Help me pick a climbing bike

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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VTR1000SP2
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by VTR1000SP2

Kayrehn wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 8:38 am
I really wonder if the Factor VAM is actually an O2 with paint stripped, given that if you subtract 100g or so from the O2 weight it'll be very close to the VAM weight. So if you're on a budget, like the Factor and don't mind taking on some ww work...
The VAM uses different carbon, has a new layup and compaction process, a larger BB area, wider clearance up to 30mm tires and improved internal cable routing.

by Weenie


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VTR1000SP2
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by VTR1000SP2

alcatraz wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:57 am
I wonder what an R3 would be lacking that other frames have?

Sure it's not the wheels?
I wondered about the wheels too but in my own experience, when I switched from a Cervelo S3 to an Izalco Max, the only difference was frame and seatpost as I moved the components over and even with ENVE 7.8s, the snappiness was noticeable. Moving to a mid-depth wheelset, the bike felt snappier, livelier.

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kgt
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by kgt

If you care about manufacturing quality Giant TCR Advanced SL is a better made frame IME.

jmfreeman535
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by jmfreeman535

alcatraz wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:57 am
I wonder what an R3 would be lacking that other frames have?

Sure it's not the wheels?
I'm pretty sure it's not the wheels...I'm running the Hunt 50 Aero. I had Zipp 404's on my Orca, and I think the Hunt's are better in every way.
I also had the Bontragers Aeolus Pro 3's on the Orca, and it didn't matter which wheels, the Orca just felt a bit more snappy than the R3 when really laying the power down.

I don't think that the R3 is necessarily lacking anything, as much as it is simply different. I find that the R3 really wants to stay upright and straight, while the Orca had a more flickable/snappy feeling to it, that you could really throw it side to side. As an everyday bike, I am much happier on the R3, but I do miss the feeling that the Orca gave me on the climbs.

The Orca was also a size smaller, so maybe that could be the cause?

asiantrick
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Location: the OC, CA

by asiantrick

Merlin Cycles is selling 2019 Helium SLX for $2.7K with Ultegra and $3.7K with DI2. In addition, they are doing a promotion this weekend for the Helium SLX. You can save an additional $520. Damn, that's a tempting deal. Too bad they don't have my sizing.
Last edited by asiantrick on Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

jmfreeman535
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by jmfreeman535

kgt wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 12:51 pm
If you care about manufacturing quality Giant TCR Advanced SL is a better made frame IME.
Quality is defintiely something that I care about, and very much appericaite when done correctly. That is one of the things that got me interested in the TCR...I can't find a single bad thing about it. With pretty much every other manufactuor, you can find some kind of horror story.

Then, you mentioned the Alpe d'huez...were you refering to the 01 or 21? The 01 is a little to pricey for me, but there are some great deals on the 21...but it doesn't sound like it has the stiffness that I'm looking for?

jmfreeman535
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by jmfreeman535

asiantrick wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 5:55 pm
jmfreeman535 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 3:15 am
VTR1000SP2 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 2:06 am
Canyon Ultimate CF SLX or Tarmac SL6 would be the 2 bikes I consider if this had to be a disc climber below 5k. Budget aside, Factor O2 VAM.. so light.
I did consider the SLX, but it is a little out of my price range at $7.5k...maybe they will release an Ultegra di2 version? I went into the bike shop all set to purchase the Tarmac SL6, but then I test rode it...didn't care for, it at all. I ended up testing an R3 at the same time, and that's what I came with

The O2 VAM is definitely dream-bike status...if only money wasn't an issue...
$7.5K where do you see that? Merlin Cycles is selling 2019 Helium SLX for $2.7K with Ultegra and $3.7K with DI2. In addition, they are doing a promotion this weekend for the Helium SLX. You can save an additional $520. Damn, that's a tempting deal. Too bad they don't have my sizing.
I was referring the the Canyon Ultimate SLX...if that was $3.7K I'd buy it in a heart beat! But, that is a good deal for the Helium as well, but yah, they don't have my size either.

Bigger Gear
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Location: Wet coast, Canada

by Bigger Gear

Very hard to beat the Giant TCR plus if you can get better components within your budget it's a win-win.

jmfreeman535
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by jmfreeman535

Ok...I'm starting to get a headache trying to work this all out...

I just heard back from a seller, and he is offering a brand new TCR SL frame and a lightly used DA di2 groupset for a very enticing price. BUT from what I've been able to find, 28c tries (more specifically, GP4000's) don't really work. I had to run 25c on my Orca, but I'm back to 28c on my R3 and definitely prefer them (handling wise).

So it looks like the TCR may be a no go...

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VTR1000SP2
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by VTR1000SP2

jmfreeman535 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:27 pm
Ok...I'm starting to get a headache trying to work this all out...

I just heard back from a seller, and he is offering a brand new TCR SL frame and a lightly used DA di2 groupset for a very enticing price. BUT from what I've been able to find, 28c tries (more specifically, GP4000's) don't really work. I had to run 25c on my Orca, but I'm back to 28c on my R3 and definitely prefer them (handling wise).

So it looks like the TCR may be a no go...
Climbing bike with 28s... I'm sure you have a great reason for this but help me understand why the weight penalty of a 28mm for a climbing bike?

spdntrxi
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by spdntrxi

VTR1000SP2 wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 1:05 am
jmfreeman535 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:27 pm
Ok...I'm starting to get a headache trying to work this all out...

I just heard back from a seller, and he is offering a brand new TCR SL frame and a lightly used DA di2 groupset for a very enticing price. BUT from what I've been able to find, 28c tries (more specifically, GP4000's) don't really work. I had to run 25c on my Orca, but I'm back to 28c on my R3 and definitely prefer them (handling wise).

So it looks like the TCR may be a no go...
Climbing bike with 28s... I'm sure you have a great reason for this but help me understand why the weight penalty of a 28mm for a climbing bike?
what go up must come down... I prefer my 28s going downhill to 25s as well.... it's all I can think of :noidea:
2019 BMC TM01 Road UCI config 7.36kg

Bigger Gear
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Location: Wet coast, Canada

by Bigger Gear

The GP4000s in 28 is massively oversized, nowhere a true 28mm tire. On a 20.5mm internal width rim like HED Belgium+ they blow out over 31mm wide and 29mm tall. A more "true" 28mm like a Vittoria Corsa G would probably work fine on the TCR. They are less wide and tall than the GP4000s by about 2 mm.

jmfreeman535
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by jmfreeman535

VTR1000SP2 wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 1:05 am
jmfreeman535 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:27 pm
Ok...I'm starting to get a headache trying to work this all out...

I just heard back from a seller, and he is offering a brand new TCR SL frame and a lightly used DA di2 groupset for a very enticing price. BUT from what I've been able to find, 28c tries (more specifically, GP4000's) don't really work. I had to run 25c on my Orca, but I'm back to 28c on my R3 and definitely prefer them (handling wise).

So it looks like the TCR may be a no go...
Climbing bike with 28s... I'm sure you have a great reason for this but help me understand why the weight penalty of a 28mm for a climbing bike?
What spadntrxi said, for decending. At 40+ mph, confidence outweighs weight (that's why I prefer disks breaks, as well)...I'll gladly trade the extra weight for the added traction.

jmfreeman535
Posts: 242
Joined: Wed Sep 18, 2019 8:12 pm

by jmfreeman535

Bigger Gear wrote:
Sat Sep 21, 2019 1:23 am
The GP4000s in 28 is massively oversized, nowhere a true 28mm tire. On a 20.5mm internal width rim like HED Belgium+ they blow out over 31mm wide and 29mm tall. A more "true" 28mm like a Vittoria Corsa G would probably work fine on the TCR. They are less wide and tall than the GP4000s by about 2 mm.
The GP4000's certainly are on the large size (my rims are 21mm internal), but they are what I'm ussed to, and comfortable on. Plus, from the sound of it, even a true 28mm is a extremely tight fit...one little rock, or some wheel flex, and you could be looking at some damage.

I can live with 25mm, but would rather not if I don't have to.

by Weenie


NiFTY
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by NiFTY

I suspect looking for "snappiness" whilst running larger tyres than the pros would run at roubaix is at least in part a self defeating mission.
Evo 4.9kg SL3 6.64kg Slice RS 8.89kg viewtopic.php?f=10&t=110579" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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