Help me pick a climbing bike

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
BmanX
Posts: 3920
Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2005 5:31 pm

by BmanX

Agreed. Here is the issue I have. For years I have said that Aero and Light is Right and we are finally there. There is no point in talking climbing bike vs ww bikes any longer as they are now one in the same. You can now get a very light aero bike and life is good.
BIG DADDY B FLOW
AERO & LIGHT is RIGHT

Cervelo SLC 5960g/13.13 lbs

by Weenie


rlanger
Posts: 306
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2016 11:53 am

by rlanger

UpFromOne wrote:
Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:51 pm
I don't know about the rest of you, but descending my long climbs, aero is of no consideration to me. My non-aero bike goes down the grades plenty fast enough!
Agreed.

I don't race, so aero is not the most important consideration to me. I really don't care that an aero frame will be 17 seconds faster than my frame over 40k at 45kph. Geez, I'd have to be going downhill the entire way to get those gains.

However, I am trying to optimize for aero where I can. I've cleaned up the cables as much as possible, just ordered an Aerofly II bar, I wear race cut jersey and bibs, and next, I will eventually get aero wheels and an aero road helmet when my current helmet needs replacing.

Most importantly, I try to stay strong and flexible so that I can maintain an aero position on my bike, without which, any gains you might get from an aero frame, are lost.

smartyiak
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:20 pm

by smartyiak

reedplayer wrote:
Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:17 pm
aha, and especially on long, fast downhills in the mountain area, lets say the alpes, under windy conditions, you will "love" your aero bike.

"From hors categorie climbs to cut-throat classics, this is the choice for top pros like CCC Team leader Greg Van Avermaet who need one machine to do it all"

https://www.giant-bicycles.com/gb/bikes ... ed-sl-2020

exceptionally i quote marketing. from "giant" promoting the TCR Advanced SL 2020. and they are right. this, fo example, is an appropriate bike for the mountains.

aero embellishment wont help in the slightest in this area, on the contrary.
Our LBS got one of these the other day:
https://www.giant-bicycles.com/gb/tcr-a ... c-red-2020

I've never been a fan of Giant, but this bike is very attractive in person (moreso than the pictures seem). And, since most of us are just pikers anyways, we might as well get something light AND good looking. :D

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cyclespeed
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Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 8:45 am

by cyclespeed

One thing to bear in mind is that if it's a windy, blustery day, you could be worse off on an aero bike.

Because any yaw at all (i.e. wind not directly in front or behind) will catch the larger surface area of an aero bike (especially with deep wheels) and destabilise it. Constantly having to mini correct your trajectory is tiring. In addition, if you are being pushed around on descents then you will be slower too, because you have less confidence in the bends.

BmanX
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Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2005 5:31 pm

by BmanX

Not sure I agree. The modern aero bike is designed in such a way that the tubes are almost the same size as a standard bike. Aero optimization does not mean a larger surface area. Also a light set of 45/50mm aero wheels are not going to cause what you are describing. Maybe a set of 80/90mm but who is using those anyways on a light weight aero set up.
BIG DADDY B FLOW
AERO & LIGHT is RIGHT

Cervelo SLC 5960g/13.13 lbs

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cyclespeed
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Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 8:45 am

by cyclespeed

Most aero bikes have a greater side on surface area than a 'climbing bike' .They are trying to follow the 1:3 rule and therefore have thin but deep sections.

You only have to see all the people complaining about twitchy 50mm wheels in the wind to understand how it IS an issue, (although not as bad as some make out). There is simply much more side surface on a 50mm wheel than a 30mm one, that's basic maths.

These aero bikes are designed in wind tunnels that have little correlation with the real word. The wind is steady and constant angle, which it is not in real life.

I have ridden a Trek Madone with 60mm wheels on a strong, blustery day, and it was not a pleasant experience, certainly not fast.

quadlt250
Posts: 49
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2015 10:25 pm

by quadlt250

cyclespeed wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 6:42 pm
Most aero bikes have a greater side on surface area than a 'climbing bike' .They are trying to follow the 1:3 rule and therefore have thin but deep sections.

You only have to see all the people complaining about twitchy 50mm wheels in the wind to understand how it IS an issue, (although not as bad as some make out). There is simply much more side surface on a 50mm wheel than a 30mm one, that's basic maths.

These aero bikes are designed in wind tunnels that have little correlation with the real word. The wind is steady and constant angle, which it is not in real life.

I have ridden a Trek Madone with 60mm wheels on a strong, blustery day, and it was not a pleasant experience, certainly not fast.
Have you tested at all? The gap between aero and non-aero frames grows when it's windy. Under zero yaw they can be quite close.

Hexsense
Posts: 1291
Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:41 am

by Hexsense

cyclespeed wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 6:42 pm
The wind is steady and constant angle, which it is not in real life.
quadlt250 wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 11:18 pm
Have you tested at all? The gap between aero and non-aero frames grows when it's windy. Under zero yaw they can be quite close.
No, you are confusing.
The test suggest the aero road bike is faster when the wind is at angle (but consistent).

Wind at angle is different to wind not moving in straight line. Almost all the test in wind tunnel even with yaw angle assume wind to be steady.
Watch this for a few minutes to see what we meant: https://youtu.be/lwrCrU4KG-I?t=363 .
Last edited by Hexsense on Wed Sep 25, 2019 11:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Hexsense
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Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:41 am

by Hexsense

delete: duplicate post by mistake, meant to just edit original post.

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cveks
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by cveks

Argon 18 Gallium Pro. Nothing beats that.

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cveks
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by cveks

BmanX wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 2:55 pm
Not sure I agree. The modern aero bike is designed in such a way that the tubes are almost the same size as a standard bike. Aero optimization does not mean a larger surface area. Also a light set of 45/50mm aero wheels are not going to cause what you are describing. Maybe a set of 80/90mm but who is using those anyways on a light weight aero set up.
I disagree.

2 Weeks ago I went on a ride with a friend who is ex pro and rides whole life , he was on Scott Addict with 50 mm wheels I was riding Argon 18 Gallium Pro with 38 mm wheels.

After some time we got hit by strong crosswind. He almost fell of his bike, and he is not light he has 82 kgs, and I just got some like breeze experience. So if you ask me for regular use, I would not ever ride again anything deeper than 38mm. 38mm have best of both worlds. I think 50mm is good only for big race events where you ride in big groups so crosswind push is less present.

andreas
Posts: 193
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:21 pm

by andreas

I've been riding on 50mm this year (Roval CL50), mostly used to ride on 28mm alu clinchers before that. The difference in crosswinds is noticable, but there have only been 1 instance where I had to start braking because I felt it would be unsafe. That was going downhill at 80 km/h with around 8 m/s crosswinds at an open mountain plains at 1300m altidude. I regularily experience slight flinching of the front wheel tire when going downhill though, but it's not really a problem with my 80+ kg.
I would probably go 38mm if I lived in a windy area.

Bryin
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:43 am

by Bryin

Giant makes the best carbon bikes. Yes, I know it is hard to accept that a mainstream brand that focuses on value rather than marketing is better than the "super bikes" but it is true. Giant makes their own carbon, in their own factory. Except for Time, no oher brand does that. Giant's R&D budget blows away every other manufacturer. A few years ago Giant did some testing and the TCR blew everything else out of the water in terms of stiffness to weight and they proved that their weight was right there at the top, if not the top. I have ridden every high end bike out there (I owned a business reselling high end bikes plus I have owned a bunch personally) and Giant is the top.

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