Orbea Gets Roasted By A Five-year Old.

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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tabl10s
Posts: 602
Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2017 5:40 am

by tabl10s

2015 Pinarello F8: 13.05lbs/5.915kg
2016 Rca: 11.07lbs/5.048kg
2018 Rca
2018 S-Works SL6 Ultralight: 12.03lbs

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C36
Posts: 845
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 3:24 am

by C36

What I take from this... is the Canyon terrible BB tolerances!

Edit: the swearing % has a severe inflation video after video. And while I can totally get over it and focus on the engineering side, it eventually be severely counter productive for many...

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Last edited by C36 on Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

Robius
Posts: 36
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:35 am

by Robius

Well, a five year old who knows what he is talking about.

BTW, RIP Canyon (looks like it's coming soon).

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wheelsONfire
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Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

I just feel one thing, the cussing swearing and obnoxious attitude is almost like tourettes.
This could be better, but this is horrendous.
Part from that, i don't think Hambini have seen all brands frames.
I have direct press bearings (no "shell", just two bearings) on my Ax bike (had a few) and there have never been a problem with fit of bearings.
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2018.12.21)
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156137
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D

Stueys
Posts: 408
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2014 1:12 pm

by Stueys

On one hand manufacturers arent applying the level of QA and engineering rigour to bikes to minimise issues, and I like Hambini calling it out. On the other hand I find the tourettes style grates and the sample size isn't meaningful or insightful.

What would be useful is if there was an independent register that all the bike shops updated with occurances of tolerance issues. That would be a useful pressure point for improvements.

pmprego
Posts: 216
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:16 pm

by pmprego

wheelsONfire wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:34 am
I just feel one thing, the cussing swearing and obnoxious attitude is almost like tourettes.
This could be better, but this is horrendous.
Part from that, i don't think Hambini have seen all brands frames.
I have direct press bearings (no "shell", just two bearings) on my Ax bike (had a few) and there have never been a problem with fit of bearings.
Hambini might produce amazing BB. Don't have a way to know but won't criticize as well.

But people have to see his videos from his business perspective. He's advertising his own product. And doing it in a way that creates heated exchange.

Regarding the brands that are better or worst his results are incredibly biased. He gets the bad frames only. A good frame is not sent over there because there is no need. The people who send frames are not random so his stats are also not random thus biased. For instance, he favors look manufacturer. How many people own look frames when compared to all other brands? If this is a very reduced portion of the entire market is just natural that he will only get a very very small number of look frames.

To get an unbiased statistics of which brands are the best and the worst regarding frame tolerances he would need to buy frames from all the brands, in the same proportion of their worldwide market share (no one has this info) and test them all. Obviously, this would be ridicously expensive and because of that no one does it. At the same time, don't take his stats regarding who's good and who's bad by heart. Or as said in English, take it with a bit (a lot actually) of salt.

Edit: I consider buying a hambini BB nonetheless.

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wheelsONfire
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Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

I would easily buy a Hambini BB to. I have no problem with him, i've mailed him a few times and he's a nice dude.
But i just find it strange people obsess over f**k, sh*t, c*nt bla bla bla.
Part from that, well i guess those brands that doesn't land on his table are also great brands.
As you say pmprego, it's probably just the bad batch that actually get sent to him.
No-one would send in a great frame just for him to wa-nk on about
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2018.12.21)
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156137
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D

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C36
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Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2017 3:24 am

by C36

First, those frames shouldn’t get out of the factory. Bearing science for BB application is an extremely mature branch of engineering. In no other mechanical industries any of those geometrical tolerances would ever be accepted. Period.

In the event we accept that remote manufacturing, weak manufacturing process (being inconsistent is a really poor manufacturing process) and loose QC...the frame replacement should be”no question asked”.


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Last edited by C36 on Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

hambini
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Location: Cologne, Germany

by hambini

This is really a reply to those saying that I don't test enough frames.

The answer is I do... The difference is you only get one video per frame. I haven't updated this page for a while but the tolerance chart is at the bottom of this page.

https://www.hambini.com/bottom-bracket- ... -analysis/

The best indicator of whether you will get a problem is frame misalignment. It's also more difficult to measure.

And swearing is used both as an adjective and to quantify in engineering - it's quite useful. It's like

"gnat's cock" =0.1mm

Hambini
Hambini Aeronautical Engineer, Polluting YouTube since 2016 - views expressed are my own...
Add me ON TWITTER!
Aerodynamic Masterclass in bicycle wheels
I fixed the bottom bracket from hell

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kgt
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Location: Athens, Greece

by kgt

hambini is not politically correct, for sure, and he loses many fans because of this but he is one of the most interesting voices in the industry.

I don't know how many frames he has tested but when talking about bb shells there is no such thing as a bad or good frame. Either manufacturers follow strict engineering tolerances or not; and most manufacturers do not.
It is the same with Raoul Luescher when testing carbon forks. His conclusions are similar. Most manufacturers' forks (especially those outsourcing their production) are of a poor quality, unfortunately.

lewishong9
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:15 pm

by lewishong9

Even though I own 2 Cervelos and 2 Spesh, I really like Hambini.

Most of his videos are about criticizing the manufacturers that can't even meet their own tolerance requirement. Fully deserved in my opinion.

As for swearing, typical middle aged British chap I guess :)

MaxPower
Posts: 114
Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2019 9:30 pm

by MaxPower

hambini wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:47 pm
And swearing is used both as an adjective and to quantify in engineering - it's quite useful. It's like

"gnat's cock" =0.1mm

Hambini
That made me laugh out loud!

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Kayrehn
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Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 6:06 pm

by Kayrehn

Agree with kgt - bikes aren't cheap these days (in fact higher end bikes are quite exorbitant given that they aren't much different than lower range bikes), so not getting the specs right is ridiculous and definitely a cause for warranty. Imagine paying big money only to find that it's shit after a few/no rides. Then more time and money spent to troubleshoot. Then give up and warrantied it. And your new bike joy all but gone after you have to rebuild it a second time.

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kgt
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Location: Athens, Greece

by kgt

Still a lot of guys still drool, waiting for the new Aeroad. So, marketing always wins at the end...

mattsurf
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by mattsurf

Personally I don't like Hambini's language, but no big deal. I think that people would take him more seriously if he expressed himself in a more professional way, however, he is like many good engineers, who are often somewhat different to the rest of us (and why many companies employ people who sit between the engineers and the rest of the world.

My own background is in operations in high tech manufacturing, and I have also worked in aerospace. Unfortunately most companies in the cycling industry are no where near the standard set in other industries. Hambini is using his own industry, aerospace, as a standard and using it as a reference. In terms of aerodynamics, manufacturing tolerence, quality, consistency etc there is a massive gap.

There are 2 fundamental reasons for this, where do the best engineers go? do the top university grads go into the cycling industry, or do they go to aerospace, automotive or high tech? Ultimately cycling does not attract the best (although I am sure that there are exceptions

The second issue is even more fundamental, cycling companies are first and foremost marketing organisations. Engineering excellence is not in their DNA.

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