Gravel bike steering, can it be good on AND off road?

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spartacus
Posts: 1048
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:53 pm

by spartacus

Is slower steering on the road a tolerable tradeoff for greater stability off road?

Are the gravel bikes that supposedly handle like a road bike at a disadvantage off road because of the geometry?

People seem to be winning races on the "slower steering" gravelbikes like the grizl, diverge, etc...

Are "faster handling" gravel bikes like a crux, aspero, 3t, tangibly more road bike feeling and "faster" on the road than normal gravel bikes?

CarlosFerreiro
Posts: 419
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Location: Shetland, Scotland

by CarlosFerreiro

I've not ridden a large range of gravel geometries, and suspect I might not be the most sensative to the differences anyhow, but when I got my SuperX I went from a US CAAD8 straight to that with a similar fit and stem length and didn't notice any difference on road large enough that I had to get used to it.

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Orbital
Posts: 392
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:52 am
Location: Pitt Meadows, BC

by Orbital

My road bike is a 2014 Supersix evo. My gravel is a 2020 Giant Revolt. They are at the opposite of the spectrum! I sometimes wish I had more similar feeling bikes but ultimately after a while in the saddle I get used to the steering and they’re both super fun bikes.

Karvalo
Posts: 3426
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:40 pm

by Karvalo

spartacus wrote:
Mon Oct 11, 2021 5:12 pm
Is slower steering on the road a tolerable tradeoff for greater stability off road?
Depends on you. Some people claim not to like anything but the sharpest of sharp handling crit race inspired road bike geometries, others prefer more stable and composed bikes. Personally I don't think that even quite seriously off-road focussed geo will make a gravel bike any slower round tarmac corners, but it may make it feel less fun on the road.
Are the gravel bikes that supposedly handle like a road bike at a disadvantage off road because of the geometry?
Depends on the surface, but IMO they more clearly are - especially when the terrain gets steeper, looser and chunkier.

OTOH if your gravel is a gravel road, then not so much.
Last edited by Karvalo on Tue Oct 12, 2021 3:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Marin
Posts: 4035
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:48 am
Location: Vienna Austria

by Marin

It's just a matter or preference.

However, the biggest difference in steering feel / handling comes from tire type, width and pressure.

Even with a slack head angle and long trail, a bike on 25mm tires @ 5.5bar will feel much more responsive than a bike with "quicker" geometry on 45mm semi-knobbies at 1.8bars.

fastezzie
Posts: 110
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2006 9:30 pm

by fastezzie

A more capable bike downhill is a huge advantage offroad. I had my best XC results on a 140mm bike. Same logic applies to gravel racing, a more stable and confident bike allows you to recover more going downhill. On a flat or smooth route I don't think it would matter much.

rothwem
Posts: 206
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:45 pm
Location: Asheville, NC

by rothwem

I think one of the biggest factors related to bike handling is the wheelbase of the bike and where the rider is located in it than the actual head tube angle/rake/trail numbers.

My Crux is a very quick handling gravelly bike, but compared to a road bike, it is decidedly less good on the road than an actual road bike.

Marin
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Location: Vienna Austria

by Marin

rothwem wrote:
Tue Oct 12, 2021 9:33 pm
My Crux is a very quick handling gravelly bike, but compared to a road bike, it is decidedly less good on the road than an actual road bike.
On identical wheels/tires/pressures?

rothwem
Posts: 206
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Location: Asheville, NC

by rothwem

Marin wrote:
Tue Oct 12, 2021 9:44 pm
rothwem wrote:
Tue Oct 12, 2021 9:33 pm
My Crux is a very quick handling gravelly bike, but compared to a road bike, it is decidedly less good on the road than an actual road bike.
On identical wheels/tires/pressures?
Similar ones. I've got a road set of wheels with 28mm Michelin Pro4s, my road bike had Open Pro/Dura Ace's with 25mm Pro4s. The disc wheels on the Crux are ~100grams heavier but I wouldn't think it would make a huge difference.

robertbb
Posts: 2179
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:35 am

by robertbb

Road bike geometry is often synonymous with "twitchy" (but mostly described as "exhilerating" or "nimble" or "reactive" or similar while gravel/touring bike is synonymous with "boring", "dull", etc.

I couldn't disagree more. Once I tried a stable and better fitting bike with longer chainstays/wheelbase and a slacker headtube I realised the word to describe race bikes is....... whack.

Give me stable and comfortable anyday, on road or off.

fourfa
Posts: 107
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:04 am

by fourfa

Haven't seen the word "dropper" yet. My preference is for a road bike geometry plus a dropper, and on fast gravel descents drop the post 100mm and get my center of mass way back and down. Works for me on my terrain.

gwerziou
Posts: 347
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:25 pm
Location: Ballard, WA

by gwerziou

I have been markedly unsatisfied by slack-angled gravel machines. I had a Salsa warbird - it did not want to turn! I'm sure that they are great on rougher terrain, but on rougher terrain I use my...mountain bike. I recently picked up an old steel (853 tubeset!) cross bike from back in the day that has 73/73 angles, 430 chainstays and I absolutely adore that bike. By random chance it fits me so well and handles like a dream on road and the light off-road that I use the bike for. It has that kind of feel like it is an extension of you. This makes me think I am more of an "all-road" type of rider, I guess?
• A hi-zoot bike, pretty sweet
• An old bike, more fun than the new one actually
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cerro
Posts: 1957
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by cerro

My Diverge (21') was faster than my Factor LS downhill on rough gravel. But the LS was like a roadbike on road and great except on the roughest gravel.
Now I got a Factor Vista which feels like it sits between them steering wise and will try it for the first time on gravel tomorrow.

I would also it depends on what you're used too. Coming for a bigger bike to a tighter bike is making you safer on descends compared to coming from a roadbike to gravel.

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