on two Ridley NOAH frames (one FAST and now on an SL) its shifting ALMOST flawlessly on the SL with Record 4 arm cranks. I say almost as I do get the occasional drop. I put this down to the limit screw moving ever so slightly.
However on the FAST frame it was a nightmare.
Now a clubmate has bought a BOWMAN frame in a size bigger then me and has etap on it. Not one issue with the fd.
So I reckon as mentioned above its got to be fd hanger angle issues.

bikeboy1tr
Posts: 369
Joined: Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:19 am
Location: Southern Ontario Canada

by bikeboy1tr

Maybe we should make a list of the bikes 11sp etap works properly on. Colnago V2R seems okay. Time RXRS not so much.
"Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving"-Albert Einstein
2018 Colnago V2R Rim Brake
2014 Norco Threshold Disc Brake
2012 Time RXRS Ulteam Rim Brake
2008 Time VXR Rim Brake
2006 Ridley Crosswind Rim Brake

by Weenie


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