1x Campagnolo Ekar drivetrain

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andreszucs
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by andreszucs

I’m also enjoying my Ekar 9-42, and is electronic, and I’m using an XX1 derailleur, and I’m using a SRAM Red AXS flat top chain! Smooth and precise shifting every time!
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bobrayner
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by bobrayner

The SRAM flat-top chain is an interesting idea!

Has anyone had any experience (or problems) with third-party chain tools? Campagnolo make an ekar-specific one, but it's fiendishly expensive.

I assume that, if using quick links, the tool is only for splitting, so there is less potential for something to go wrong if pressing out a chain pin using a tool that's too a fraction of a millimetre too deep...
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andreszucs
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by andreszucs

bobrayner wrote:The SRAM flat-top chain is an interesting idea!

Has anyone had any experience (or problems) with third-party chain tools? Campagnolo make an ekar-specific one, but it's fiendishly expensive.

I assume that, if using quick links, the tool is only for splitting, so there is less potential for something to go wrong if pressing out a chain pin using a tool that's too a fraction of a millimetre too deep...
The sram flat top chain was definitely a step up from the prior chain I was trying wish was a traditional 12 speed. I’m not sure if it would work with campy mechanical shifting because the space is tight (Ekar chain is narrower), but with the Xshifter I can micro adjust the position of the chain over each cog, and since the AXS chain is also completely flat also on the sides, this shifting is super quiet. It’s working really well.




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itsacarr
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by itsacarr

Can you explain that whole setup for us?? Clever indeed.

pritish8287
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by pritish8287

Hi,
Does anyone know if shimano funnel will work with Campagnolo brake lever? Are the threads the same?Image


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andreszucs
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by andreszucs

itsacarr wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 3:03 pm
Can you explain that whole setup for us?? Clever indeed.
Back in January I had the proof of concept sorted, apparently I was the only one excited about the compatibility between an AXS chain and the EKar cassette:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=165029&p=1643527#p1643527

Even if the AXS chain is slightly thicker than the EKar chain, back in January I could see how it could work just fine with an external wireless system like the Xshifter or the Archer components, because It's possible to micro adjust the position of the chain. Piggybacking on that, ANY rear derailleur can be used, and voila!

Considerations: Campagnolo hit the nail in the head with the Ekar cogs choice, but poor execution. Nothing justifies 393g to make a 9-42 13sp cassette when E13 made a 298g 11sp 9-46.I'm only using the Ekar because is the only one in the market right now addressing Road use of high range cassettes. I already sent a message to E13 challenging them to make a 13sp cassette line-up, I can think of variations such as 9-42 / 9-46 / 9-50 with small steps on the small cogs 9-10-11-12-13-14-16-18...., but about 100g lighter than the Ekar, I think they can do it.
Last edited by andreszucs on Mon Jun 28, 2021 5:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

andrewbn42
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by andrewbn42

Has anybody tried ekar shifters with the flat top chain? That would open up a wider array of chainring sizes, which I would appreciate

raggedtrousers
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by raggedtrousers

andreszucs wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:25 pm
itsacarr wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 3:03 pm
Can you explain that whole setup for us?? Clever indeed.
Back in January I had the proof of concept sorted, apparently I was the only one excited about the compatibility between an AXS chain and the EKar cassette:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=165029&p=1643527#p1643527

Even if the AXS chain is slightly thicker than the EKar chain, back in January I could see how it could work just fine with an external wireless system like the Xshifter or the Archer components, because It's possible to micro adjust the position of the chain. Piggybacking on that, ANY rear derailleur can be used, and voila!

Considerations: Campagnolo hit the nail in the head with the Ekar cogs choice, but poor execution. Nothing justifies 393g to make a 9-42 13sp cassette when E13 made a 298g 11sp 9-46.I'm only using the Ekar because is the only one in the market right now addressing Road use of high range cassettes. I already sent a message to E13 challenging them to make a 13sp cassette line-up, I can think of variations such as 9-42 / 9-46 / 9-50 with small steps on the small cogs 9-10-11-12-13-14-16-18...., but about 100g lighter than the Ekar, I think they can do it.
So am I right in thinking that you are running an AXS Eagle rear mech, AXS chain, chainring and road shifters, but just the Ekar 13sp cassette for an electronic 1x13 setup? If so, this is a very cool idea...

andrewbn42
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by andrewbn42

andreszucs wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:25 pm
itsacarr wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 3:03 pm
Can you explain that whole setup for us?? Clever indeed.
Back in January I had the proof of concept sorted, apparently I was the only one excited about the compatibility between an AXS chain and the EKar cassette:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=165029&p=1643527#p1643527

Even if the AXS chain is slightly thicker than the EKar chain, back in January I could see how it could work just fine with an external wireless system like the Xshifter or the Archer components, because It's possible to micro adjust the position of the chain. Piggybacking on that, ANY rear derailleur can be used, and voila!

Considerations: Campagnolo hit the nail in the head with the Ekar cogs choice, but poor execution. Nothing justifies 393g to make a 9-42 13sp cassette when E13 made a 298g 11sp 9-46.I'm only using the Ekar because is the only one in the market right now addressing Road use of high range cassettes. I already sent a message to E13 challenging them to make a 13sp cassette line-up, I can think of variations such as 9-42 / 9-46 / 9-50 with small steps on the small cogs 9-10-11-12-13-14-16-18...., but about 100g lighter than the Ekar, I think they can do it.
How many miles on this setup/ how much have you test it? I didn’t see the previous thread, but I am quite interested. I am intrigued, and would be interested in getting those ekar cassette jumps for a nice road setup.

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andreszucs
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by andreszucs

raggedtrousers wrote:
Mon Jun 28, 2021 8:27 pm
andreszucs wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:25 pm
itsacarr wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 3:03 pm
Can you explain that whole setup for us?? Clever indeed.
Back in January I had the proof of concept sorted, apparently I was the only one excited about the compatibility between an AXS chain and the EKar cassette:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=165029&p=1643527#p1643527

Even if the AXS chain is slightly thicker than the EKar chain, back in January I could see how it could work just fine with an external wireless system like the Xshifter or the Archer components, because It's possible to micro adjust the position of the chain. Piggybacking on that, ANY rear derailleur can be used, and voila!

Considerations: Campagnolo hit the nail in the head with the Ekar cogs choice, but poor execution. Nothing justifies 393g to make a 9-42 13sp cassette when E13 made a 298g 11sp 9-46.I'm only using the Ekar because is the only one in the market right now addressing Road use of high range cassettes. I already sent a message to E13 challenging them to make a 13sp cassette line-up, I can think of variations such as 9-42 / 9-46 / 9-50 with small steps on the small cogs 9-10-11-12-13-14-16-18...., but about 100g lighter than the Ekar, I think they can do it.
So am I right in thinking that you are running an AXS Eagle rear mech, AXS chain, chainring and road shifters, but just the Ekar 13sp cassette for an electronic 1x13 setup? If so, this is a very cool idea...
No, it's a Sram XX1 (non Eagle) rear derailleur (it was designed to handle 42T), shifter came with the Xshifter, its the road version https://cell-cycling.com/product/mini-pod/, super small and can be neatly installed on any bar type.

Just a heads up: The X-shifter app still needs to be updated (not yet released) for 13 speeds for iOs, on Android it sounds like is already supporting 13 speeds. Archer components is already offering 13 speeds on both platforms is what I understand.
Last edited by andreszucs on Tue Jun 29, 2021 4:55 am, edited 2 times in total.

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andreszucs
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by andreszucs

andrewbn42 wrote:
Mon Jun 28, 2021 8:46 pm
andreszucs wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:25 pm
itsacarr wrote:
Sat Jun 26, 2021 3:03 pm
Can you explain that whole setup for us?? Clever indeed.
Back in January I had the proof of concept sorted, apparently I was the only one excited about the compatibility between an AXS chain and the EKar cassette:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=165029&p=1643527#p1643527

Even if the AXS chain is slightly thicker than the EKar chain, back in January I could see how it could work just fine with an external wireless system like the Xshifter or the Archer components, because It's possible to micro adjust the position of the chain. Piggybacking on that, ANY rear derailleur can be used, and voila!

Considerations: Campagnolo hit the nail in the head with the Ekar cogs choice, but poor execution. Nothing justifies 393g to make a 9-42 13sp cassette when E13 made a 298g 11sp 9-46.I'm only using the Ekar because is the only one in the market right now addressing Road use of high range cassettes. I already sent a message to E13 challenging them to make a 13sp cassette line-up, I can think of variations such as 9-42 / 9-46 / 9-50 with small steps on the small cogs 9-10-11-12-13-14-16-18...., but about 100g lighter than the Ekar, I think they can do it.
How many miles on this setup/ how much have you test it? I didn’t see the previous thread, but I am quite interested. I am intrigued, and would be interested in getting those ekar cassette jumps for a nice road setup.
Little miles so far, about 60. but I did some steep hill climbs to test the AXS chain vs Ekar cassette marriage under big loads and I'm super happy with it, smooth and quiet shifting.

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bobrayner
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by bobrayner

Has anyone experienced premature wear problems? I've just set up a bike, experimented with different gear options, and the chainring bolts are already slightly worn (Some of the faces of Torx teeth look scuffed, and black coating is coming off the area around the socket where it might have been touched by the Torx driver). My first instinct is that the bolts are wearing like aluminium, but they feel like steel.

Otherwise, I like the bolt design - happy to see OEMs moving away from old-style chainring bolts.
morrisond wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:37 am
bm0p700f wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 11:56 pm
As i pointed out 12 speed narrow wide rings dont work with the 13 speed chain. The chain simply does not fit over the teeth.
Have you or anyione you know actually tried it though? .15mm is really not a lot.
I have tried it with an aftermarket chainring, and I can confirm that it didn't fit. I think the difference is more than .15mm (still small, but more than .15mm). Either use an OEM Ekar chainring, or choose an aftermarket vendor who explicitly says their chainring is 13-speed compatible!

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andreszucs
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by andreszucs

bobrayner wrote:
Wed Jun 30, 2021 12:29 pm
I have tried it with an aftermarket chainring, and I can confirm that it didn't fit. I think the difference is more than .15mm (still small, but more than .15mm). Either use an OEM Ekar chainring, or choose an aftermarket vendor who explicitly says their chainring is 13-speed compatible!
Image
Just throw a SRAM AXS chain, and expand your chainring options. Here is a video of my setup:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJZ2Hv0MwjY
Note that for now, my Xshifter app can only shift 12sp on iOS (13sp on Android already). While I wait for the update, I can individually adjust the RD position to shift whatever cog I want, choosing to skip the 36t for now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzaTiJEzxsM
Last edited by andreszucs on Thu Jul 01, 2021 4:13 am, edited 3 times in total.

gwerziou
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by gwerziou

I have zero interest in Xshifter, but the proposed use of a flat-top chain on Ekar is intriguing. I have read elsewhere that an AXS chain will most definitely not work for Ekar... But is that true? Will an AXS flat-top chain work on an otherwise stock Ekar drivetrain? If so, does it work well, or skip? Excessive drivetrain wear?

I'm sure the stock Campy chain is great so it's not a driving factor per se, but the flat-top opens up the possibility of using, let's say, a third party crankset like Easton or whatever with a chainring that fits a flat-top chain.

Third party chainring companies have been oddly slow to provide chainrings that work with Ekar. One would hope that Wolftooth or Absolute Black would get on the ball and get some new product out in this area.
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andreszucs
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by andreszucs

gwerziou wrote:
Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:28 pm
I have zero interest in Xshifter, but the proposed use of a flat-top chain on Ekar is intriguing. I have read elsewhere that an AXS chain will most definitely not work for Ekar... But is that true? Will an AXS flat-top chain work on an otherwise stock Ekar drivetrain? If so, does it work well, or skip? Excessive drivetrain wear?
I tried showing in the video (post right above) that shifting is very smooth and ramps well between cogs. Since I never tried the AXS chain with the rest of the EKAR mechanical components, I can't speak for that. The question is: Since the AXS chain is slightly thicker compared to the EKAR chain, would it compromise precision between cogs and maybe accidental skips if used with the mechanical Campy shifters? with the Xshifter, I can micro adjust the position on top of each cog ensuring precision all across the cassette.

The only reason they say the AXS chain won't work with EKAR might be because the upper pulley on the Ekar RD is narrow wide or the teeth are not recessed enough to give room for the Flat top chaing plates, it just needs to be replaced by a standard pulley.

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