Factor Ostro
Moderator: robbosmans
- wheelsONfire
- Posts: 6283
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
- Location: NorthEU
>Cberg
^^
I believe you. But i think most people who buy the bikes (not just Pinarello) believe they buy the true blueprint. However, my guess is also that they test differet layups on current models. So it's possible there is a few versions. I don't believe each riders bike is custom for their specifics.
I mean, as an example. Vial EVO have two versions, the old geo and that of SCULP which was sold under another brand name. But each of these models have seen several revisions, but looks same same. It's both external layup aswell as internal that is different through revisions.
So, my guess is that for example, Pinarello do this to. A later F8 might be different to the first!? Or otherwise Pinarello actually test several versions and then release ex F10 and later F12 aso. A change in the visual appearance might trigger potential customers to buy a new bike over a version that actually looks the same!?
Building in metal would require change of tube diameter, lenght of tubes/ shapes and different angel. T*red is a good example looking at Aracnide, Crab (2 versions of steel and 2 Ti) + the REA model. All of these are either steel or ti. You also have Mania which is existing in different versions (alu frame).
Personally i am more keen on a T*red over a new carbon frame.
^^
I believe you. But i think most people who buy the bikes (not just Pinarello) believe they buy the true blueprint. However, my guess is also that they test differet layups on current models. So it's possible there is a few versions. I don't believe each riders bike is custom for their specifics.
I mean, as an example. Vial EVO have two versions, the old geo and that of SCULP which was sold under another brand name. But each of these models have seen several revisions, but looks same same. It's both external layup aswell as internal that is different through revisions.
So, my guess is that for example, Pinarello do this to. A later F8 might be different to the first!? Or otherwise Pinarello actually test several versions and then release ex F10 and later F12 aso. A change in the visual appearance might trigger potential customers to buy a new bike over a version that actually looks the same!?
Building in metal would require change of tube diameter, lenght of tubes/ shapes and different angel. T*red is a good example looking at Aracnide, Crab (2 versions of steel and 2 Ti) + the REA model. All of these are either steel or ti. You also have Mania which is existing in different versions (alu frame).
Personally i am more keen on a T*red over a new carbon frame.
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
I really doubt anyone at the UCI cares - there are plenty of recent examples of, in practical terms, pro only stuff.
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- wheelsONfire
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- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
- Location: NorthEU
There is atleast one brand who design frames to handle impact. I wonder if it wasn't Factor!?tjvirden wrote: ↑Tue Mar 23, 2021 12:37 pmWell, it's entirely possible that is the reason - however it would help customer confidence if they put out something official, wouldn't it?!mrlobber wrote: ↑Tue Mar 23, 2021 8:58 amAssuming it's true, this means the pros (even not individual, but a whole team) sometimes get a custom layup despite how many times we're being told that "they ride the same bikes which are available to the general public"
Even more interesting is why they did it
My guess as to why is that it was stiffness related - I can see the fork being very, very stiff front-back and about the only way you can increase the comfort on bad surfaces (aka in-plane compliance, or splay) is let the steerer flex a little more. It's a legitimate way of doing it, but obviously requires very careful design, manufacture and of course testing! It seems there wasn't quite enough margin for impact, so back to the drawing board they go.
I think it was, but not sure.
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Frame/fork impact testing is a part of ISO 4210 that all the manufacturers will be following - the problem is, real-world usage is not well represented by 4210. Factor seem to make reliable stuff in general, but once you really start pushing weight down with carbon then you can't rely on industry standard composites modelling software and definitely not on ISO 4210 - Specialized gave some hints as to how difficult the Aethos was to produce.
UD front end maybe?mrlobber wrote: ↑Tue Mar 23, 2021 8:58 amAssuming it's true, this means the pros (even not individual, but a whole team) sometimes get a custom layup despite how many times we're being told that "they ride the same bikes which are available to the general public"
Even more interesting is why they did it
It might be weight related but I'd guess its more chasing front stiffness and pro's tolerate harshness a little better than the average consumer
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Ok I may want to believe him.
But it's the same for the VAM fully integrated too ? Don't speak about that one
They ride the non integrated VAM. So maybe he's telling the truth AND
Also avoiding or keeping one information for himself, not impossible.
The Ostro was ridden as a prototype, for a short review by dave at cyclingtips, he found it not very stiff.
And he's your average weekend warrior cyclist, nothing crazy in terms of fitness .
Factor add in the article, that they were doing a stiffer layup for the production version
But it's the same for the VAM fully integrated too ? Don't speak about that one
They ride the non integrated VAM. So maybe he's telling the truth AND
Also avoiding or keeping one information for himself, not impossible.
The Ostro was ridden as a prototype, for a short review by dave at cyclingtips, he found it not very stiff.
And he's your average weekend warrior cyclist, nothing crazy in terms of fitness .
Factor add in the article, that they were doing a stiffer layup for the production version
Broken Ostro and plug issue addressed here:
Cycling Tips article:
https://cyclingtips.com/category/tech/
Factor blog post:
https://factorbikes.com/update-on-isn-team-ostro/
Cycling Tips article:
https://cyclingtips.com/category/tech/
Factor blog post:
https://factorbikes.com/update-on-isn-team-ostro/
That’s cool. He’s been super responsive and helpful to me...just placed an order for a Prisma O2 VAM with him. He’s even involved a product specialist to answer some technical bb and chainline questions.ichobi wrote:In case you didn’t know, Factor Head of Sales is not just your average sales guy. John Ebsen is 3x Taiwan kom champion and also won Tour de Langkawi KOM jersey. Pretty cool!
Good to know, but a strange way to handle this problem. If the wrong steering plug can cause such a catastrophic failure, i would expect a replacement and check of fork for all owners. Not them waiting for customers to complain about a loosesing headset.Scott2017 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 30, 2021 4:49 amBroken Ostro and plug issue addressed here:
Cycling Tips article:
https://cyclingtips.com/category/tech/
Factor blog post:
https://factorbikes.com/update-on-isn-team-ostro/
And the first explanation of a special layup for the pros being the reason for the failure was a lie then i guess...
I think the red flag is raised when many people reported loose headset. Mine also suffers from the same issue though to a minor degree. The new expander solves all that, but you would think they should have better QC for this quite critical piece. Still i think they are responsive enough and did a better job than Canyon, though it could have been faster.
Tnx for this, and agree this is a strange way to handle this issue..
Contacted my LBS and asked him to order the updated plug. I prefer to fix issues like this before they occur.
Now continue waiting for the correct barstem...
Contacted my LBS and asked him to order the updated plug. I prefer to fix issues like this before they occur.
Now continue waiting for the correct barstem...
Fuctor Ostro - Campy EPS SR Disc 12sp/P2M NG
Ridley R12 - Campy EPS Record 11sp/P2M NGEco
Thrust something - Campy Chorus/Record mechanical/P2M NGEco
No, that's not a typo
Ridley R12 - Campy EPS Record 11sp/P2M NGEco
Thrust something - Campy Chorus/Record mechanical/P2M NGEco
No, that's not a typo
Kudos to Factor for being so honest and making very detailed public statements of their findings. But waiting for customers to get in contact with them or their LBS is a risky move if they already know there is a potential issue.
And now we also got confirmation that pros are not riding special layups but much rather that they are still riding the old prototypes from last year.
And now we also got confirmation that pros are not riding special layups but much rather that they are still riding the old prototypes from last year.
- cyclespeed
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- Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 8:45 am
Why can't they just make the fork with a set nut inside like they have done for the pros?
So much simpler and lighter, and it's part of the fork so CANNOT move.
Also, I don't fully buy this explanation. Because the stem is the thing anchoring the whole system together. The stem should clamp the steerer in such as way that it cannot move. The compression bung should not be stressed. Only when the stem is incapable of holding the steerer is the bung then stressed and it's 'grip' is tested, and in these cases failing.
So much simpler and lighter, and it's part of the fork so CANNOT move.
Also, I don't fully buy this explanation. Because the stem is the thing anchoring the whole system together. The stem should clamp the steerer in such as way that it cannot move. The compression bung should not be stressed. Only when the stem is incapable of holding the steerer is the bung then stressed and it's 'grip' is tested, and in these cases failing.
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