Wasn't disagreeing with you either. P
2024 product release rumors
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TobinHatesYou
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howaboutme wrote: ↑Sun Dec 08, 2024 7:22 pmI agree. I'm personally not worried about it. So I pay a few bucks more for odds and ends and maybe a hundred or so more for the more expensive items. Cycling is not buying groceries. You get to make a choice.
Except we import a lot of foodstuffs from around the world? The US imports about $100B in agricultural products from Canada and Mexico annually. China is the lifeline for the American soybean market. Mexico makes John Deere farming equipment. The US imported almost $200B in energy from Canada last year.
If you don’t think blanket tariffs will affect the price of eggs, I’ve got a bridge to sell you.
Plus what about your average mom&pop shoe store/cobbler in the middle of Iowa that is reliant on selling Nike, Adidas, UnderArmour, etc. shoes? How will they afford groceries after they go out of business?
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howaboutme
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Listen, I'm not going to dismiss your comment because it is not irrelevant. But I chose to control what I can control. Worrying less = less stress for me, maybe for you too.TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Sun Dec 08, 2024 10:11 pmhowaboutme wrote: ↑Sun Dec 08, 2024 7:22 pmI agree. I'm personally not worried about it. So I pay a few bucks more for odds and ends and maybe a hundred or so more for the more expensive items. Cycling is not buying groceries. You get to make a choice.
Except we import a lot of foodstuffs from around the world? The US imports about $100B in agricultural products from Canada and Mexico annually. China is the lifeline for the American soybean market. Mexico makes John Deere farming equipment. The US imported almost $200B in energy from Canada last year.
If you don’t think blanket tariffs will affect the price of eggs, I’ve got a bridge to sell you.
Plus what about your average mom&pop shoe store/cobbler in the middle of Iowa that is reliant on selling Nike, Adidas, UnderArmour, etc. shoes? How will they afford groceries after they go out of business?
Even though this is OT and we should get back to the original topic of new products quickly again,
one should stay away from generalizing too much when saying Asia and taking China as synonym.
It is not that all Western brands' frames come from China. I have worked with plenty different top brands whose frames all came from Asia, not necessarily China though, plus we now also have the option of Portugal as can be seen from BikeAhead's hardtail or Simplon's Pavo - let alone smaller scale manufacturing from other Euopean countries (Germany, Italy, Switzerland, ..)
In my current job we source the frames from 4 different Asian countries, 1 of them indeed being China, 3 others however not. I have been to all of these factories and the working conditions in respectable companies are not as some people here come to assume. Admittedly one could argue this all was show for visitors, but we are in contact with the frame makers every single day and visit them every month, such a cover would hardly work.
Of course such companies as in the assumption still exist, but there are also others out there.
In some you'd even be surprised on the technological level, as technology has been brought in by Western brands or they have replicated Western standards on their own.
I have seen tons of Zedler test benches there as one example, clean room laminating. CNC cutters etc.
Having been involved in all VIAL evo rim brake frames that wheelsONfire kindly quoted I am very aware of the technologial possibilites, what methods and also materials to use and whilst there are still some subtle differences (that simply cannot be transferred to a mass production), the technological level is really high. That high (or copied) that I even found the exact model of clean room doors that we had back at ax, all over the place at one of the most-highly respected Asian frame makers.
As an evidence: After 4 custom frames rim brake frames (1 US, 3 German), me I am now also running an Asian SWorks and - oh wonder - a Chinese Intropy, because technologically they are simply convincing.
FWIW there are a couple different options for a brand to buy an Asian-made frame, such as [without claim of completeness]:
- design & purchase the moulds, set up and optimize the layup themselves
- design & purchase the moulds, let the supplier optimize the layup
- modify parts of existing (OEM) moulds (with or without change in layup)
- purchase OEM frame (with or without change in layup)
- own the frame maker etc.
one should stay away from generalizing too much when saying Asia and taking China as synonym.
It is not that all Western brands' frames come from China. I have worked with plenty different top brands whose frames all came from Asia, not necessarily China though, plus we now also have the option of Portugal as can be seen from BikeAhead's hardtail or Simplon's Pavo - let alone smaller scale manufacturing from other Euopean countries (Germany, Italy, Switzerland, ..)
In my current job we source the frames from 4 different Asian countries, 1 of them indeed being China, 3 others however not. I have been to all of these factories and the working conditions in respectable companies are not as some people here come to assume. Admittedly one could argue this all was show for visitors, but we are in contact with the frame makers every single day and visit them every month, such a cover would hardly work.
Of course such companies as in the assumption still exist, but there are also others out there.
In some you'd even be surprised on the technological level, as technology has been brought in by Western brands or they have replicated Western standards on their own.
I have seen tons of Zedler test benches there as one example, clean room laminating. CNC cutters etc.
Having been involved in all VIAL evo rim brake frames that wheelsONfire kindly quoted I am very aware of the technologial possibilites, what methods and also materials to use and whilst there are still some subtle differences (that simply cannot be transferred to a mass production), the technological level is really high. That high (or copied) that I even found the exact model of clean room doors that we had back at ax, all over the place at one of the most-highly respected Asian frame makers.
As an evidence: After 4 custom frames rim brake frames (1 US, 3 German), me I am now also running an Asian SWorks and - oh wonder - a Chinese Intropy, because technologically they are simply convincing.
FWIW there are a couple different options for a brand to buy an Asian-made frame, such as [without claim of completeness]:
- design & purchase the moulds, set up and optimize the layup themselves
- design & purchase the moulds, let the supplier optimize the layup
- modify parts of existing (OEM) moulds (with or without change in layup)
- purchase OEM frame (with or without change in layup)
- own the frame maker etc.
| works for an European bike manufacturer |
| Write less, ride more. |
| Write less, ride more. |
Back on topic.toxin wrote: ↑Sat Dec 07, 2024 3:06 pmFrom the look of social media, it seems the Quick Pro ER:One is in the middle of release in china https://v.douyin.com/iD32q7vb/
A raw carbon and white painted ER:One frameset in a medium/large looking size was weighted
980 g frame with hangers
451 g uncut white fork
188.5 g seatpost with hardware
72.5 g thru axles
21.5 g seatpost wedge
I think it's UDH, no luck finding a geo chart
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wheelbuilder
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This turned into a fantastic thread.
Never cheer before you know who is winning
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TobinHatesYou
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A size 58 SL8 has a 577 top tube
402 reach and 591 stack.
The Quick ER is 4mm longer and 2 cms lower.
It does not have the Geo of a regular 56.
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