Tubolito road tubes - worthwhile or not?

[Stickman]

I found this comparison between latex, butyl and Tubolito. Latex is king for RR and weight:

https://www.aero-coach.co.uk/inner-tube ... resistance

SUMMARY
In this updated test we found that there was a large difference in rolling resistance between different models of inner tubes, with standard butyl tubes being the heaviest and the slowest on test.

Latex inner tubes outweigh any small penalty from ultra light tubes like Tubolitos or a Continental Race Supersonic as the rolling resistance with a latex tube is so much lower (better). One small drawback with latex tubes is that they lose air overnight and require pumping up before a ride - so if you want to have an inner tube that's a little bit faster than a standard butyl tube and doesn't require daily inflation, Tubolito or Continental Race Supersonic would be two alternatives.

Cutting rotating weight by upgrading my stock wheels (~2100g to ~1550g) made a huge difference, I'm hoping cutting another ~70g per wheel of rotating mass will help me gasp and wheeze my way up the hills at a snail's pace a tiny bit easier

[StanK]

So many Tubolito users, so many punctures, so many problem with air leakage.
Revoloop - no air leakage (even slightly better than a good butyl tube like Michelin A1 in that regards), without puncture in approx. 500km and the same price as Tubolito.
And I think they have 60mm valve version, which is enough for 38mm rims. At least for my pump it would be.

[colagreek]

So many Tubolito users, so many punctures, so many problem with air leakage.
Revoloop - no air leakage (even slightly better than a good butyl tube like Michelin A1 in that regards), without puncture in approx. 500km and the same price as Tubolito.
And I think they have 60mm valve version, which is enough for 38mm rims. At least for my pump it would be.

I think there is just a larger group of Tubolito users, and a thus a larger sample size.

[liketoride]

stanK which rovoloop are you using? does anyone else have first hand usage reports on this product? never knew about this

[aeroisnteverything]

There is a thread re revoloop on weightweenies. Fairly few reports, unfortunately, but there was not a widespread complaint about valve joint leaking like you see with tubolitos. They are also not orange, which is a plus in my book. One common complaint I do recall was that the valves are smooth plastic on which a pump struggles to find a purchase. I think this is solved by buying a 40mm valve stem length and adding a normal alloy valve extender for your rim depth.

And they also seem to have a new product range for 2020. Like this thing here: https://revoloop.com/racer-cyclocross/1 ... 10017&c=34 25g is crazy light. It's a WW dream. You could save c. 180g of rotating mass by using this with Conti 5000 vs Conti 5000TL with the sealant and tubeless valve and all that. People pay a lot of money for a wheelset that is 180g lighter than the alternative. And if it really does hold air better than butyl, and has no valve issues - well, that's pretty compelling, no? Per that aerocoach data above, RR penalty is really quite small vs latex (one needs to remember that aerocoach tests at 45kph which exaggerates the gaps as RR increases linearly with speed, and their data is for two wheels, so it really is around maybe 1w per wheel vs latex at "mortal speed".

I am very, very tempted to try this after I wear out my current supply of tubeless.

[StanK]

"Revoloop white". But now I see recently was name changing to "REVOLOOP.race". Weight 38-39 grams.

[Krzysio]

My experience with Tubolitos shows some cons. First is that if you want to reinstall the used one, you will need to be very careful to force whole thing inside your tyre's bead without pinching it. That's because they are made of not elastic material, so, once inflated they stay expanded - you remove air, and your tube is expanded in size, flat and thinner walls thing. It is doable to force it inside tire, but rather crazy to take it for ride and try to replace punctured one with it.
Another thing is - patches are not permanent. Patch glue is never getting hard, and the hotter the softer it is.
Third - it's not really declared 38 grams. It is 41 - 42. For longer than 10 years I was using butyl Conti Supersonics. 51 grams, and 2.5 times cheaper. I'm not going for this pocket and inconvenience struggle anymore to gain those 9 grams. Back to Supersonics.

[StanK]

I think there is just a larger group of Tubolito users, and a thus a larger sample size.

That's for sure, but I don't understand why.
Yes, I read, "on paper" Tubolito should be slightly better for some reason (I was forget why, to be honest), but too many complaints about leaking air. And I'm either not fan of orange valve. For same money and weight, for now, Revoloop is way more interesting to me.

But we will see how would behave this season, especially when temperature goes up (they even don't recomend using this with rim brakes?!?! - obviously in some situations generating heat in rims could be a problem), so game is still on. I will switch back to butil if there will be some problems, but for now it's all good.

[Kumppa]

Used Tubolitos for 3000 km last summer and I am happy user. Didn't have any problem with assembly and zero punctures/leaking. Hopefully still going strong after 6 month break.

Those leaking valves should been fixed as they started to use threadlocker. Not fan of that orange valve but 10s work with permanent marker and it is black.

[Leviathan]

Ive had three Tubolitos and no puncture issues, I guess 5000kms on each. Dont like the plastic valve barrel for clamping, but find they are lightweight and have OK RR: Had a mate who bought two which both split at the valve entrance so cleary these things arent (werent?) 100% defect free

[robertbb]

Latex is great, but to me the air leakage makes it a bit of a challenge to use on a daily basis.

For practical purposes, if you are using tubes, it seems to me that light butyl (Conti race light or Specialized equivalent) is the best of all worlds - at least until revoloop or tubolito establish themselves as a realiable alternative. 70g weight, small RR penalty over latex (1w at 30 kph, according to Jarno), and reliable. YMMV obviously.

Who's Jarno?

Jarno Bierman is the man behind https://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/

Thank you! I didn't realise that the RR penalty for light butyl vs latex is only 1w at 30kph. I though the magic number was 5w per tyre, so 10w all-up.

In fact, with so much importance on correct pressures for RR, I wonder if the loss of pressure over the course of an all-day ride actually makes latex *less* efficient in total. Now, if Jarno's reading this - *that* would be an interesting thing to calculate/test:

At typical latex pressure-loss rates, how many watts of RR do you lose per hour of riding and how does this compare over, say, a 6 hour ride (like a fondo for example). Now what happens if one compensates by over-inflating slightly at the beginning...

Of course for people like us, this is just snapping around at the edges of the most fractional gains and it makes not one iota of difference. Still an interesting question.

[bilwit]

I also don't really understand the appeal of Turbolitos when we have latex. More supple, less weight, better rolling resistance, equal or less the price. The air loss/convenience is aspect is fair, but if you use the latest Vittoria ones with the added graphene, it's a lot easier to live with. I would say it's nearly 2x better at holding air, reducing a every-single-day inflation to maybe-every-day (just to top it off, but still rideable without) but definitely-every-other-day, depending on where you start/finish of course. Pumping it up before riding every day was never a big deal to me though.

Thank you! I didn't realise that the RR penalty for light butyl vs latex is only 1w at 30kph. I though the magic number was 5w per tyre, so 10w all-up.

Some people have had good experiences with the super thin butyl tubes like Conti supersonic or whatever their thinnest model is called but personally I found them extremely fragile and way more prone to pinch flat.

[robertbb]

I also don't really understand the appeal of Turbolitos when we have latex. More supple, less weight, better rolling resistance, equal or less the price. The air loss/convenience is aspect is fair, but if you use the latest Vittoria ones with the added graphene, it's a lot easier to live with.

Is there any way to know which vittoria one you're getting? Packaging? Batch number?

[jlok]

There is a thread re revoloop on weightweenies. Fairly few reports, unfortunately, but there was not a widespread complaint about valve joint leaking like you see with tubolitos. They are also not orange, which is a plus in my book. One common complaint I do recall was that the valves are smooth plastic on which a pump struggles to find a purchase. I think this is solved by buying a 40mm valve stem length and adding a normal alloy valve extender for your rim depth.

And they also seem to have a new product range for 2020. Like this thing here: https://revoloop.com/racer-cyclocross/1 ... 10017&c=34 25g is crazy light. It's a WW dream. You could save c. 180g of rotating mass by using this with Conti 5000 vs Conti 5000TL with the sealant and tubeless valve and all that. People pay a lot of money for a wheelset that is 180g lighter than the alternative. And if it really does hold air better than butyl, and has no valve issues - well, that's pretty compelling, no? Per that aerocoach data above, RR penalty is really quite small vs latex (one needs to remember that aerocoach tests at 45kph which exaggerates the gaps as RR increases linearly with speed, and their data is for two wheels, so it really is around maybe 1w per wheel vs latex at "mortal speed".

I am very, very tempted to try this after I wear out my current supply of tubeless.

I'm planning to try S-Tubo + light clincher too, vs my current Pro One TLE 25/28 (248+268g) + 25mL x2 + TL valves (4g x2?).

[synchronicity]

I was thinking of getting these but I hate having to inflate my tyres all the time. Hmm.
Are they really all that susceptible to heat?