Please don’t make this a rim vs disc bloodfest. Stage 17 won with rim brake

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.

Moderator: robbosmans

Locked
User avatar
Lewn777
Posts: 1261
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

Just bought a Bowman Palace 3C. Thought I'd get in there whilst still nice frames with rim. I'll be riding it for 10 years while I hope disk brakes improve in new generations. However considering they are almost the exact same as the brakes on mountain bikes 15 years ago, I doubt I'll see anything but glacial improvement.

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓    Broad Selection ✓    Worldwide Delivery ✓

www.starbike.com



usr
Posts: 560
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2021 5:58 pm

by usr

Lewn777 wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 2:50 pm
I doubt I'll see anything but glacial improvement.
The only thing I still hope for is hoods returning to roughly mechanical/mechanical size once the mechanical/hydraulic hybrids are completely gone, I believe that electronic/hydraulic could shrink quite a bit, electronics take zero volume compared to mechanical and the hydraulic stuff shouldn't be much bigger than the old shifting winch mechanisms.

But my hopes are small, many people seem to be perfectly happy with their "reassuringly big grips". To me, they remind me of every rental I ever hated for the lever hood shape.

smartyiak
Posts: 263
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:20 pm

by smartyiak

usr wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 3:12 pm
The only thing I still hope for is hoods returning to roughly mechanical/mechanical size once the mechanical/hydraulic hybrids are completely gone, I believe that electronic/hydraulic could shrink quite a bit, electronics take zero volume compared to mechanical and the hydraulic stuff shouldn't be much bigger than the old shifting winch mechanisms.

But my hopes are small, many people seem to be perfectly happy with their "reassuringly big grips". To me, they remind me of every rental I ever hated for the lever hood shape.
Like!

Everytime I see new e-shift bikes, I think: those look ridiculously large!

iheartbianchi
Posts: 680
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:17 am

by iheartbianchi

MikeD wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 2:43 pm
Just give us choice in the marketplace. I don't care what people ride or what they prefer, but manufacturers are practically all disc these days. A friend of mine bought a new Trek. He said he wanted rim brakes but the bike came only with disc. That probably means I'll probably keep my old bike for quite a while longer.

I bought an Orbea Gain e-road bike. Came with disc only, but since it has room for 40mm tires (came with 28s), I kinda like the flexibility of that, but I've had noise and rubbing problems with the brakes.
Problem is that choice hurts the manufacturers. You need two manufacturing processes and two separate supply chains, plus all the overhead to maintain two different sets of brakes. We can't blame the manufacturers for choosing one or the other. Just watch - eventually all the major manufacturers will only offer disc brakes, as the final holdouts (such as myself) eventually give in and go disc - it just hurts profitability too much to cater to an ever shrinking market for rim.

I'm fine with rim going the way of downtube shifters and mechanical groupsets going away. I just pray the same never happens to tubular tires! Clinchers are guaranteed to go flat and I hate carrying spare tubes, and tubeless...well too many horror storries of them blowing off rims, or otherwise exploding, for my comfort level!
Bianchi Oltre XR4
Celeste Matte
Campy SR 11spd mechanical
Bora Ultra 50 tubs
Viseon 5D / stock bits and parts

Bianchi Specialissima Pantani Edition
Campy R 12spd mechanical
Fulcrum Racing Speed 35 tubs
FSA / Deda bits and parts

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 10124
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

Lewn777 wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 11:26 am

You talk about straw man arguments? This thread is about how someone won a stage of a grand tour on a rim bike, and you talk of disk brake sales as if they are evidence of the superiority of disk brake bikes. :roll:

You have no idea what a strawman argument is. The discussion shifted to shitting on disc brakes and the usual delusional suspects saying things like the rise of disc brakes was only due to marketing and that rim brakes will rise from the dead. I'm just here mentioning that disc brakes have dominated the market since 2017. I haven't implied that they are superior in all respects, but you're rebutting me as if I am. That's a strawman.

For whatever reason, rim brakes are functionally extinct. Move on with your lives.

iheartbianchi
Posts: 680
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:17 am

by iheartbianchi

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:05 pm

For whatever reason, rim brakes are functionally extinct. Move on with your lives.
I think we still got 5-10 years to enjoy rim brakes :) Campagnolo offers their Bora Ultra WTO in rim, so we can expect legacy support for several more years at least!
Bianchi Oltre XR4
Celeste Matte
Campy SR 11spd mechanical
Bora Ultra 50 tubs
Viseon 5D / stock bits and parts

Bianchi Specialissima Pantani Edition
Campy R 12spd mechanical
Fulcrum Racing Speed 35 tubs
FSA / Deda bits and parts

tomato
Posts: 680
Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2019 8:37 pm

by tomato

iheartbianchi wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 9:34 am
Boonen's statement that "It's the biggest improvement I've seen in my career" in 2017 was especially comical, given he was on a precipitous decline at that stage of his career. But hey, Specialized was paying him so who cares.
Froome's statement that "Personally, I just don’t think the technology is quite where it needs to be yet for road cycling" in 2021 was especially comical, given he was on precipitous decline at that stage of his career. But hey, Factor was pay him so who cares.

See how that works?

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 10124
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

iheartbianchi wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 3:45 pm

I'm fine with rim going the way of downtube shifters and mechanical groupsets going away. I just pray the same never happens to tubular tires! Clinchers are guaranteed to go flat and I hate carrying spare tubes, and tubeless...well too many horror storries of them blowing off rims, or otherwise exploding, for my comfort level!

Tubulars don't go flat? People who train on tubulars don't carry entire spare tubs in their back pockets?

Also your preconception/bias has turned tubeless into a bogeyman. Don't believe the FUD.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 10124
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

iheartbianchi wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:11 pm

I think we still got 5-10 years to enjoy rim brakes :) Campagnolo offers their Bora Ultra WTO in rim, so we can expect legacy support for several more years at least!

That's why I said functionally extinct instead of extinct-extinct. It's already evident that Shimano will simply rebrand their R9150 levers as R9250.

iheartbianchi
Posts: 680
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:17 am

by iheartbianchi

tomato wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:13 pm
iheartbianchi wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 9:34 am
Boonen's statement that "It's the biggest improvement I've seen in my career" in 2017 was especially comical, given he was on a precipitous decline at that stage of his career. But hey, Specialized was paying him so who cares.
Froome's statement that "Personally, I just don’t think the technology is quite where it needs to be yet for road cycling" in 2021 was especially comical, given he was on precipitous decline at that stage of his career. But hey, Factor was pay him so who cares.

See how that works?
Hey, don't pick on a man while he's down!
Bianchi Oltre XR4
Celeste Matte
Campy SR 11spd mechanical
Bora Ultra 50 tubs
Viseon 5D / stock bits and parts

Bianchi Specialissima Pantani Edition
Campy R 12spd mechanical
Fulcrum Racing Speed 35 tubs
FSA / Deda bits and parts

iheartbianchi
Posts: 680
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:17 am

by iheartbianchi

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:14 pm

Tubulars don't go flat? People who train on tubulars don't carry entire spare tubs in their back pockets?

Also your preconception/bias has turned tubeless into a bogeyman. Don't believe the FUD.
Tires/wheels are one area I will glady sacrifice performance for safety. Too many horror threads of tubes blowing up at speed or hookless/tubeless failures. Yes some of it is probably user error but I'm not taking any chances.
Bianchi Oltre XR4
Celeste Matte
Campy SR 11spd mechanical
Bora Ultra 50 tubs
Viseon 5D / stock bits and parts

Bianchi Specialissima Pantani Edition
Campy R 12spd mechanical
Fulcrum Racing Speed 35 tubs
FSA / Deda bits and parts

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 10124
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

Some pros are racing tubeless and surely pushing their tires to the limit, right?

MikeD
Posts: 834
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2014 9:55 pm

by MikeD

iheartbianchi wrote:
MikeD wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 2:43 pm
Just give us choice in the marketplace. I don't care what people ride or what they prefer, but manufacturers are practically all disc these days. A friend of mine bought a new Trek. He said he wanted rim brakes but the bike came only with disc. That probably means I'll probably keep my old bike for quite a while longer.

I bought an Orbea Gain e-road bike. Came with disc only, but since it has room for 40mm tires (came with 28s), I kinda like the flexibility of that, but I've had noise and rubbing problems with the brakes.
Problem is that choice hurts the manufacturers. You need two manufacturing processes and two separate supply chains, plus all the overhead to maintain two different sets of brakes. We can't blame the manufacturers for choosing one or the other. Just watch - eventually all the major manufacturers will only offer disc brakes, as the final holdouts (such as myself) eventually give in and go disc - it just hurts profitability too much to cater to an ever shrinking market for rim.

I'm fine with rim going the way of downtube shifters and mechanical groupsets going away. I just pray the same never happens to tubular tires! Clinchers are guaranteed to go flat and I hate carrying spare tubes, and tubeless...well too many horror storries of them blowing off rims, or otherwise exploding, for my comfort level!
The only reason tubulars didn't become extinct is because of professional racing. There's a bigger market for rim braked bikes than tubular tires, rims, and wheels. If the pros still use rim brakes, at least there will still be some decent rim braked bikes around and components too.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 10124
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

I mean, it’s okay to say “I just prefer tubulars.” Just don’t be part of the problem by spreading FUD about regular clinchers or tubeless clinchers.

“Tubeless?? Won’t touch ‘em. I heard they can explode at any time! I think Andrea’s cousin lost an eye!”

FUD.

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓    Broad Selection ✓    Worldwide Delivery ✓

www.starbike.com



iheartbianchi
Posts: 680
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:17 am

by iheartbianchi

Fair enough - never meant this to be an entire discussion on tire choice. Back to bashing rims or disc.
Bianchi Oltre XR4
Celeste Matte
Campy SR 11spd mechanical
Bora Ultra 50 tubs
Viseon 5D / stock bits and parts

Bianchi Specialissima Pantani Edition
Campy R 12spd mechanical
Fulcrum Racing Speed 35 tubs
FSA / Deda bits and parts

Locked