Cable/Housing combo? Jagwire Pro, Shimano Dura Ace... something else?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
oldturd
Posts: 188
Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2016 12:10 am

by oldturd

Yup, I can weigh it. I also received the Elite Pro sealed kit (XEX) yesterday. Is the same as your Pro?

Understood on the taxes- I'm canadian so it worked out for me, for the first time!

by Weenie


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StanK
Posts: 243
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Location: Croatia

by StanK

Uh, more confusion ... :? :D Elite Pro?

I saw "Elite" and "Pro" sets. And "Pro Lightweight" that I didn't find, but you got it at Rossi Bikes. I really don't know about that Elite Pro set.
If I understand correctly, you would had 2 sets: one is Elite Pro and the other would be Pro Lightweight? If so, it would be really interesting to compare that two.

oldturd
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by oldturd

Sorry, not enough coffee. Just Elite Sealed. LOL

So yes, Road Elite sealed and Pro Shift lightweight.

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StanK
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Location: Croatia

by StanK

Well, you can weigh both of them, ideal opportunity. I think more than few people would be interested. I certainly would.
Is Elite sealed XEX housing weigh 17g/m or just XEX-SL from Pro Lightweight? At least to know how much I "lost" in choosing "ordinary" Pro :)

RocketRacing
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Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

I went through this reciently with the xex-sl, xex, lex, les, blah blah.

I opted for the sealed elite brake kit from jaguire. The lincs looks like hassle, and not a weight savings after adaptors were fitted (can’t run under bar tape). And then there were the white mountain bike liners from tune. Sounded like a lot of work in sourcing to get ugly white brake lines.

And good luck comparing weights... is what i found. I think the bigger key is to not make the lines any shorter or longer than required.

Mep
Posts: 500
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 4:11 pm

by Mep

For those in America, Kyle's Bikes in Iowa has them in stock and on eBay e.g. https://ebay.us/exKTXY

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StanK
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by StanK

RocketRacing wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 1:46 am
... And good luck comparing weights... is what i found. I think the bigger key is to not make the lines any shorter or longer than required.
I don't get it, to be frank.
Proper length is basic stuff. But if you are not interested in weight saving, why bother with top Jagwire kit?

If I'm not interesting in getting lighter "wiring", I would buy something 3x cheaper (as I did on the previous bikes) and be happy with it. Never got problem with entry-level sets of well known brands. They work.

RocketRacing
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Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

StanK wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 11:34 am
RocketRacing wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 1:46 am
... And good luck comparing weights... is what i found. I think the bigger key is to not make the lines any shorter or longer than required.
I don't get it, to be frank.
Proper length is basic stuff. But if you are not interested in weight saving, why bother with top Jagwire kit?

If I'm not interesting in getting lighter "wiring", I would buy something 3x cheaper (as I did on the previous bikes) and be happy with it. Never got problem with entry-level sets of well known brands. They work.
The short answer is that i was interested in weight saving, just not hassle. Jagwire elite sealed. Done.

The longer, and far more jaded response follows...

I was all about a finding a balance of low weight and quality(performance). price was secondary because, in the big picture, no cable option was terribly expensive.

But when i did my weight weenie search, i found solid info on weights to be lacking. The entire weight per length helps, but much of the weight is in the ends/links/bells/whistles which is not captured in this weight per length. And it was also frusterating as the weight per length may be as a system, not the sheathing, or cable weighed separate (to mix and match the lightest of each).

And places that did weigh the entire system either weighed everything uncut in a package, or to the specific length for one bike. I just could not find find much objective apples to apples weights. Just forum comments on “this is lighter, or that has bad performance”. So ideas like kncn brake cables pared with stripped white mtb tune housings i just shelved. Maybe i could save a few grams, but a jagwire kit would come with everything i needed, and is a proven performer. Easy.

So i just threw my hands up in the air and bought a top end sealed brake kit that had a good rep in performance (jagwire elite sealed). And i passed on the jag elite linc option as it seemed fiddly... and grime magnets. And possibly harsh on frames. I figured that any weight savings might be partly negated by the protection i would need to add to stop those things from making a mess of my frame in the event of a excessive right turn of my bars.

So i thought about my choices a lot, maybe too much.

When i get around to installing my new jag kit, i might even weigh what i removed (vs what i am about to install with roughlty the same length).

That being said, if someone finds/promotes a light/reliable solution, and shares it here, i am all ears.

Mep
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Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 4:11 pm

by Mep

RocketRacing wrote:
The short answer is that i was interested in weight saving, just not hassle.
It sounds like you're after the easiest solution, not the highest performing or lightest. You've summed it up quite well in your first sentence. For the easiest possible solution, you can't go too wrong with a Jagwire kit. That said, if your cable system has much of its weight in cable ends/accessories, you're clearly doing something wrong.

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StanK
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by StanK

RocketRacing wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 4:21 pm
... places ... either weighed everything uncut in a package, or to the specific length for one bike. I just could not find find much objective apples to apples weights. Just forum comments on “this is lighter, or that has bad performance”...
Well, that is always problem with multi-part systems and that's why I asked oldturd if can weighed that two different but similar Jagwire sets. I hope he will weigh everything separately :)
For my upcoming change of "wiring" that info won't be of some use, but maybe will be for next change. And surely for someone else, who consider similar options, that info could be very interesting.

It is not that some of those information can't be found around here, but not much. I managed to find (by accident) some info (in one gallery) and now I know that I can expected that Jagwire Pro on my bike would weight aprox. 160g. Thing that really interested me now, is weight of present wiring on my bike, and that will I know when I take it off.

And even then, every bike is different so you can't known weight for sure. At least not to the gram or two, or even five. There is always some +/- margin (I don't know; 10, 30 grams?), but we can come closer to real numbers by putting bits and pieces to the scale. There is no other way.

Btw. I love lenghty "jaded" posts, RocketRacing and your was enjoy to read :thumbup:

RocketRacing
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Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

Mep wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 7:07 pm
RocketRacing wrote:
The short answer is that i was interested in weight saving, just not hassle.
It sounds like you're after the easiest solution, not the highest performing or lightest. You've summed it up quite well in your first sentence. For the easiest possible solution, you can't go too wrong with a Jagwire kit. That said, if your cable system has much of its weight in cable ends/accessories, you're clearly doing something wrong.
My first sentence was incorrect. I was going for the best balance of high performing and light. Easy was a nice side effect.

On the topic of easy, Weight weeniesm is usually pretty easy... google schmolke or thm, and when in doubt buy the most expensive part available. For brake cables, my desire for something not discontinued (red flag!!!), pushed me to Jagwire.

It was between tune housing (now discontinued?) with kncn cables, or some other brand that i forget that was apparently light and popular around here (no numbers) but had reliability and stretching issues, and Jagwire. I had gotten into the same issue as the OP with googling specific lighter jag housings that were now discontinued (still used in elite shift sets i believe).

I may have exaggerated about cable ends/acessories.

RocketRacing
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Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

StanK wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 11:31 pm

Btw. I love lenghty "jaded" posts, RocketRacing and your was enjoy to read :thumbup:
Yeah, brake cables, and to a lesser degree brake calipers were less of an easy decision for me. Researching cables just frustrated me.

Brakes: thm too expensive. Camillo - was not willing to deal with the rep/flex/fussiness (maybe the new ones are good, but they lost me already), Ee brakes... perfect (got used in excellent condition).

Cables - just a headache of opinion, anticdotes, discontinued stuff, and soft data. I considered braking to be one of those “mission critical” parts where you don’t want to f$&k around too much. Flying too close to the sun and all that. Dental work is not cheap... that is why dentists all ride pinarellos and colnagos fyi. ;-)

RocketRacing
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Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

Mep wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 7:07 pm
It sounds like you're after the easiest solution, not the highest performing or lightest.
So what is the lightest/highest performing brake cable option that we can buy today? (I include durability as part of performance, and i refuse to put white cables on my bike... cause, yeah... i am superficial like that).

Jagwire was arguably the best performing in the opinions i read, and i was just not seeing big weight savings for other brake lines. Unless i was missing something, i was seeing differences in single digit grams ar the cost to a hit to performance/reliability. Nope.

But if there is a holy grail out there made of angel hairs lubed by the tears or orphans, let me know and i will buy it.

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StanK
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Location: Croatia

by StanK

Pro sets arrived and I put it on scale. Weights of the housings are:

Shift: LEX-SL 33g/m
Brake: KEB-SL 41g/m

Weight of cables are pretty low. Of course, I don't know weight of head of the cable, but in general ...

Shift: 10g/m aprox
Brake: 13g/m aprox

I don't know that there is much to reduce with some other option. Probably, but not much.
Bits and pieces are 5-6 grams per set, and you wouldn't use them all, so ...

Now, I would like to know real weight of shift housing that is provided with Elite sealed and Pro lightweight sets, and CSX housing from Elite sealed brake set. With that I would know what I missed on saving grams, at least :)
Last edited by StanK on Sat May 04, 2019 9:00 am, edited 2 times in total.

by Weenie


alcatraz
Posts: 2259
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

I use noname alloy stranded housing. 26gr/m brake and 20gr/m shift.

I wouldn't recommend it for high performance but works ok enough and pleases my ww heart. :lol:

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