"Lightness" vs "Aeroness" UPDATED 10/2023

[FlatlandClimber]

[TobinHatesYou]

Please tell me that Look 795 Blade came with shallow concrete wheels.

[C36]

Basically with 404, canyon, felt, cube, giant, storck are between 207-210w.
Look, Scott, Fuji, Merida in the 214-217 range.


—————————————
- Supersix evo2 HM 5707g
- 1995 Miguel Indurain Pinarello restauration project
- R3000si Junior bike restauration project.

[FlatlandClimber]

Yes, the Scott and the Look are on laughably shallow wheels...
it is as if this German cycling mag really favors German manufacturers ...

[Dr.Dos]

Yes, the Scott and the Look are on laughably shallow wheels...
it is as if this German cycling mag really favors German manufacturers ...

I bet they used German scales and German grams. So biased. Unfair.

Simple: Don't like the results, attack the source.

[FlatlandClimber]

You are right. As a long term reader of German cycling magazines and haven't come up with the idea, that Canyon, Cube, Storck and Rose bikes are simply the best. The new Canyon Aeroad is the highest rated bike ever on both Tour and Road Bike. A marvel of engineering!
I will listen to the National Anthem for the rest of the day.

[Dr.Dos]

Merida is German as well.

There you go.

Maybe you visit us to enjoy our Autobahn. Stop dreaming, seize the day

[FlatlandClimber]

Visit Germany? Ich bin aus Deutschland... Den Witz mit Merida verstehe ich leider nicht

[rides4beer]

The real question is why do Scott and Look put shallow wheels on their aero bikes?? Sell them properly equipped to perform and they’ll test better.


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[HansZuDemFranz]

Yes, the Scott and the Look are on laughably shallow wheels...
it is as if this German cycling mag really favors German manufacturers ...

The cube also has shallow wheels.

Edit: maybe not. I was looking at the old test. My bad.

[C36]

I bet they used German scales and German grams. So biased. Unfair.

Simple: Don't like the results, attack the source.

As much as I praise Tour for their approach, they do have a biais toward German products and a closer collaboration with the brands that puts their product in favorable position (configuration, other products in competition).
From a canyon engineer “we have very good relationship with Tour, it’s needed and it’s a win win”.
In some cases you have an alignment on the test procedures, meaning some products are developed to perform well in their tests.


—————————————
- Supersix evo2 HM 5707g
- 1995 Miguel Indurain Pinarello restauration project
- R3000si Junior bike restauration project.

[Dr.Dos]

I bet they used German scales and German grams. So biased. Unfair.

Simple: Don't like the results, attack the source.

As much as I praise Tour for their approach, they do have a biais toward German products and a closer collaboration with the brands that puts their product in favorable position (configuration, other products in competition).
From a canyon engineer “we have very good relationship with Tour, it’s needed and it’s a win win”.
In some cases you have an alignment on the test procedures, meaning some products are developed to perform well in their tests.


—————————————
- Supersix evo2 HM 5707g
- 1995 Miguel Indurain Pinarello restauration project
- R3000si Junior bike restauration project.

It think it all started with Scott and their C1, from there it was all STW. Then came vertical deflection (Komfortwertung) and then came aero. Plus everybody including many over here want to ride the best bike in the world (and they want to show it and they want it to be shown by tests). So naturally, as a bike maker, you will try and use/cheat the system. This made bikes better in general but also produced Rohrkrepierer (their is no good translation for this) like the 2020 Aeroad - or is it the 2019 Aeroad??

Looking at the test, if you decide between bikes that are within less than 5W with a normalized set of wheels (at 45km/h!) because of aeroness, you are beyond help. There is the margin of error and let's be clear about this, the aero data is also normalized and can change depending on circumstances, yaw angles.

That being said, a good bike is a good bike. But we will never know which one is "the best" and Tour mag is not the single point of truth. And regarding aeroness, there might not be such thing in general.

Back in the early days of MTB'ing I read Mountain Bike Action as a subscriber. I was happy because they were different from our Bike magazine who had to promote a winner in each and every test. MBA was different, there were so many subjective notes, you had to *feel* the test. It was awesome. If you look closely, Tour added this touch to their tests some years ago. So to me, all this testing is a bit strange but if try to *feel* what they want to tell us, Tour may be every bit as good as MBA.

[Dr.Dos]

Visit Germany? Ich bin aus Deutschland... Den Witz mit Merida verstehe ich leider nicht

Oh, das wusste ich nicht.

Meridas are being developed in Germany for decades. Of course, most of the manufracturing know-how is located in Asia as with every other big player.

[FlatlandClimber]

Okay, I thought they were Taiwanese...
I don't want to accuse anyone of collusion, because I could never prove it.
However, I have read loads and loads of German cycling magazines and I always found it a little suspicious that German bike makers, especially the one from Koblenz always perform through the roof. I have ridden Canyon bikes and I am not saying they are bad by any means.
Just saying that the ones with the biggest ad space also perform well in the Tests... just a Little sour taste in my mouth.

The same also goes for German car mags ...

[Dr.Dos]

Scott is a big advertiser, yet they do not win tests. Big German importers such as MCG, Lange et al are very close with the magazines, yet I'm under the impression that it does not affect the tests. Cube bikes have always been good performers and value - especially for a shop-brand. Rose used to be very good with their configurator, the best configurator for non-top-end bikes there was, you could literally change *everything* (they lost that USP unfortunately).

I find the GCN/Canyon conglomerate much nastier.