Help me choose some tyres

[Nickldn]

I ride Corsa tubs too and really like the feel and comfort, but wonder how that translates to the world of tubless.

I know that tubless tyres have stiffer sidewalls, so perhaps the cotton casing has less impact on comfort.

I have ridden tubless tyres with nylon casings before and found them quite comfortable compared to nylon based clinchers (lower pressure too of course).

[tjvirden]

Thicker casing? Not sure.
But those are separate dimensions, aren't they?
1. The drum is a good way to estimate rr, but not perfect.

2. With the drum, softer casings tyres are penalized versus harder tyres.

3. Cotton casing is not the only factor driving rr.

I haven't ridden tubeless for a couple years. Within tubulars, I think I do appreciate a bit more comfort with softer tyres and latex inner tubes.

Have you done any testing of this idea?

[DHG01]

Thicker casing? Not sure.
But those are separate dimensions, aren't they?
1. The drum is a good way to estimate rr, but not perfect.

2. With the drum, softer casings tyres are penalized versus harder tyres.

3. Cotton casing is not the only factor driving rr.

I haven't ridden tubeless for a couple years. Within tubulars, I think I do appreciate a bit more comfort with softer tyres and latex inner tubes.

Have you done any testing of this idea?

No; just reading. Below a Rene Hersey article you might find interesting. They seem a bit too harsh with BRR and their tyres always score well... may want to take it with a pinch of salt.

Coach also has an interesting article where they introduce "impedance" and how the lower pressure helps reduce resistance on non perfect surface. Seems the softness could also apply?

https://www.renehersecycles.com/testing ... isnt-easy/

[Yoln]

Just switched to Spesh Turbo tires recently (after GP5K in 2019, and Vitoria Corsa/Corsa-speed in 2020). So far fantastic tires. I have the Cottons with Aerothans on one bike and the RapidAir tubeless on the other. Both 26mm which are more like 27 on my campy WTO (rapidair) and 27.5 for the cottons on the lightbycicle wheels.

All in all, very fast tire, faster than Vittorias (not the speed one) more comfortable/supple than GP5k, good grip... I'm loving them

[tjvirden]

Thicker casing? Not sure.
But those are separate dimensions, aren't they?
1. The drum is a good way to estimate rr, but not perfect.

2. With the drum, softer casings tyres are penalized versus harder tyres.

3. Cotton casing is not the only factor driving rr.

I haven't ridden tubeless for a couple years. Within tubulars, I think I do appreciate a bit more comfort with softer tyres and latex inner tubes.

Have you done any testing of this idea?

No; just reading. Below a Rene Hersey article you might find interesting. They seem a bit too harsh with BRR and their tyres always score well... may want to take it with a pinch of salt.

Coach also has an interesting article where they introduce "impedance" and how the lower pressure helps reduce resistance on non perfect surface. Seems the softness could also apply?

https://www.renehersecycles.com/testing ... isnt-easy/

I like Jan Heine's (Rene Herse/Compass Cycles) enthusiasm in investigating and doing things differently, but he isn't an independent tester - he has a product to sell and so, in my opinion, sometimes the story is fitted to his product; his testing lacks rigour (repeatable, quantifiable methods). Having said that, I do think many of his products (tires in particular) have merit - Panaracer make some good tires.

"Impedance" as a term referring to some of the energy losses was introduced by Josh Poertner - blog.silca.cc - ultimately coming from testing done by him and Tom Anhalt. I'm not keen on the name (impedance), but the testing done by them is extremely informative and useful. In relation to that, a problem with talking about "softness" of tires is that is isn't defined and quantified - that's the enormous advantage of properly done drum or roller tire testing; the factor of interest far above everything else is quantified. That factor is energy "loss" from deformation of the tread and casing + tube (if there is one). An obvious problem is that the relative contributions to energy "loss" can only be estimated, by testing at different pressures and with different tubes - for example, a low-loss casing + high-loss tread might have the same measured total loss, at a specific pressure, as an opposing combination. Testing at a different pressure - or load - might enable you to estimate in what proportions the losses occur.

I think it would be better to talk about losses in the casing (and tread or tube) rather than 'softness', which is vague.

[DHG01]

Yes, you are right- impedance was used in the Silca article; my bad. I also thought it was a great article.

And agree with you on Rene's articles; I really like them - but then I am looking into steel tubes for a frame and all of a sudden Kaisei are known to make the worlds best tubes but I can't read about it elsewhere...

Good thoughts you share - particularly breaking out losses on the different tyre components. As surprising as it may be, it's not too difficult to distinguish a Corsa from a Corea Elite tubular - being the only difference the latex inner tube (in spite of very low difference tested on rr tested by BRR).

Anyway, back to the OP - I would try something new. And the referred to Specialized sound appealing!

[raggedtrousers]

Nothing really! It's just wet with a lot of debris in the road and it's cold enough that you don't want to risk too many punctures. So people tend to run more puncture resistant rubber.

I've not come across rubber cracking but it rarely goes below -5C here. I know UV causes rubber to crack.

My unease about tubeless comes from the fact that punctures seem, from anecdata, less likely, but - equally from anecdata - a bit less fixable. I've been on 2 rides with guys who got tubeless flats that didn't seal, and in one case, he couldn't get a tube in either, so was stranded.

That said, my gut is to try the Challenge Roubaix TL. I mean, what's the worst that can happen...

[vinny]

Nothing really! It's just wet with a lot of debris in the road and it's cold enough that you don't want to risk too many punctures. So people tend to run more puncture resistant rubber.

I've not come across rubber cracking but it rarely goes below -5C here. I know UV causes rubber to crack.

My unease about tubeless comes from the fact that punctures seem, from anecdata, less likely, but - equally from anecdata - a bit less fixable. I've been on 2 rides with guys who got tubeless flats that didn't seal, and in one case, he couldn't get a tube in either, so was stranded.

That said, my gut is to try the Challenge Roubaix TL. I mean, what's the worst that can happen...

You need to bring a plug kit of some sort with you. When i get a hole with tubless, i always just put a plug in it (assuming i notice the issue). I always use this one
https://www.amazon.com/Dynaplug-Mega-Pi ... NrPXRydWU=

[petromyzon]

The goal with modern rims is to have the tyre stay mounted so you can plug it.
But I wouldn't go out with a setup that I couldn't put a tube in - made that mistake before!
The larger size tubeless tyres are often a little bit easier to work with and I often mount them with a tube in the workshop at home first.