Shimano Dura-Ace 9000 Series - 11sp

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
Post Reply
VNTech
Posts: 195
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 8:08 pm

by VNTech

Two quick notes on the disc brake question:

1) braking on carbon rims sucks. Period, end of story. It's downright dangerous in the wet. (there's your catalyst for a change)
2) If you think a road/cx disc brake is going to be set up with the same power as a mtb disc, you're nuts. The limiter, both on dirt with huge tires and on a road with tiny tires, is contact patch. Engineers know that, and they are bright people. They won't create a road disc that locks up with a light squeeze. The advantage of discs will be their consistent modulation (specifically tuned for the smaller tires) regardless of length of descent or weather.

Will the first ones be any good? Probably not. But the Hayes HFX Mag wasn't particularly good either, and look where we are now.
VeloNews Magazine/VeloNews.com tech

by Weenie


andyindo
Posts: 395
Joined: Tue May 12, 2009 10:03 am

by andyindo

Colin wrote:All the same arguments that mountain bikers used...10 years from now you'll be asking how you even rode without disc's.


Maybe 20years from now :D

celeste55
Posts: 95
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:08 am

by celeste55

I find it super hard to even process all of the Shimano innovation in the last few months. Electric ultegra Di2, and then 11sp. Then they're going to have to make all the electric 11sp. Makes me feel bad for a cousin who just loaded up some Ultegra Di2 on a cross bike last week. Never ending cycle.

I kind of doubt this means change to rear wheel spacing.
Last edited by celeste55 on Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
There is nothing lighter than a hole

User avatar
euan
Posts: 1493
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:20 am

by euan

http://bicycling.com/blogs/thisjustin/2 ... shimano-11" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Going to a 4 bolt spider. You boys better stop moaning about discs.
"Step forward the climber and all those who worship at the altar of lightness" - R. Millar

User avatar
prendrefeu
Posts: 8609
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2007 10:32 pm
Location: Los Feliz, Los Angeles, California
Contact:

by prendrefeu

yourdaguy wrote:Also, this is WW and I can see no scenario under which you can build a road bike with disc brakes that is even close to the weight of a rim brake bike especially when you factor in all the changes to the frame, fork, wheel and the fact that the discs weigh something and the calipers are heavier; etc., etc. And then we have to talk about aero.


Thank you.
Exp001 || Other projects in the works.

User avatar
tommasini
Posts: 1296
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 6:48 am
Location: Central USA
Contact:

by tommasini

Good summary from Bicycling mag - key items being debated here may be put to rest (for now)

130 mm rear spacing unchanged
"direct mount" calipers are not a disc brake version but rather TT version of rim brakes
24 mm spindle on the crank remains
10 speed cassettes will work on the 11 speed freehub

Maybe for once their cog spacing and campy's will line up?
Last edited by tommasini on Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

airwise
Posts: 1049
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2010 8:31 pm

by airwise

roca rule wrote:@airwise
But the rim had to be beefier at the spoke holes
On pavement I have not seen a mountain bike that goes down as fast as a road bike.
On a mountain bike they work because you have a larger contract patch.
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk


Does my X317 or Stans 340 weigh more than a Mavic 231?

I'll race you down from Alpe d'Huez in the wet. You can ride with Zipp firecrests - I'll go for some discs. I'll put good money on my winning with ease.

On a mountain bike they work because they have fabulous modulation and control. Power is a side issue. V brakes could lock up a mountain bike in the dry no problem.

spartan
Posts: 1107
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 2:52 am

by spartan

great work by bicycling.

bad news for sram. imho 11speed is pure marketing BUT marketing sells at retail. 11 is better than 10. electronic >> mechanical


Beyond the additional cog, there are few details about the new group in the internal document. However, industry insiders filled in some specifics for us. (If you’re wondering, our moles also tell us that a new SRAM Red group will be unveiled soon, but it remains at 10 speeds.)
Current Rides:

2017 Giant TCR Advanced SL 0 DI2 9150

andyindo
Posts: 395
Joined: Tue May 12, 2009 10:03 am

by andyindo

tommasini wrote:Good summary from Bicycling mag - key items being debated here may be put to rest (for now)

130 mm rear spacing unchanged
"direct mount" calipers are not a disc brake version but rather TT version of rim brakes
24 mm spindle on the crank remains
10 speed cassettes will work on the 11 speed freehub

Maybe for once their cog spacing and campy's will line up?


You used to be able to run 10s shimano on a 10s campy drivetrain..Who knows, maybe we'll be able to do this again!

User avatar
BeeBee30
Posts: 1473
Joined: Sun Dec 21, 2003 8:32 pm
Location: WALES,UK
Contact:

by BeeBee30

So a direct mount TT brake is essentially the U-brake I had mounted by the bottom bracket on my GT mountain bike 20 odd years ago? Thats progress :D
Ti or dye!

The Weenie formally known as CAADHEAD

Epic-o
Posts: 621
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:18 pm

by Epic-o

1908gr, now SRAM has to do something

JensW
Posts: 763
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 9:41 pm
Location: Uppsala, Sweden

by JensW

Epic-o wrote:1908gr, now SRAM has to do something



but if you read it, they say "The mechanical group’s weight is claimed at 1,908 grams, a 67-gram reduction from Dura-Ace 7900.", since when are the weight of DA7900 1975 grams? :D

justkeepedaling
Posts: 1340
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:14 am
Location: by Crystal Springs (Sawyer Creek Trail)

by justkeepedaling

I think that's a miscalculation of the weight savings. But really, it doesn't make sense for 9000 to weigh as much as 7900. There was a lot of room to cut weight. 1908 grams would be fantastic. Narrower hoods is also a big + for me. Even better front shifting! Likely better braking. Count me impressed, Shimano

User avatar
euan
Posts: 1493
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:20 am

by euan

I wonder if the 4 bold crank spider will give a decent weight saving.
"Step forward the climber and all those who worship at the altar of lightness" - R. Millar

by Weenie


roca rule
Posts: 678
Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:23 am
Location: so. cal.

by roca rule

Ok airwave
How much does the lightest 29er wheel set weights?
Compare that to the lightest Wheel set for road.
you obviously don't know my descending skills, and neither do I know yours. Would you say that you can descent faster on a mountain bike than on a road bike?

Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post