Stiffest QR Skewer?

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FactoryMatt
Posts: 1014
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:35 am

by FactoryMatt

Ultradog wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 3:08 am
Thanks all!

I'll give the DA one a try as I am running 9100 anyways, so extra points for matchy matchy!

Anyone care to explain the difference between internal and external cam?
leverage ratio on internal is higher and the cam surfaces are better protected from the elements for smoother operation. if youre going external cam, you might as well go tooled IMO (viewspeed, control tech, etc)

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nickf
Posts: 1428
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2010 10:34 pm

by nickf

Nickldn wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:31 pm
jih wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 2:16 pm

I don't think the QR contributes very much to the stiffness of the axle, but a steel one would be less flexible than ti. Shimano, Campag etc rather than ultra-light QRs
Agree with the above, skewers just provide a compression force to keep your chainstays together around the axel. Their contribution to axle stiffness is small.

It is the axle in your rear wheel which provides enough stiffness to keep the wheel spinning correctly and prevents too much movement.

As noted by other posters skewers with internal cams are much better at providing a compression force. Hex key skewers are good too.

If you have a brake rub issue and your frame dropouts are OK then also check the hub too.
This. I never experienced any additional flex with my extralite streeters. If there is enough flex for your wheel to rub your rum brakes then you have other issues going on. Disc brakes rubbing, eh welcome to disc brakes.

I have seen bikes with 12mm bolt-on axles rub disc when out of the saddle or even a tight turn one way or the other. Some of the hydro brakes are such tight tolerances any amount of frame deflection will cause the disc to rub. Not the skewer.

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wheelsONfire
Posts: 6283
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Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

nickf wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 3:39 am
Nickldn wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:31 pm
jih wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 2:16 pm

I don't think the QR contributes very much to the stiffness of the axle, but a steel one would be less flexible than ti. Shimano, Campag etc rather than ultra-light QRs
Agree with the above, skewers just provide a compression force to keep your chainstays together around the axel. Their contribution to axle stiffness is small.

It is the axle in your rear wheel which provides enough stiffness to keep the wheel spinning correctly and prevents too much movement.

As noted by other posters skewers with internal cams are much better at providing a compression force. Hex key skewers are good too.

If you have a brake rub issue and your frame dropouts are OK then also check the hub too.
This. I never experienced any additional flex with my extralite streeters. If there is enough flex for your wheel to rub your rum brakes then you have other issues going on. Disc brakes rubbing, eh welcome to disc brakes.

I have seen bikes with 12mm bolt-on axles rub disc when out of the saddle or even a tight turn one way or the other. Some of the hydro brakes are such tight tolerances any amount of frame deflection will cause the disc to rub. Not the skewer.
It's not fun if you have issues with dics rub running through axles. Heard several complain about this!
How usual is it really?
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.

FactoryMatt
Posts: 1014
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:35 am

by FactoryMatt

^ its very common. All forks twist.

Ultradog
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2020 3:32 am

by Ultradog

Sorry to drain the resource, but in terms of DA 9100 rear QR, I can only find 163mm for sale.

I'm under the impression my rear spacing is 135mm and therefore I'd need a 168mm skewer. Measuring my Enve QR and it seems even longer than 168mm. Dogma F8 Disk.

1. Will 163mm work?
2. If not, can you get 168mm in DA 9100?

Thanks!!

alexmcm09
Posts: 92
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:02 am

by alexmcm09

Ultradog wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 11:42 am
Sorry to drain the resource, but in terms of DA 9100 rear QR, I can only find 163mm for sale.

I'm under the impression my rear spacing is 135mm and therefore I'd need a 168mm skewer. Measuring my Enve QR and it seems even longer than 168mm. Dogma F8 Disk.

1. Will 163mm work?
2. If not, can you get 168mm in DA 9100?

Thanks!!
I was running a DA 130mm skewer on my gravel bike (135mm spacing) for a year with no issues. There's not a heap of thread engaged but the clamping force was fine and I had no issues even when banging about off road. No pad rub whatsoever on Ultegra disc calipers.

Tychom
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:29 am
Location: FR

by Tychom

Ultradog wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 11:42 am
2. If not, can you get 168mm in DA 9100?
You could always go with XTR 9000 quick releases that come for 135mm spaced hubs (XTR FH-M9000)

bikerzero
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:32 pm

by bikerzero

Another vote for DT Swiss RWS. Noticable difference. Or perhaps it's just the Enve Ti that's bad. Didn't think it would make a difference at first but back to back test on the same climb. One rub, one doesn't.

FactoryMatt
Posts: 1014
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:35 am

by FactoryMatt

Tychom wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:51 pm
Ultradog wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 11:42 am
2. If not, can you get 168mm in DA 9100?
You could always go with XTR 9000 quick releases that come for 135mm spaced hubs (XTR FH-M9000)
i think i have a rear 985 XTR skewer if anyone needs it. LMK.

CyclingGiraffe
Posts: 328
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2020 10:04 pm

by CyclingGiraffe

bikerzero wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 5:21 pm
Another vote for DT Swiss RWS. Noticable difference. Or perhaps it's just the Enve Ti that's bad. Didn't think it would make a difference at first but back to back test on the same climb. One rub, one doesn't.
I have the Enve Ti (pre Mavic) and find them inadequate for holding the rear wheel on my rim brake bike. I still use it on my front wheel, as it is light and looks good, but am using the Campy skewers that came with my Eurus wheelset for the rear wheel. I've not had an issue with other lightweight Ti skewers in the past (Am Classic, Zipp). The Campy skewers -- which use a cam mechanism and larger contact areas -- hold much more securely; the only issue is that the lever is quite wide, which means that on my frame, they can only be closed in one direction or they interfere with the dropout/frame interface.

bikerzero
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:32 pm

by bikerzero

CyclingGiraffe wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 7:46 pm
bikerzero wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 5:21 pm
Another vote for DT Swiss RWS. Noticable difference. Or perhaps it's just the Enve Ti that's bad. Didn't think it would make a difference at first but back to back test on the same climb. One rub, one doesn't.
I have the Enve Ti (pre Mavic) and find them inadequate for holding the rear wheel on my rim brake bike. I still use it on my front wheel, as it is light and looks good, but am using the Campy skewers that came with my Eurus wheelset for the rear wheel. I've not had an issue with other lightweight Ti skewers in the past (Am Classic, Zipp). The Campy skewers -- which use a cam mechanism and larger contact areas -- hold much more securely; the only issue is that the lever is quite wide, which means that on my frame, they can only be closed in one direction or they interfere with the dropout/frame interface.
Thanks. Those are the Enve Ti ones I have also, inadequate is an understatement actually. I have tried other cam style ones like Roval, Mavic, Shimano as well but in the end I like the RWS more. Another single data point that I have is that my gf fell over quite a few times when she was just getting into biking and using clipless pedals. Each time she fell over, the wheel would shift with any of the other cam style quick release and it would rub the brakes. Have to loosen and retighten. Don't have this problem at all with the RWS. I have the road version levers on the RWS so they are not as bulky.

Nickldn
Posts: 1866
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 12:35 am

by Nickldn

wheelsONfire wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 6:20 am
nickf wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 3:39 am
Nickldn wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:31 pm
jih wrote:
Wed Sep 30, 2020 2:16 pm

I don't think the QR contributes very much to the stiffness of the axle, but a steel one would be less flexible than ti. Shimano, Campag etc rather than ultra-light QRs
Agree with the above, skewers just provide a compression force to keep your chainstays together around the axel. Their contribution to axle stiffness is small.

It is the axle in your rear wheel which provides enough stiffness to keep the wheel spinning correctly and prevents too much movement.

As noted by other posters skewers with internal cams are much better at providing a compression force. Hex key skewers are good too.

If you have a brake rub issue and your frame dropouts are OK then also check the hub too.
This. I never experienced any additional flex with my extralite streeters. If there is enough flex for your wheel to rub your rum brakes then you have other issues going on. Disc brakes rubbing, eh welcome to disc brakes.

I have seen bikes with 12mm bolt-on axles rub disc when out of the saddle or even a tight turn one way or the other. Some of the hydro brakes are such tight tolerances any amount of frame deflection will cause the disc to rub. Not the skewer.
It's not fun if you have issues with dics rub running through axles. Heard several complain about this!
How usual is it really?
With Rim brakes at least you can increase the gap between pads and the wheel by 0.5mm by adjusting the brake cable, that'll quickly help reduce brake rub when sprinting.

Trickier with Disk brakes. Forks and chainstays will always flex, that's what they're designed for.
Giant Propel Advanced SL Red Etap 11s Easton EC90 wheels CeramicSpeed BB Zipp SL70 bars 6.5kg

Vitus ZX1 CRS Campy Chorus 12s Bora WTO 45 disk brake wheels Zipp SL70 bars 7.5kg

SL8 build with Craft CS5060 Wheels in progress

MyM3Coupe
Posts: 374
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:32 pm

by MyM3Coupe

I briefly had Dura Ace 9100 skewers, but found them to not fit my frame correctly when closed. Bought some Mavic titanium ones and find them to work just as well, as the titanium shafts are quite thick. They can be hard to find though. Totalcycling was the only place I could get them. Liked them so much I bought two pairs.

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wheelsONfire
Posts: 6283
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

FactoryMatt wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 7:07 am
^ its very common. All forks twist.
Yeah i believe so to. Question is for those talking about drag, how much will this affect the outcome?
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.

FactoryMatt
Posts: 1014
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:35 am

by FactoryMatt

wheelsONfire wrote:
Fri Oct 02, 2020 12:19 am
FactoryMatt wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 7:07 am
^ its very common. All forks twist.
Yeah i believe so to. Question is for those talking about drag, how much will this affect the outcome?
none. many/most only do it when out of the saddle in anger and its very minimal, like the lip of the rotor touching the pad; there's not full-on engagement with the pad.

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓    Broad Selection ✓    Worldwide Delivery ✓

www.starbike.com



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