Alternatives to Open UP?

Especially for light weight issues concerning cyclocross / touring bikes & parts.

Moderator: Moderator Team

amey
Posts: 208
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:09 am

by amey

DutchMountains wrote:
amey wrote:IF you are open to far east options this is quite nice: http://www.carbonda.com/road/gravel/cfr505.html

I've just got one, it will be delivered this week. The factory also sent me a pic with 47c 650b WTB Horizon tyres and mudguards.

Shame I just got a Bish Bash Bosh frameset as this looks even nicer. I'd love to hear more about it when you get it: weight, cost, how much clearance there is between chain stays etc etc.

Btw, the medium sized Bish Bash Bosh frame weighs 1160 gram, with the (uncut) fork being 500 gram. Definitely not worth the 999 UKP list price (it's not very refined and finishing only so-so) but at 377 UKP it should make a nice winter / fast touring bike. It comes with 12mm/15mm through axles included (heavy at 174 gram combined) and nothing else; you'll need to buy the headset, steerer bung and rear mudguard (fender) mount separately.



I'll post some photos tomorrow :)

UpFromOne
Posts: 800
Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:23 am
Location: Olympic Nat'l Park, WA

by UpFromOne

Just found this TrailDonkey frame:

http://www.rodeo-labs.com/td2/

Not sure what to make of it yet.

Stalkan
Posts: 109
Joined: Tue Sep 21, 2010 1:04 pm

by Stalkan

That looks pretty nice and seems to check all your boxes except for "inexpensive". FWIW, rack/fender mounts are a glaring omission from the UP....

User avatar
wheelsONfire
Posts: 3110
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

It looks like a nice option to UP. I'd rather take my chances on this one over 3T Explorer.
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2018.12.21)
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156137
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D

UpFromOne
Posts: 800
Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:23 am
Location: Olympic Nat'l Park, WA

by UpFromOne

Yes, the whole "aero" gravel thing is questionable to me.

The Trail Donkey's pro's are a round, non-proprietary seatpost + clamp, and 71.5 head angle (medium).

The con's to me are the PF30 BB, the flat brake mounts, shortish top tube, high stack for the frame size, and the weight-to-price ratio.

Stalkan
Posts: 109
Joined: Tue Sep 21, 2010 1:04 pm

by Stalkan

I was thinking about the exploro on the commute home yesterday and simultaneously thought about Cervelo's study on the bar being a much larger factor on aero impact than the frame is. That is one of the reasons I run an AeroNova on my UP and have used aero bars on my road bikes since 2012. To that point, I wonder if running an aero bar on a gravel bike is actually more of a benefit than running the 3T frame with round bars.

Also, the 3T bike is more about being an everything bike (road, crits, gravel,) than just an aero gravel bike. Now the latter is silly, but 3T is actually arguing that the aero aspect makes it viable in other disciplines. That being said Aero is always a thing and if they can make the same bike with the same attributes slipperier through the air than I don't think that is a bad thing. However, the look of the 3T did not speak to me as the UP did.

dmulligan
Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:16 pm

by dmulligan

amey wrote:IF you are open to far east options this is quite nice: http://www.carbonda.com/road/gravel/cfr505.html

I've just got one, it will be delivered this week. The factory also sent me a pic with 47c 650b WTB Horizon tyres and mudguards.

How much? How much does it weigh? Where did you buy it? How is the paint job?
Do I also see rack brazons on the rear seat stays and drop outs as well as front fender mounts? How does your mudguard mount at the back end? I don't see any wires going to the dropouts.
I've been looking for a new commuter/cross/gravel race bike with a shorter reach and this one looks promising!



Sent from my Oneplus One using Tapatalk

User avatar
wheelsONfire
Posts: 3110
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

UpFromOne wrote:Yes, the whole "aero" gravel thing is questionable to me.

The Trail Donkey's pro's are a round, non-proprietary seatpost + clamp, and 71.5 head angle (medium).

The con's to me are the PF30 BB, the flat brake mounts, shortish top tube, high stack for the frame size, and the weight-to-price ratio.


You can use torque tite PF 30 BB over pressfit.

3T Exploro head tube angle 71,1 degree size medium
Open UP head tube angle size medium 71,0 degree size medium.
So, i don't see a huge difference here.

Can't say much about the brake mounts. On Lauf Grit you must use an adapter to get postmount instead of direct mount.

Aero is not making much for me. I only believe in position and wheels/tires as long as we don't talk fractions of real time differences.
Also, we should buy into the whole outfit of aero to play in this ballpark.
Although i must admit, i bought No tubes Avion Pro for some aero gains on tarmac and also because of the reversed ideal of vertical rim stiffness.
http://www.notubes.com/RiACT/

Also a great idea when you bang into potholes or some roots in the woods!
Cracked rims is not on top of wish list!

Also bought a head light to mount at helmet (how aero can this be?)

Anyway, my fastest gravel tires are less comfortable and offers less grip and traction on loose gravel.
So this thing (tires) is of huge interest to me.
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2018.12.21)
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156137
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D

MikeDee
Posts: 118
Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2014 1:27 am

by MikeDee

Ritchey Ascent. Takes 700x40 or 27.5x2.1 max.

amey
Posts: 208
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:09 am

by amey

dmulligan wrote:
amey wrote:IF you are open to far east options this is quite nice: http://www.carbonda.com/road/gravel/cfr505.html

I've just got one, it will be delivered this week. The factory also sent me a pic with 47c 650b WTB Horizon tyres and mudguards.

How much? How much does it weigh? Where did you buy it? How is the paint job?
Do I also see rack brazons on the rear seat stays and drop outs as well as front fender mounts? How does your mudguard mount at the back end? I don't see any wires going to the dropouts.
I've been looking for a new commuter/cross/gravel race bike with a shorter reach and this one looks promising!



Sent from my Oneplus One using Tapatalk


Frame with axle and headset weighs 1266g and uncut fork with axle weighs 496g

It was £550 delivered including the customs charges to UK. The build quality is great. I bought it directly from Carbonda on alibaba. Spent a lot of time discussing it with Adam at Carbonda, great guy amazing customer support.

To prove that the mudguards will fit fine they did this mock up for me:
Image

It has full mudguard support front and rear. The rear has a machined bridge that goes on the seat stays (in the last pic).

Comes with all the bits for Di2 or mechanical. I am building it 1x11 Di2 with medium cage 6870 rear mech.

Image
Image

As promised more photos: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/5whznzj3y5x8 ... w7_Wa?dl=0

Stalkan
Posts: 109
Joined: Tue Sep 21, 2010 1:04 pm

by Stalkan

I love the dropped seat stays....that is a good looking bike.

DutchMountains
Posts: 103
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2016 9:16 pm

by DutchMountains

Agree with Stalkan, that's a nice looking frame!

And about 200 grams lighter than the On-One Bish Bash Bosh...

Did £550 include the seat post? Also, is that a BB86 bottom bracket? From the earlier pictures I assumed it was BSA (which I would actually prefer, after hearing so many horror stories with creaking floorboards ehhh press fit bb's).

amey
Posts: 208
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:09 am

by amey

DutchMountains wrote:Agree with Stalkan, that's a nice looking frame!

And about 200 grams lighter than the On-One Bish Bash Bosh...

Did £550 include the seat post? Also, is that a BB86 bottom bracket? From the earlier pictures I assumed it was BSA (which I would actually prefer, after hearing so many horror stories with creaking floorboards ehhh press fit bb's).


Yep seatpost included. Thats 193g. Its pressfit BB, they are ok compared to other standards I think. I asked it only comes in pressfit.

UpFromOne
Posts: 800
Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 5:23 am
Location: Olympic Nat'l Park, WA

by UpFromOne

Then what's the biggest tire without fenders?
47c is only 1.85.

That frame = bang for the buck.

And as for any press fit BB, just smear the cups with Loctite 641 and no creaks.

amey
Posts: 208
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:09 am

by amey

UpFromOne wrote:Then what's the biggest tire without fenders?
47c is only 1.85.

That frame = bang for the buck.

And as for any press fit BB, just smear the cups with Loctite 641 and no creaks.


I havent experimented but I'd go with 47c as what they recommend. From that pic you can tell that there is space at the front (with mudguards) but not sure about the 'bulge' if you know what I mean.

Will I be able to get the cups off if I use Loctite?

Post Reply