Latex vs tubeless

[Shmitt]

Can someone determine the differences between vittoria and challenge latex tubes? Except for the weight, of course.

[MikeD]

Can someone determine the differences between vittoria and challenge latex tubes? Except for the weight, of course.

I've used both and much prefer Vittoria. Challenge is thinner walled and got all wrinkled when they were in the tires for a while. I saw that when I replaced the tires. I didn't like the looks of that so I disposed of them. They are seamless and lighter, but no doubt more fragile.

[Roadrocket]

Question about Vittoria Latex inner tube size.

Sold my tubular wheelset and ordered clincher wheelset (inner width 19mm). Tires will be Michelin TT 23mm, their actual width on those rims should be anywhere between 24-25mm.
Should I buy 700x19-23c or 700x25-28 Vittoria tubes?

My guess is the bigger size should be a bit more puncture resistant due to probably thicker walls when inflated to same pressure.

So I ordered both sizes of Vittoria Competition Latex and here is how they look side by side. If it´s installed without problems, I´ll stick with the larger size. It should be less stretched so maybe a bit more puncture resistant than smaller size I guess.

Interestingly enough, they are both much lighter than advertised.

[Ravix]

I switched to latex about 4 weeks ago after 12 months of tubeless hell. I lost count of how many flats I had in that time, from Veloflex to Pirelli (p zero race and cinturato) to Vittoria N.EXT and Corsa it was just puncture after puncture and I've just had it. I know a lot of it had to do with just luck, but to hell with it if I'm THAT unlucky...
Knock on wood, been puncture free with 25mm GP5000+Vittoria latex 19-23 and the difference in ride feel and perception of speed going from TL to latex is absolutely sublime. I read a lot of people talking about it and I know it's hard to put in words, which I almost never try to, but it really is that good and I don't see myself going back from latex.

[NealH]

I've always had good luck with the 25mm GP5000 and Vittoria latex. Many moons ago I used the Michelin latex and they worked well too. I've seen too many issues with fellow riders on our club rides with tubless. I'm in Florida and junk washes off the road when it rains, the washes back on the road next time it rains. I used to incurr about one flat per month. But its much better now. Maybe my 5000/latex set up, or maybe streets are swept more often (which they are). Regardless, since its working for me, I don't plan on changing.

[C36]

Interestingly enough, they are both much lighter than advertised.

Indeed, I had a 25-28 at 69g (and I am sure it is not a 19-23, I have few of them) even if they usually come 74-77g

[Ravix]

Interestingly enough, they are both much lighter than advertised.

Indeed, I had a 25-28 at 69g (and I am sure it is not a 19-23, I have few of them) even if they usually come 74-77g

Just out of curiosity I checked a few of the 19-23s I have and they're 65-66g, which is a nice surprise if pretty irrelevant.

[BikeEatSleepRepeat]

Anyone really feel like (or see in their power numbers) tubless is noticeably faster?

RR of the best tubless tires is 7-8ish watts these days, with the best clinchers above 10.

Typically, you can come in a bit lighter running tubless, also.

I've always been a clincher/latex guy, but have tried tubless and can't say I felt faster at all (when on paper, I should have).

[MagicShite]

Anyone really feel like (or see in their power numbers) tubless is noticeably faster?

RR of the best tubless tires is 7-8ish watts these days, with the best clinchers above 10.

Typically, you can come in a bit lighter running tubless, also.

I've always been a clincher/latex guy, but have tried tubless and can't say I felt faster at all (when on paper, I should have).

IIRC, latex + fastest clincher equivalent comes up top, unless you don't use sealant at all.

Aerocoach's data especially highlights this.

You can still use latex with tubeless tires, such as corsa speeds and the GP5kTT, but then it wouldn't be a fair comparison.

[maxima]

If you want light, you use TPU tubes, you want comfort and fast, use latex. you want comfort low pressure and ride off the grid use tubeless. I've 6 wheelset and ride daily(high mileage as I've sort of retired and ride fulltime!) The issue is tubeless is of all the 10 different tubeless tyres i use, none will hold air over 24 hrs, you will need to pump before every ride! I use 60-80ml of sealant and it dries up very very fast if you don't use the wheel for a week(vacation). Tubeless is great if you are a pro and have a pro team of mechanic with you, else it just doesn;t adds up to make sense. I've submit some photos of my dry sealant and it weights down the tyre.my 60-80ml of sealant weights 30+g when dry up and I need to top up any 60ml to hold aire reasonably - loss of 5-10psi overnight. I love tubeless, but if you refer car tyres to our tubless tyres, our bicycle tubeless technology is still in it's early days......not much "real" tech to make it robust! We don;t add sealant to car tyres until u gets a flat!! And the tyres doesn;t leaks! you can't hold pressure for bicycle tubeless without sealant.....30ml is not enough, you need 60-80ml to seal a new tyre and set on rims!!! it dries up in 3-4 weeks and I top up.....in 3 months, I;ve additional 60-90grams of dry sealant in the tyre...............

[TheLuddite]

If you want light, you use TPU tubes, you want comfort and fast, use latex.

TPU tubes are testing as fast as latex and I am not noticing a comfort difference.
They also hold air longer if that matters. I check before each ride out of habit.
They are also much easier to fit that latex which means I don't have to carry Butyl spares with me. I always find latex to be too much of a faff to fit on the roadside.
I notice (subjectively) a higher number of punctures on tubeless when I'm on group rides. Sure most of these do normally self seal but the tyre is still compromised. I assume that a higher number of tubeless riders dont bother to check their tyres and winkle out the small pieces of flint before they become an issue?

[BikeEatSleepRepeat]

I notice (subjectively) a higher number of punctures on tubeless when I'm on group rides. Sure most of these do normally self seal but the tyre is still compromised.

I have noticed this, too.

Sometimes, it's just a complaint of sealant spray as it self seals but a puncture nonetheless.

[Hexsense]

They are also much easier to fit that latex which means I don't have to carry Butyl spares with me. I always find latex to be too much of a faff to fit on the roadside.

Why would you carry Butyl spare? TPU is the perfect type of tube for a spare.
I normally run latex tube. If I flat, I put in TPU tube. Then when I'm back home, I take TPU off put new latex tube in.
The TPU can be folded back into my emergency kit.

At moderate/low pressure (58psi 25c front and 28c rear GP5000 with latex or TPU), I notice the difference in ride quality. Enough that I still use latex tube on my best road bike. For commuter/city/gravel bike, I use TPU because it hold air better.

[TheLuddite]

Why would you carry Butyl spare?

I mean prior to the invention of TPU tubes.

[C36]

If you want light, you use TPU tubes, you want comfort and fast, use latex.

TPU tubes are testing as fast as latex and I am not noticing a comfort difference.

Small detail point. TPU is as fast as latex when tested over slick drums (no vibrations from the road). On real life roads with some rugosity the natural higher stiffness of TPU seems to transmit more vibrations and generate more impedance losses.

I ran both and indeed the felt difference is not big (particularly since I ride on very good roads), really need back to back runs to feel it…

Could also notice that many of the tubeless set ups are tested with a very minimal sealant artificially lowering absolute rolling resistance