Please don’t make this a rim vs disc bloodfest. Stage 17 won with rim brake

[tomato]

The nonsensical, irrelevant, and false statements are coming so fast that there's not enough time to refute one before three more are made.

[cveks]

Chris Froome unhappy to be on disc brakes
By Cyclingnews February 08, 2021

'I don't think the technology is quite where it needs to be' says four-time Tour de France winner




Chris Froome has questioned the merits of disc brakes, arguing the "the technology is not quite where it needs to be" despite preparing to use them during the 2021 season.

After spending 10 years on a rim-braked Pinarello at Team Sky/Ineos, Froome has switched to Factor Bikes and disc brakes at his new team Israel Start-Up Nation.

In a video released on Monday, the four-time Tour de France winner presented the features of his new main race bike, the Factor Ostro VAM.

While speaking enthusiastically about the rest of the bike and components, Froome did little to try and disguise his distaste for his new stoppers.

"I've been using them for the last couple of months and, performance-wise, they're great. You always stop when you need to stop. In the dry, in the wet, they do the job. They do what they're meant to do.

"The downside to disc brakes: the constant rubbing, the potential for mechanicals, the overheating, the discs becoming a bit warped when on descents longer than five or 10 minutes of constant braking.

"Personally, I don't think the technology is quite where it needs to be yet for road cycling," Froome continued, before adding to his list of shortcomings.

"The distance between the disc and the rotors is still too narrow, so you're going to get that rubbing, you're going to get one piston that fires more than another, you're going to get these little issues. I don’t think the pistons quite retract the way they're meant to all the time. Quite often it’ll work on the stand and when the mechanic sorts it out, but once you get onto the road, it’s a different story."

Disc brakes have become widespread in the professional road racing peloton in the past few years. There were several early hiccups, including disputes between the UCI and the CPA, as well as multiple riders speaking out to question the benefits of discs and highlight potential dangers.

However, the debate has calmed in the past couple of years and now Ineos Grenadiers are the only team in the WorldTour still exclusively using caliper brakes, with only a couple of others giving their riders the option.

[cveks]

Is Chris Froome still unhappy with his disc brakes?

Four-time Tour de France winner switches out Shimano callipers for mountain stage

The move could be an attempt to stop rotor rubbing on long mountain descents

Chris Froome isn’t the convert to disc brakes that many pro riders are and he looks to have taken one more step in an attempt to stop the annoying rotor noise that can follow a long period of heavy braking.

Back in February, Froome said that he wasn't "100 per cent sold" on disc brakes despite having used them for a couple of months when talking to his YouTube followers about the Factor Ostro VAM that his Israel Start-Up Nation (ISUN) team uses. In the refreshingly honest review, Froome also said that while performance in both the wet and dry impressed him, he suggested that he had concerns over rubbing, overheating and the potential for rotors becoming warped.

On the horribly hard double Ventoux stage on Saturday, Froome was spotted using what we think is Magura’s MT8 SL FM(link is external). This two-piston flat-mount calliper is identifiable by the red ring seen on the body of the brake.

Magura disc calliper 2
While we believe the calliper to be the MT8 SL FM - it’s the premium flat-mount in the Magura range - the lack of detail in the photo means that we can’t take a close enough look to confirm our suspicions.

The question really isn’t about what brake the ISUN mechanics have fitted, but why Froome wants it fitted. From what Froome has said about disc brakes in the past, we believe that the answer to that centres on heat dissipation and long descents.

When a rider such as Froome heads down a long descent, there are going to be numerous times where heavy braking is required due to the high speeds and twisting nature of the road. Hard braking can cause heat to build on the rotor and also within the brake calliper. In here, the heat can cause the pistons to expand slightly and this prevents the brake pads from returning to their ‘off’ position.

> What’s wrong with Chris Froome’s disc brakes?

This is when you will get the annoying noise as the brake pad is still slightly contacting the rotor. Dirt and brake dust can also be burnt onto the wall of the piston, further enhancing the issue.

So does the use of (what we think are) the Magura callipers solve this issue? We haven’t reviewed the MT8 SL FM, or used any other Magura callipers with Shimano road levers, so we can’t say either way; but with Froome being given the green light to use rim brakes should he wish, the set-up must be good enough to keep him on discs.

https://road.cc/content/tech-news/chris ... ers-284783

Froomey trying to fix disc brake failure by chainging calipers from Shimano crapy to Magura MT8 SL FM . It looks that not even best mechanics pro sport have can't resolve this nightmare....

[cveks]

Some guy asked here question "How come that disc brakes are good for MTB and Cyclocross bikes and not for road bikes"?

Answer is simple. While riding MTB you are riding 2-3-4 times slower than pro peloton riders on road bikes. So you simply dont have problems they have.

Rotors wont warp when you brake at 30 kmh to 10 kmh but warp regularly when you brake from 70-100 kmh because they are very thin.

And when they warp it comes quick and situation becomes very dangerous on big mountain descents.

And squeling sound of disc brakes is non avoidable and almost non-resolvable. That hurt ears.

[tjvirden]

The nonsensical, irrelevant, and false statements are coming so fast that there's not enough time to refute one before three more are made.

It almost makes me wonder what one has to do to be given a holiday

Edit:
..and what I forgot to add was to ask if anyone has experience of the Bontrager "Laser Control Track" with Swissstop pads, both dry and wet? Even better if there's a comparison with Campag's AC3!
Thanks.

[Konsi]

The women's Olympic Road Race winner lives about 60km away from me and we train on the same roads in the same conditions. She has no sponsor commitments and picked a Scott Addict RC with discs. She is also quite light, so weight matters proportionally more for her. Why would I pick anything else for rides in the region here?

On this Banana guy from Australia – he is a conspiracy theorist and has a long history of assault allegations. I would not take him seriously on any topic.
https://steemit.com/durianrider/@michae ... d-a-rapist

https://jezebel.com/a-year-of-bananas-v ... 1788340075

[cveks]

The women's Olympic Road Race winner lives about 60km away from me and we train on the same roads in the same conditions. She has no sponsor commitments and picked a Scott Addict RC with discs. She is also quite light, so weight matters proportionally more for her. Why would I pick anything else for rides in the region here?

On this Banana guy from Australia – he is a conspiracy theorist and has a long history of assault allegations. I would not take him seriously on any topic.
https://steemit.com/durianrider/@michae ... d-a-rapist

https://jezebel.com/a-year-of-bananas-v ... 1788340075

She would be even faster with older Scott Addict with rim brakes. Lighter.

Scott Addict RC 15 with Ultegra Di2 in my country weights over 7.5 kgs without pedals and costs over 5000 euros.

Older Scott Addict RC with rim breaks and Ultegra mechanical is somewhere around 6.8kg .


800 grams weight difference is - A LOT.

[Alexbn921]

Some guy asked here question "How come that disc brakes are good for MTB and Cyclocross bikes and not for road bikes"?

Answer is simple. While riding MTB you are riding 2-3-4 times slower than pro peloton riders on road bikes. So you simply dont have problems they have.

Rotors wont warp when you brake at 30 kmh to 10 kmh but warp regularly when you brake from 70-100 kmh because they are very thin.

And when they warp it comes quick and situation becomes very dangerous on big mountain descents.

And squeling sound of disc brakes is non avoidable and almost non-resolvable. That hurt ears.

Aahhhahaha.
Mountain bikes require 3-4x the braking force and thermal management. Your ignorance related to this show how little you know on the subject.

Again ZERO mountain bikers would ever consider rim brakes.

[spartacus]

Some guy asked here question "How come that disc brakes are good for MTB and Cyclocross bikes and not for road bikes"?

Answer is simple. While riding MTB you are riding 2-3-4 times slower than pro peloton riders on road bikes. So you simply dont have problems they have.

Can you show us on the doll where the disc brakes hurt you?

Anyways yes the answer is simple but somehow you've still managed to find the wrong one.

1.) MTB/CX encounter more wet / muddy conditions
2.) Braking requirements for MTB are HIGHER (not lower) than road. Mountain bikes have typically have 180-220mm front rotors often with 4 piston calipers. Road bikes have 140-160mm front rotors usually with 2 piston calipers. If what you said were true then the sutuation would be reversed.

Thank you and have a nice day.

[LeDuke]

Some guy asked here question "How come that disc brakes are good for MTB and Cyclocross bikes and not for road bikes"?

Answer is simple. While riding MTB you are riding 2-3-4 times slower than pro peloton riders on road bikes. So you simply dont have problems they have.
.

This might be the dumbest statement yet.

But, yes, all of the people riding 180mm, 200mm or 220mm rotors with 4 piston calipers are doing it wrong, and some person who has never ridden an MTB is right.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CampagYOLO]

The women's Olympic Road Race winner lives about 60km away from me and we train on the same roads in the same conditions. She has no sponsor commitments and picked a Scott Addict RC with discs. She is also quite light, so weight matters proportionally more for her. Why would I pick anything else for rides in the region here?

On this Banana guy from Australia – he is a conspiracy theorist and has a long history of assault allegations. I would not take him seriously on any topic.
https://steemit.com/durianrider/@michae ... d-a-rapist

https://jezebel.com/a-year-of-bananas-v ... 1788340075

She would be even faster with older Scott Addict with rim brakes. Lighter.

Scott Addict RC 15 with Ultegra Di2 in my country weights over 7.5 kgs without pedals and costs over 5000 euros.

Older Scott Addict RC with rim breaks and Ultegra mechanical is somewhere around 6.8kg .


800 grams weight difference is - A LOT.

Best go and mansplain to the Olympic Road Race winner about how to ride a bike.

To add to his long list of indiscretions, turns out Durian Rider is also an anti-vaxxer.

[wheelsONfire]

I totally agree with Froome. The breaking is great, it's also great that so many love disc brakes (inspite most of the guys here threw hate over them some years ago).
But perfect disc brakes are not!
(no need to dive into this mess once again!)
Rim brakes has drawbacks to, so it's up to each and everyone what they want to buy.
A bit of an issue with old standard framesets and new rim brake rims, is the internal width of the rims.
Old standard bikes often max out at 25mm tires (then there's clearance issues).
The later design of rims seems to be 20mm + which makes 25mm tires a bit too wide.
That is an issue. Everybody knows that massproducation steer away from premium rim brake framesets, so that leaves us to custom (if you want premium).
Ofcourse the industry is judge and jury here, so there isn't much to do but suck it up.

[MikeD]

Some guy asked here question "How come that disc brakes are good for MTB and Cyclocross bikes and not for road bikes"?

Answer is simple. While riding MTB you are riding 2-3-4 times slower than pro peloton riders on road bikes. So you simply dont have problems they have.
.

This might be the dumbest statement yet.

But, yes, all of the people riding 180mm, 200mm or 220mm rotors with 4 piston calipers are doing it wrong, and some person who has never ridden an MTB is right.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't see where 4 piston calipers are better than two. Please explain.

[naylor343]

Is Chris Froome still unhappy with his disc brakes?

Four-time Tour de France winner switches out Shimano callipers for mountain stage

The move could be an attempt to stop rotor rubbing on long mountain descents

Chris Froome isn’t the convert to disc brakes that many pro riders are and he looks to have taken one more step in an attempt to stop the annoying rotor noise that can follow a long period of heavy braking.

Back in February, Froome said that he wasn't "100 per cent sold" on disc brakes despite having used them for a couple of months when talking to his YouTube followers about the Factor Ostro VAM that his Israel Start-Up Nation (ISUN) team uses. In the refreshingly honest review, Froome also said that while performance in both the wet and dry impressed him, he suggested that he had concerns over rubbing, overheating and the potential for rotors becoming warped.

On the horribly hard double Ventoux stage on Saturday, Froome was spotted using what we think is Magura’s MT8 SL FM(link is external). This two-piston flat-mount calliper is identifiable by the red ring seen on the body of the brake.

Magura disc calliper 2
While we believe the calliper to be the MT8 SL FM - it’s the premium flat-mount in the Magura range - the lack of detail in the photo means that we can’t take a close enough look to confirm our suspicions.

The question really isn’t about what brake the ISUN mechanics have fitted, but why Froome wants it fitted. From what Froome has said about disc brakes in the past, we believe that the answer to that centres on heat dissipation and long descents.

When a rider such as Froome heads down a long descent, there are going to be numerous times where heavy braking is required due to the high speeds and twisting nature of the road. Hard braking can cause heat to build on the rotor and also within the brake calliper. In here, the heat can cause the pistons to expand slightly and this prevents the brake pads from returning to their ‘off’ position.

> What’s wrong with Chris Froome’s disc brakes?

This is when you will get the annoying noise as the brake pad is still slightly contacting the rotor. Dirt and brake dust can also be burnt onto the wall of the piston, further enhancing the issue.

So does the use of (what we think are) the Magura callipers solve this issue? We haven’t reviewed the MT8 SL FM, or used any other Magura callipers with Shimano road levers, so we can’t say either way; but with Froome being given the green light to use rim brakes should he wish, the set-up must be good enough to keep him on discs.

https://road.cc/content/tech-news/chris ... ers-284783

Froomey trying to fix disc brake failure by chainging calipers from Shimano crapy to Magura MT8 SL FM . It looks that not even best mechanics pro sport have can't resolve this nightmare....

Having made the change to Magura calipers, Froome still made a bike change to a rim brake bike during the stage from Ceret to Andorra.

[spartacus]

Some guy asked here question "How come that disc brakes are good for MTB and Cyclocross bikes and not for road bikes"?

Answer is simple. While riding MTB you are riding 2-3-4 times slower than pro peloton riders on road bikes. So you simply dont have problems they have.
.

This might be the dumbest statement yet.

But, yes, all of the people riding 180mm, 200mm or 220mm rotors with 4 piston calipers are doing it wrong, and some person who has never ridden an MTB is right.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't see where 4 piston calipers are better than two. Please explain.

More surface area potentially. The clamping force of the caliper is related to the surface area of the pistons. More surface area = stronger clamping. Another possible reason is using a larger (surface area) brake pad.