Short nose saddles vs. classic saddles

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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hlvd
Posts: 364
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by hlvd

Ypuh wrote:
hlvd wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 2:45 pm
That's what I don't really understand, why are these saddles much wider than conventional ones?
No clue. These saddles are aimed at riding in the drops and therefor should't be too wide at the front I'd say. Both the Pro Stealth and also the SELLE ITALIA SLR from a few posts above seems to be pretty wide. The Specialized Power seems to be a bit more normal, but still wide if you compare it with an Arione or something.

Image
Does it compromise your balance point with more forward weight or does nothing change?

RedbullFiXX
Posts: 231
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by RedbullFiXX

JayDee81 wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 4:02 pm
RedbullFiXX wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 8:14 pm
SELLE ITALIA SLR Boost Superflow Saddle 130mm (160gr)
Best I've tried, super comfy for long rides
Found on traditional saddles I moved around constantly trying to find that sweet spot
This has a smaller sweet spot, sorted
Very nice for long pulls in the drops, or more upright on long climbs
It did take a few attempts to find the correct for/aft position, as this is more critical than with a longer saddle
Also I prefer the shape at the back as it allows free movement off the rear for long decents
Did you try standard (not Boost) Selle Italia SLR Superflow too?
Yes, that was my goto for a while, thought it couldn't get any better
The Boost was a nice upgrade both in comfort and weight, couldn't be happier
I will add that I have a fairly narrow stance on the bike, cannot deal with wide saddles, especially on the front portion
Cyclocross, in general, is about riding the wrong bike for the conditions.

by Weenie


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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

Probably pending on how wide rami bones user have?
I like Pro Aerofuel. But i'm also waiting for Ere Research Genus (270mm = Long)

Anyway, Aerofuel has more padding on the nose than Stealth, it's also flat from nose to rear.
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2018.12.21)
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156137
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D

xcnick
Posts: 176
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 5:27 pm

by xcnick

Nicely timed post. Been using a standard Power for a few years on all my bikes but came across an old Selle Italia SLR Flow in my spares. I stuck it on out of interest and wow! At first it felt a little hard but then it started to feel so good that when i sat back on my Power it just like it was blocking my legs from moving. The SLR felt so free and i really liked not being fixed in one position (Not that I move about much) and much preferred the flatness. So I'm gonna be returning to a classic saddle and buy another SLR.

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JayDee81
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Location: Europe

by JayDee81

I have currently borrowed Specialized Power and I have two questions for you guys.

First is what is the actual benefit of the saddle being shorter, when we don't take into account the UCI rule?

And the second is what saddle would you suggest I should try? The Power basically solved my perineum problem, but I don't find it comfortable, because of the rising rear. It makes me lean forwards and ride in the drops all the time, because on the hoods and tops I find way too much weight on my arms, which have to hold me from falling forward. Basically a saddle, which would be flat or have just a slighty rising rear, that would be similar to Power in the perineum area, which is my biggest problem with most saddles.

Thanks guys.

PS: My ischial bones distance is 110 mm, so 130ish saddle I think?

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BikeEatSleepRepeat
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by BikeEatSleepRepeat

JayDee81 wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2020 10:46 pm
And the second is what saddle would you suggest I should try? The Power basically solved my perineum problem, but I don't find it comfortable, because of the rising rear. It makes me lean forwards and ride in the drops all the time, because on the hoods and tops I find way too much weight on my arms, which have to hold me from falling forward. Basically a saddle, which would be flat or have just a slighty rising rear, that would be similar to Power in the perineum area, which is my biggest problem with most saddles.
The Prologo Dimension is similar to the Power but flatter.

I run mine ever so slightly nose up.

The Power did not suit me either, but the Dimension definately does.

Image

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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

BikeEatSleepRepeat wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 12:09 am
JayDee81 wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2020 10:46 pm
And the second is what saddle would you suggest I should try? The Power basically solved my perineum problem, but I don't find it comfortable, because of the rising rear. It makes me lean forwards and ride in the drops all the time, because on the hoods and tops I find way too much weight on my arms, which have to hold me from falling forward. Basically a saddle, which would be flat or have just a slighty rising rear, that would be similar to Power in the perineum area, which is my biggest problem with most saddles.
The Prologo Dimension is similar to the Power but flatter.

I run mine ever so slightly nose up.

The Power did not suit me either, but the Dimension definately does.

Image
^
If you like that tail style up like prologo, aswell as riding with nose up, you should probably like Selle Italia SP-01 Boost.
For me who don't like tail up and any curved saddles, i just don't get why S.I. are so hellbent on doing so many versions of short saddles that are so alike.
All their saddles have more or less tail up and are a bit curved.
I like flat saddles not dipping in the middle.

Basically S.I. have no saddle like that.
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2018.12.21)
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156137
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D

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BikeEatSleepRepeat
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by BikeEatSleepRepeat

double post
Last edited by BikeEatSleepRepeat on Sun Jan 26, 2020 4:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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BikeEatSleepRepeat
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by BikeEatSleepRepeat

wheelsONfire wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 2:56 am
^
If you like that tail style up like prologo, aswell as riding with nose up, you should probably like Selle Italia SP-01 Boost.
For me who don't like tail up and any curved saddles, i just don't get why S.I. are so hellbent on doing so many versions of short saddles that are so alike.
All their saddles have more or less tail up and are a bit curved.
I like flat saddles not dipping in the middle.

Basically S.I. have no saddle like that.
I gave up on Selle Italia's offerings long ago, myself.

The Dimension doesn't have a pronounced tail or dip, but isn't dead level board flat front to back like a Fizik Arione, either.

Image

Side to side, it's what Prologo dubs "semi-curved", but again it's not pronounced.

For me the saddle is a great balance of what works best as an all-arounder.

NordicSal
Posts: 155
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:09 pm

by NordicSal

I have a quite large saddle to bar drop on my new bike, and I've noticed it can irritate the soft tissue behind the balls, making me somewhat numb. What kind of saddle could get me rid of this problem? I have a Fizik Aliante R5 atm, and have tried a bit of a negative angle on the saddle to combat the issue (yet to ride it), would that help you think?

blaugrana
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by blaugrana

JayDee81 wrote:
Sat Jan 25, 2020 10:46 pm
And the second is what saddle would you suggest I should try? The Power basically solved my perineum problem, but I don't find it comfortable, because of the rising rear. It makes me lean forwards and ride in the drops all the time, because on the hoods and tops I find way too much weight on my arms, which have to hold me from falling forward. Basically a saddle, which would be flat or have just a slighty rising rear, that would be similar to Power in the perineum area, which is my biggest problem with most saddles.
I was in a similar situation, liked the Power but the raised tail was a bit annoying (the front had to be level to be comfortable on an aggresive position, but then when riding more casually on the tops of the bars or on the hoods, the angle of the back of the saddle was just too pronounced and pushed me forward). I tried the Pro Stealth because it seemed like a similar saddle, but flatter (it's still not completely flat, though), and I have been really happy with it for more than a year. I would really recommend you to try it (and there is a 30 day return period in case you don't like it, no questions asked).

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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

NordicSal wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 3:59 pm
I have a quite large saddle to bar drop on my new bike, and I've noticed it can irritate the soft tissue behind the balls, making me somewhat numb. What kind of saddle could get me rid of this problem? I have a Fizik Aliante R5 atm, and have tried a bit of a negative angle on the saddle to combat the issue (yet to ride it), would that help you think?
If you you look at Pro saddles, this is what is likely to happen with them to. They need to be positioned meticulously careful.
I have been looking at Syncros, but they are same. It seems like you'd need a saddle were the flare of the sides flex.
Pro and Syncros are reinforced, which is opposite. Selle Italias SP-01 could have been great due to the construction, but they persist to do all saddles like a cradle.
I don't like Fizik, i think all their saddles are to narrow in the nose.
Looking at the new SMP F30C, it dips/ sag right in the middle, so your soft tissue is squeezed against the nose saddle rails mount.

I have been part happy with Pro Aerofuel. But again, the thighs risk to dig in to the saddle sides.

I repeat myself saying, the forthcoming ERE Research Genus could be the thing.
I was told the short version (240mm) comes first and then the longer version (270mm).
This concept have some nice features, looking at how the rails are designed and also a switch in the nose, allowing tuning of the flex of the hull.
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2018.12.21)
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156137
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D

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wheelsONfire
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Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

BikeEatSleepRepeat wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 4:03 am
wheelsONfire wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 2:56 am
^
If you like that tail style up like prologo, aswell as riding with nose up, you should probably like Selle Italia SP-01 Boost.
For me who don't like tail up and any curved saddles, i just don't get why S.I. are so hellbent on doing so many versions of short saddles that are so alike.
All their saddles have more or less tail up and are a bit curved.
I like flat saddles not dipping in the middle.

Basically S.I. have no saddle like that.
I gave up on Selle Italia's offerings long ago, myself.

The Dimension doesn't have a pronounced tail or dip, but isn't dead level board flat front to back like a Fizik Arione, either.

Image

Side to side, it's what Prologo dubs "semi-curved", but again it's not pronounced.

For me the saddle is a great balance of what works best as an all-arounder.
Off topic, but this is one beautiful bike
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2018.12.21)
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156137
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D

rospeedmich
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Dec 31, 2019 7:40 pm

by rospeedmich

JayDee81 wrote:I have currently borrowed Specialized Power and I have two questions for you guys.

First is what is the actual benefit of the saddle being shorter, when we don't take into account the UCI rule?

And the second is what saddle would you suggest I should try? The Power basically solved my perineum problem, but I don't find it comfortable, because of the rising rear. It makes me lean forwards and ride in the drops all the time, because on the hoods and tops I find way too much weight on my arms, which have to hold me from falling forward. Basically a saddle, which would be flat or have just a slighty rising rear, that would be similar to Power in the perineum area, which is my biggest problem with most saddles.

Thanks guys.

PS: My ischial bones distance is 110 mm, so 130ish saddle I think?
With a shorter saddle it's very easy to fall into the trap of NOT placing it as far BACK as you should because comparing to your former, longer saddle you might think that you're too far back in the beginning.

Before returning your Power I would suggest checking your fore-aft position. Don't rely on KOPS. When you ride hard and you're on the drops you should feel minimal pressure on your hands. What you've written before makes me believe you need more setback. Also, check for NOT having it too much tilted down.

A major advantage of short saddles for me is that you don't get your shorts stuck in the nose of the saddle riding on and off the saddle. Good luck.

Sent from my TA-1033 using Tapatalk


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JayDee81
Posts: 153
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:45 pm
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by JayDee81

rospeedmich wrote:
Mon Jan 27, 2020 4:39 pm
With a shorter saddle it's very easy to fall into the trap of NOT placing it as far BACK as you should because comparing to your former, longer saddle you might think that you're too far back in the beginning.

Before returning your Power I would suggest checking your fore-aft position. Don't rely on KOPS. When you ride hard and you're on the drops you should feel minimal pressure on your hands. What you've written before makes me believe you need more setback. Also, check for NOT having it too much tilted down.

A major advantage of short saddles for me is that you don't get your shorts stuck in the nose of the saddle riding on and off the saddle. Good luck.

Sent from my TA-1033 using Tapatalk
Thanks for the advice. I don't think I have the saddle too much forward. Comparing to the SP-01 I also have I set the Power cca 4 cm more back, when measured to the nose of the saddle. Also I played around with this position and tried position more forward, which made it differend, but not too much. Still rideable for shorter rides. I have played with the angle too, always having a cradle on the saddle (the tip was always at least horizontal).
I actually don't consider KOPS for some time. Actually I have my knee a little in front of the axle when measuring. Used to pushing saddle forward from riding enduro. :D But I don't do this on my road bike.
wheelsONfire wrote:
Mon Jan 27, 2020 11:24 am
NordicSal wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 3:59 pm
I have a quite large saddle to bar drop on my new bike, and I've noticed it can irritate the soft tissue behind the balls, making me somewhat numb. What kind of saddle could get me rid of this problem? I have a Fizik Aliante R5 atm, and have tried a bit of a negative angle on the saddle to combat the issue (yet to ride it), would that help you think?
If you you look at Pro saddles, this is what is likely to happen with them to. They need to be positioned meticulously careful.
I have been looking at Syncros, but they are same. It seems like you'd need a saddle were the flare of the sides flex.
Pro and Syncros are reinforced, which is opposite. Selle Italias SP-01 could have been great due to the construction, but they persist to do all saddles like a cradle.

I repeat myself saying, the forthcoming ERE Research Genus could be the thing.
I was told the short version (240mm) comes first and then the longer version (270mm).
This concept have some nice features, looking at how the rails are designed and also a switch in the nose, allowing tuning of the flex of the hull.
So you say that the problem with Pro Stealth is that it doesn't have flex in the wings for pedalling motion?

Also I looked at the ERE Genus saddle and it has a cradle too, but you say it might be good, even though you said cradle is bad (for you).




Other than that can anyone tell me, if I should look more for narrower saddle with the sit bones distance of 11 cm? Or should I stay with 140ish saddles? Or there isn't another way than to test myself?

Also I have tested the Dimension and although I really liked the saddle, it didn't liked me. On the trainer my sit bones hurt after some time, but more importantly it didn't really solve my numbing perineum problem, even when riding outside.

Edit: Btw probably the best saddle I have tried is the Selle Italia XLR Superflow (should be the 131 mm wide (narrow) version, but it was on a bike I bought and I couldn't find any size marker on it, so it could be the 145 mm version), but it's not a road saddle, even though it might be the best saddle I tried yet, even on a trainer.

by Weenie


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