Addict RC 2025

[TobinHatesYou]

Yeah you're right about the math. Just makes it even more unfriendly. To be honest I was so shocked when I first saw foil's geometry table and this new addict is doing the exact same thing. While foil can go with a ton of spacers and still look actually fine, I don't know if it works on this addict. Their crazy reach might be somehow compensated by a zero setback seatpost and a more front-leaning riding position, which I don't dare try on my own bike unless I get a new fit with the fitter.

The real irony here is that even the non-RC Addict is too aggressive most. It's longer and lower than the SuperSix Evo in most sizes.

That's where the complaints should be focused. The RC should be MORE aggressive and the non-RC should be LESS aggressive. More people get the bike they actually want...everybody wins.

[pmprego]

Yeah you're right about the math. Just makes it even more unfriendly. To be honest I was so shocked when I first saw foil's geometry table and this new addict is doing the exact same thing. While foil can go with a ton of spacers and still look actually fine, I don't know if it works on this addict. Their crazy reach might be somehow compensated by a zero setback seatpost and a more front-leaning riding position, which I don't dare try on my own bike unless I get a new fit with the fitter.

The real irony here is that even the non-RC Addict is too aggressive most. It's longer and lower than the SuperSix Evo in most sizes.

That's where the complaints should be focused. The RC should be MORE aggressive and the non-RC should be LESS aggressive. More people get the bike they actually want...everybody wins.

You're right about the geometry.

But then this non rc has 420mm chainstay, not the 410mm the rc has. The frame is some 50% heavier. There goes the appeal.

Again... It's their financials, I just don't know the financials, but if companies are having to reduce SKUs and models, they should be focusing where their market is. If it's the racing, so let it be. Make it racing.

[TobinHatesYou]

You're right about the geometry.

But then this non rc has 420mm chainstay, not the 410mm the rc has. The frame is some 50% heavier. There goes the appeal.

Again... It's their financials, I just don't know the financials, but if companies are having to reduce SKUs and models, they should be focusing where their market is. If it's the racing, so let it be. Make it racing.

The problem is the fickle poseur community is going to want what pros ride. If pros are reduced to riding weird pro-only bikes like the Domane RSL, then the public is going to want to ride that too. If you make the Addict RC for "Real People" then all of a sudden those same "Real People" aren't going to want it anymore.

[EddyTwerckx]

Unfortunately, this new geo is too long for me as Amateur.
Sorry, Scott. May be if you offer different cockpit sizes right from teh beginning, but not in this standard config.

And if they made the reach shorter, the bike would be even lighter

They made their bike, their racing bike. Now the market will respond.

@tobin people can use a riser stem/handlebar but may not like the looks of it (not to mention compatibility - a racing bikes has to optimized for racing thus not very much into standard components and compatible with many things).

Right now scott has 2 different racing bikes. Market and time will decide if this approach survives. I also wonder how many paris-roubaix does specialized still sells. I also don't see a market for the aethos with that geo. But I don't have their sales information. They are the brands, they make the decisions, and have to assume responsability for it with their shareholders. All good.

We need to normalize positive rise stems and riser bars. They make it possible to have racy geometry for those that need it but people without the ability to ride one are still able to ride the same bike. And this is also why companies need to not use proprietary front ends. They'll never offer as many possibilities as being able to use standard components would.

Interestingly enough, Cannondale offers a positive rise Conceal stem for the SuperSix. Which is already a good cm taller in stack than most race bikes.

[EddyTwerckx]

The question is why they don´t sell a bike which fits the 95% nomal people and the 5% pro- and semi-pro racers need to change parts?
Instead they sell a bike which fits the 5% and doesn´t fir the 95%.
Do they really think I will buy a non-fitting bike for 13.000 EUR and then spend on top money to swap parts to make it fit?

I'd already be using a 170mm/-16deg Velobike Elite Longboi on a 52cm Addict RC just like I use on my 54cm Domane RSL. On something like a Domane SLR, I'd be using a theoretical 200mm/-30deg stem. I wouldn't be able to get low because the steerer would be piercing my sternum. While most racers haven’t gone this extreme yet, we are definitely progressing to a point where a 54/medium sized race bike should have 415-420mm reach instead of the 384-390mm reach we typically see.

Scott doesn't need to make the Addict RC taller, they actually need to make it longer and also come out with an updated non-RC version with a more upright STR ratio.

I'm not arguing that you don't need what you need. But you have to recognize that you are an extreme outlier (I know .. using two words that are somewhat equivalente just to reinforce my case).

What I see people riding is bikes with 40-45mm spacers height and still being very long (for instance... No way using the drops or a puppy paw posture). It's extremely rare to see a slammed 120mm stem (I actually cant remember a illustrative example around me).

The majority of people need more relaxed bikes. Somehow manufacturers have been able to get by selling them bikes they shouldn't be riding.

Did you not read beyond the first sentence of my reply? I admit that I am and outlier, but you almost must admit that actual race fits are getting more aggressive. Look at van Schip, Hesters, Sam Boardman, Jonas Rutsch, etc. These guys are just the early adopters, more will follow.

It's crazy-talk to cry about how the Addict RC has to be taller when the non-RC update will presumably be the exact bike you all are clamoring for. The non-RC Addict exists. The Dogma X exists. The Endurace exists. These are all no-compromise "racey" bikes with more forgiving STR. Why is everyone so adamant that race bikes need to disappear?

I disagree with the fit part and pros. I think if anything, we're seeing more and more pros use spacers under their stems. It seems like being comfortable for 5 hour stages is faster than being low and killing yourself for little aero gain. The guys you mention are breakaway guys so of course they're going to optimize a specific fit for their racing style. But look at Gaudu and Merlier just off the top of my head, but I know there are others. And part of the reason you're seeing longer stems is slammed forward saddles and steeper seattube angles, which this Addict gets in the smaller sizes but the larger ones are not that steep.

[TobinHatesYou]

Yeah you're right about the math. Just makes it even more unfriendly. To be honest I was so shocked when I first saw foil's geometry table and this new addict is doing the exact same thing. While foil can go with a ton of spacers and still look actually fine, I don't know if it works on this addict. Their crazy reach might be somehow compensated by a zero setback seatpost and a more front-leaning riding position, which I don't dare try on my own bike unless I get a new fit with the fitter.

The real irony here is that even the non-RC Addict is too aggressive most. It's longer and lower than the SuperSix Evo in most sizes.

That's where the complaints should be focused. The RC should be MORE aggressive and the non-RC should be LESS aggressive. More people get the bike they actually want...everybody wins.

You're right about the geometry.

But then this non rc has 420mm chainstay, not the 410mm the rc has. The frame is some 50% heavier. There goes the appeal.

Again... It's their financials, I just don't know the financials, but if companies are having to reduce SKUs and models, they should be focusing where their market is. If it's the racing, so let it be. Make it racing.

If you’re sitting more upright your center of mass moves rearward. While the non-RC Addict was designed for wider tires, the longer chainstay indirectly helps preserve front-rear weight balance.

So what I’m saying is make the non-RC Addict Ultimate with HMX-SL carbon. Make it exactly like the Addict RC except give 1.5:1 STR. Isn't that a better option than turning the Addict RC into a short wheelbase Addict?

[TobinHatesYou]

I disagree with the fit part and pros. I think if anything, we're seeing more and more pros use spacers under their stems. It seems like being comfortable for 5 hour stages is faster than being low and killing yourself for little aero gain. The guys you mention are breakaway guys so of course they're going to optimize a specific fit for their racing style. But look at Gaudu and Merlier just off the top of my head, but I know there are others. And part of the reason you're seeing longer stems is slammed forward saddles and steeper seattube angles, which this Addict gets in the smaller sizes but the larger ones are not that steep.

Okay so Gaudu, a pure climber, is running spacers on a race bike. What's the problem here? Seriously?

[EddyTwerckx]

Yeah you're right about the math. Just makes it even more unfriendly. To be honest I was so shocked when I first saw foil's geometry table and this new addict is doing the exact same thing. While foil can go with a ton of spacers and still look actually fine, I don't know if it works on this addict. Their crazy reach might be somehow compensated by a zero setback seatpost and a more front-leaning riding position, which I don't dare try on my own bike unless I get a new fit with the fitter.

The real irony here is that even the non-RC Addict is too aggressive most. It's longer and lower than the SuperSix Evo in most sizes.

That's where the complaints should be focused. The RC should be MORE aggressive and the non-RC should be LESS aggressive. More people get the bike they actually want...everybody wins.

You're right about the geometry.

But then this non rc has 420mm chainstay, not the 410mm the rc has. The frame is some 50% heavier. There goes the appeal.

Again... It's their financials, I just don't know the financials, but if companies are having to reduce SKUs and models, they should be focusing where their market is. If it's the racing, so let it be. Make it racing.

make the non-RC Addict Ultimate with HMX-SL carbon. Make it exactly like the Addict RC except give 1.5:1 STR.

That's literally what people are saying. I think you're getting it now.

[EtoDemerzel]

Addict RC is a race bike. it's got race geo.
Where is the outrage over Aethos geo being the same as the Tarmac?

And if you don't fit, you don't fit. Get a different bike

[EddyTwerckx]

I disagree with the fit part and pros. I think if anything, we're seeing more and more pros use spacers under their stems. It seems like being comfortable for 5 hour stages is faster than being low and killing yourself for little aero gain. The guys you mention are breakaway guys so of course they're going to optimize a specific fit for their racing style. But look at Gaudu and Merlier just off the top of my head, but I know there are others. And part of the reason you're seeing longer stems is slammed forward saddles and steeper seattube angles, which this Addict gets in the smaller sizes but the larger ones are not that steep.

Okay so Gaudu, a pure climber, is running spacers on a race bike. What's the problem here? Seriously?

Okay so Boardman, a pure breakaway guy, is using a long stem on a race bike. What's the problem here? Seriously?

Not much of a point. Not to mention you left out Merlier, a pure sprinter, who's sole job is to go as fast as possible, is running a bunch of spacers. But no, all the pros are going super long and low according to you. SMH.

[EddyTwerckx]

Where is the outrage over Aethos geo being the same as the Tarmac?

Have you missed the hundreds of posts that fit this description? That point was brought up in this thread actually.

[EtoDemerzel]

Where is the outrage over Aethos geo being the same as the Tarmac?

Have you missed the hundreds of posts that fit this description? That point was brought up in this thread actually.

yeah bc it's a weird thing to rage about. It's like raging because a shoe size doesn't fit you.

[Pierre86]

Did you not read beyond the first sentence of my reply? I admit that I am and outlier, but you almost must admit that actual race fits are getting more aggressive. Look at van Schip, Hesters, Sam Boardman, Jonas Rutsch, etc. These guys are just the early adopters, more will follow.

Willem is the only real early adopter here, he wants a road pursuit position.
Heaters just sits very far forward, Boardman/Rutch have short legs/long torso builds.

Most WT fits have come up and in, there's more spacers than ever in the pro ranks.

[TobinHatesYou]

That's literally what people are saying. I think you're getting it now.

Nah people are outraged that the RC isn't the bike for them when they should be complaining that the non-RC isn't the bike for them.

Race bikes shouldn't be deleted from existence just because the average adult can't touch their toes.

Okay so Boardman, a pure breakaway guy, is using a long stem on a race bike. What's the problem here? Seriously?

Not much of a point. Not to mention you left out Merlier, a pure sprinter, who's sole job is to go as fast as possible, is running a bunch of spacers. But no, all the pros are going super long and low according to you. SMH.

The problem is we can make a size range that fits both Boardman and Gaudu, whereas you seemingly want a bike that fits Boardman even worse. It looks like Gaudu has 3cm worth of spacers on his Verticale. He could easily swap from a size S to an M, swap from a 110mm stem to a 100mm one and lose half of those spacers. Now imagine Boardman on a SuperSix Evo or a Time AdH, he'd have to size down and run an even longer stem. That Argon 18 Sum Pro he rides is already more aggressive than pretty much any other western brand's offerings.

Plus there's the whole issue with the riders I mentioned being beyond 50:50 front:rear weight balance.

[ichobi]

Where is the outrage over Aethos geo being the same as the Tarmac?

Have you missed the hundreds of posts that fit this description? That point was brought up in this thread actually.

yeah bc it's a weird thing to rage about. It's like raging because a shoe size doesn't fit you.

I don't think anyone rage about it. I raised the point about the Aethos having a tarmac fit in this thread and that it's somewhat disjointed to what the bike try to represent. it's just my opinion. Conceptually, aesthetically, the aethos isn't presented as a race bike so to many (including me) it feels weird to have quite aggressive geometry. It's okay to raise point when things don't conceptually fit? I mean it still sells well. It would have sold even better if the stack is a tad taller.

I might even be correct re the aethos. Ask someone who has seen '25/'26 specialized lineup.

This is beside the point though. We can agree that the Addict geometry is rather extreme.