I don't think anyone (reasonable!) is arguing that they're untrue, I think it's questionable the degree to which some of them matter. Slightly lighter and slightly more aero, for sure. A threaded BB is always nice, but BB86 with a Shimano crank is probably the best pressfit implementation out there. The integrated seatpost clamp looks slicker, but there's still nothing with a traditional external clamp. As for the beauty point, that's clearly subjective - some may find the Scott more beautiful! Personally $1500 is a lot of money and if I had to add up the ways the SL7 is "better" and put a price on them, so to speak, it wouldn't be close to that amount.eucalyptus wrote: ↑Mon Sep 19, 2022 3:19 pmAll the points Req110 mentioned in favor of SL7 > Scott is 100% valid.
Like there is no reason to argue against it, it is true!
Adding the fact that Venge and now SL7 are some of the most beautiful frames ever made.... Both aesthetically and performance-wise. One should have strong reasons to buy a Scott over any other brand if money is not an issue!
Scott Addict vs Spesh SL7
Moderator: robbosmans
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- wheelsONfire
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I would buy Addict any day over SL7. Only thing i really hate, is the BB86. Many frames use it and i question why (OD 41mm bearings over OD 42mm bearings is a no good idea). Smaller balls and durability is way lower.
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
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I have to admit that integrated bar looks way better than stock sl7 solution.
His: Orbea Orca OMX
Hers: Cannondale Synapse HM Disc
Hers: Cannondale Synapse HM Disc
You can use integrated bars on sl7 like farsports f1 or exs or deda alanera.
Bb86 with Shimano may not be that bad, but someone would prefer 30mm or 28.99mm crankset.
I am providing pros and cons, regardless of money.
Original poster has to calculate which pros and cons are important for him to justify additional cost.
Bb86 with Shimano may not be that bad, but someone would prefer 30mm or 28.99mm crankset.
I am providing pros and cons, regardless of money.
Original poster has to calculate which pros and cons are important for him to justify additional cost.
SW SL8 RTP 56cm @ 9270 / CLX II / CS OSPW / CEMA BB
S Epic 8 L @ XX T-Type / Berg Ratheberg 30 / Quarq / Fox Transfer SL 100mm / 3p
S Epic 8 L @ XX T-Type / Berg Ratheberg 30 / Quarq / Fox Transfer SL 100mm / 3p
Yeah, the scott mandatory brick stem or integrated bar is really nice. Especially if, for any reason, one needs something that scott doesn't really make (-12° stem or longer stem but narrow handlebar). Another awesome thing is if one needs to swap a damaged handlebar but there isn't any stock anywhere. Then it's really awesome to just put the bike on a corner and wait for whoever knows how long. I love that part.
Think I just found the 1,500 reasons between the two bikespmprego wrote: ↑Mon Sep 19, 2022 9:36 pmYeah, the scott mandatory brick stem or integrated bar is really nice. Especially if, for any reason, one needs something that scott doesn't really make (-12° stem or longer stem but narrow handlebar). Another awesome thing is if one needs to swap a damaged handlebar but there isn't any stock anywhere. Then it's really awesome to just put the bike on a corner and wait for whoever knows how long. I love that part.
Don't get me wrong, the addict rc is a good frame but proprietary parts like a stem it is stupid. For any brand. I guess the problem gets bigger for smaller brands that don't have such big inventory of replacement parts.
I just don't have the money to be replacing high end bikes every 3 years but I get the feeling (searching online I really get that feeling) that it starts to become relt hard to find replacement parts for the addict rc if the needs arise (I have an addict rc). That for me is now a deal breaker.
I'll never again be fooled by the "wow its really way cheaper than competition" - there is a reason they can make it cheaper, they have to reduce costs somewhere else (there really are no free lunches). Another way to reduce costs: specialized has life time warranty on the frame; scott has 2 years of warranty mandated by law.
I just don't have the money to be replacing high end bikes every 3 years but I get the feeling (searching online I really get that feeling) that it starts to become relt hard to find replacement parts for the addict rc if the needs arise (I have an addict rc). That for me is now a deal breaker.
I'll never again be fooled by the "wow its really way cheaper than competition" - there is a reason they can make it cheaper, they have to reduce costs somewhere else (there really are no free lunches). Another way to reduce costs: specialized has life time warranty on the frame; scott has 2 years of warranty mandated by law.
Oh. I forgot to add lifetime warranty for sl7. That's a huge dealbraker. Yup, also changing the stem without redoing cabling is really convenient.
SW SL8 RTP 56cm @ 9270 / CLX II / CS OSPW / CEMA BB
S Epic 8 L @ XX T-Type / Berg Ratheberg 30 / Quarq / Fox Transfer SL 100mm / 3p
S Epic 8 L @ XX T-Type / Berg Ratheberg 30 / Quarq / Fox Transfer SL 100mm / 3p
But people don't need to go specialized to get some of the benefits pointed here. Other brands have it. Not many and they are really getting shorter and shorter but there are still a few. I'm just saying that people do not realize the huge problem that is to live with proprietary stuff. I saw zero setback seatposts for the addict rc a couple of months after releasing (2020) but as soon as they went out-of-stock never again. It has been 2 years. Let's say that for some stupid reason I break my seatpost. What do I do? Put the bike to a corner and search for a carbon manufacturer to produce me one?
One can say: "oh... but many bikes have proprietary seatposts" I say: "correct, almost all nowadays but if you go to a big brand giant, specialized and maybe others, I dunno, they have spares." But spares cost money. That money is then reflected on the final product cost. It is what it is.
One can say: "oh... but many bikes have proprietary seatposts" I say: "correct, almost all nowadays but if you go to a big brand giant, specialized and maybe others, I dunno, they have spares." But spares cost money. That money is then reflected on the final product cost. It is what it is.
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for the last 3-4 years, owning spesh is like an extra bling factor, but in the last 18 months im starting to observe a new reputation for them at least in my cycling community: "people who like to fund the marketing department" lol.
Some say pour 10ml water out of your bottle to save that last bit of the weight. Sorry, i go one step further, i tend to the rider off my bikes.
n+1...14 last time i checked, but i lost count
n+1...14 last time i checked, but i lost count
- wheelsONfire
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- Location: NorthEU
Years ago it was RCA all over, then it was Cavendish Venge, and then if i remember correct it was Pinarello. A few years after, Pinarello wasn't getting to much win on the podium so i guess it was some other or was it Spesh directly? Anyway, people are so affected of what pro's ride so it's almost ridiculous.WorkonSunday wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 11:24 amfor the last 3-4 years, owning spesh is like an extra bling factor, but in the last 18 months im starting to observe a new reputation for them at least in my cycling community: "people who like to fund the marketing department" lol.
But the win goes to the hypocrites - Spesh - Aero is everything (let's kill Venge and makes something less aero voila SL7)
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
As someone who has had an Addict RC Ultimate (crashed), a lower spec Addict (current) and an SL7 (current) I'd go for the SL7 all things considered.
The integrated bar/stem on the addict looks good but is a pain in real life unless you get it dialled perfectly from the start. It's also not as comfortable as the SL7 on a day to day basis IMO.
I also find the servicing of the SL7 easier due to bar setup. Riding wise my SL7 feels better to me, but it is marginal and there is no difference between the two speed/aero wise on any of my regular routes which include 20min plus climbs plus a broad range of terrain.
If I hadn't crashed my RC ultimate I wouldn't have changed to SL7 but now I have it, it is my preference. Having said that I bought both largely off what I thought looked good, which as we all know is the most important thing!
The integrated bar/stem on the addict looks good but is a pain in real life unless you get it dialled perfectly from the start. It's also not as comfortable as the SL7 on a day to day basis IMO.
I also find the servicing of the SL7 easier due to bar setup. Riding wise my SL7 feels better to me, but it is marginal and there is no difference between the two speed/aero wise on any of my regular routes which include 20min plus climbs plus a broad range of terrain.
If I hadn't crashed my RC ultimate I wouldn't have changed to SL7 but now I have it, it is my preference. Having said that I bought both largely off what I thought looked good, which as we all know is the most important thing!
Not saying you're wrong about how strongly people are affected by marketing in their buying decisions and Spesh kit is winning a lot.... but despite wanting to fully believe in aero I think we all know that for most riders on most normal rides at normal speeds there is no real advantage to riding a full aero Venge Vias/SystemSix/S5, compared to a semi aero, but usually a bit lighter, SL7.wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 11:56 amYears ago it was RCA all over, then it was Cavendish Venge, and then if i remember correct it was Pinarello. A few years after, Pinarello wasn't getting to much win on the podium so i guess it was some other or was it Spesh directly? Anyway, people are so affected of what pro's ride so it's almost ridiculous.WorkonSunday wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 11:24 amfor the last 3-4 years, owning spesh is like an extra bling factor, but in the last 18 months im starting to observe a new reputation for them at least in my cycling community: "people who like to fund the marketing department" lol.
But the win goes to the hypocrites - Spesh - Aero is everything (let's kill Venge and makes something less aero voila SL7)
Manufacturers are catching onto this now, several years after Spesh, just look at the new Propel.
Giant Propel Advanced SL Red Etap 11s Easton EC90 wheels CeramicSpeed BB Zipp SL70 bars 6.5kg
Vitus ZX1 CRS Campy Chorus 12s Bora WTO 45 disk brake wheels Zipp SL70 bars 7.5kg
Vitus ZX1 CRS Campy Chorus 12s Bora WTO 45 disk brake wheels Zipp SL70 bars 7.5kg
SL8 build with Craft CS5060 Wheels in progress
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I don't think the concept is new. I think Spesh went in to the wall with Vias and had to do something different.Nickldn wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 12:20 pmNot saying you're wrong about how strongly people are affected by marketing in their buying decisions and Spesh kit is winning a lot.... but despite wanting to fully believe in aero I think we all know that for most riders on most normal rides at normal speeds there is no real advantage to riding a full aero Venge Vias/SystemSix/S5, compared to a semi aero, but usually a bit lighter, SL7.wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 11:56 amYears ago it was RCA all over, then it was Cavendish Venge, and then if i remember correct it was Pinarello. A few years after, Pinarello wasn't getting to much win on the podium so i guess it was some other or was it Spesh directly? Anyway, people are so affected of what pro's ride so it's almost ridiculous.WorkonSunday wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 11:24 amfor the last 3-4 years, owning spesh is like an extra bling factor, but in the last 18 months im starting to observe a new reputation for them at least in my cycling community: "people who like to fund the marketing department" lol.
But the win goes to the hypocrites - Spesh - Aero is everything (let's kill Venge and makes something less aero voila SL7)
Manufacturers are catching onto this now, several years after Spesh, just look at the new Propel.
They did SL7. They couldn't re-introduce a new bike right away. Next will be a new Venge (name might be something else). It's just ridiculous since Spesh has bombarded all that weight is secondary to aero.
Aero isn't everything all of a sudden. No shit! You either get a light and snappy bike or full aero. Or you go inbetween.
I personally believe it's sales propaganda from Spesh. Just wait until they release a new full blown aero bike. Guys here will probably want to buy that as their's for sure a new sales propaganda. We all would look at human psyche and see how much we absorb surroundings. Many think they have so much ideas of their own, but reading about how almost all humans handle input, you'll see.
There are few braking the norm. Most are very affected, how to think, behave, what we do and what we buy.
Anyway, If i would buy something radically different from what i have, it is a full blown aero.
All else in honesty, is just feeding an itch! I must try to be honest atleast to myself.
But then again, i was riding UP and ditched my road bike for 1 1/2 season riding only gravel. When i for some reason took the road bike one day, i was amazed of the nimbleness. It was madness, i just laughed and felt like a wild 7 year old kid again!
So much of a kid i bought Etap and also a new Vial EVO. Since then the UP has been more or less a commuter bike.
I have many times pondered this aero idea. But the weight and fact that they will be very different to ride has been making me staying off.
But again, i wouldn't buy SL7, Propel or those. I would go for S5 (but as you and all else say, the weight).
Either all in or i can just go for deeper wheels.
It's the only sensible thing from my perspective.
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓ Broad Selection ✓ Worldwide Delivery ✓
www.starbike.com
No, the points are not all true.eucalyptus wrote: ↑Mon Sep 19, 2022 3:19 pmAll the points Req110 mentioned in favor of SL7 > Scott is 100% valid.
Like there is no reason to argue against it, it is true!
Adding the fact that Venge and now SL7 are some of the most beautiful frames ever made.... Both aesthetically and performance-wise. One should have strong reasons to buy a Scott over any other brand if money is not an issue!
The rr1.5 stem allows for changing stem or spacers without needing to cut hoses. Only when using Creston IC SL integrated cockpit you have to cut hoses (as common with integrated cockpits). Drawback: Stem heavier - big issues for weight weenies counting micro-grams.
BB: personal preference. He didn't provide any proof.
Design: personal preference (I slightly prefer Scott, but like Spec, too)
Aero: True (however, SL7 tested with deeper rims, aerobar, less tire width, 160/140 discs). With better wheels scott tested 217W but here the Spec wins for sure). For most amateurs not averaging 45km/h less relevant.
Price: In favor of Scott. S-Works frame is 5200 Euros alone in Germany.
Wins: Irrelevant
System weight is higher with Scott.
I find the Spec rides harsher than the Scott. But here I prefer the Giant TCR Advanced SL over both. I don't mind the cables, too with the Giant, super easy to set up.
If I raced professionally, I would buy the Specialized (or new Scott Foil). Although I can afford it, I don't want to spend several thousand Euros more for a Specialized.
Last edited by HBike on Thu Nov 24, 2022 8:19 am, edited 1 time in total.