Which Bottom Bracket

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
moonoi
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by moonoi

If you do go the CeramicSpeed option, you don't need to buy the tool, the CeramicSpeed replacement BB also comes with the tool in the box.

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Foxman50
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Joined: Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:40 pm

by Foxman50

Will the Ceramicspeed tool fit the Colnago unit, or are the splines different

by Weenie


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Calnago
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by Calnago

@moonoi: are the Ceramic Speed BB splines the same as on the Threadfit cups?...so you can use the same tool for both? I’ve not done any Ceramic Speed options at this point, as I mostly deal with Campy stuff, and i really do prefer the Campy CULT bearings with Campy cups. Easy peasy, looks great, machined to exacting tolerances, and works.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

TobinHatesYou
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by TobinHatesYou

The BB comes with a plastic adapter that fits into your existing Campy tool. In the same vein as Shimano threaded BBs with their various different external cup circumferences...what’s needed is supplied.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Tobin, if you actually worked on any of this stuff you’d know that most people don’t have the existing Colnago tool (it’s not a Campy tool). It does not automatically come with the frame. It did briefly when the C60 was first introduced, but by and large most people who have purchased a C60 likely would not have the Colnago tool for their Threadfit cups. That’s why I was asking Moonoi.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

TobinHatesYou
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by TobinHatesYou

Yes, but you have a Campy tool and I was replying to you. The Colnago "tool" is just another adapter, is it not?

e: Okay so it seems there's two adapters, a 16t/44mm to Colnago adapter and a Colnago to CS adapter. Good on them. So the package does provide everything needed to remove the Colnago BB and install the CS BB.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

There are a couple people on the forum now asking about their C60's, and various Bottom Brackets by either SRAM or Shimano. No one is talking about Campy at all in this context. The Colnago Threadfit cups are a Colnago item, nothing at all to do with Campy. The tool to remove the Threadfits cups is this, third item from the left...
Image
The cuplike looking tool (second from left), is a Cyclus product which fits over top of the Threadfit tool, or in the alternative you could use a 1/2" drive socket wrench. So, you need the Colnago tool to remove the Threadfit cups, and I don't believe this is the same tool for the Ceramic Speed BB's.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

TobinHatesYou
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by TobinHatesYou

Top adapter is Colnago->CS.
Bottom adapter is like your 16t/44mm->Colnago (similar to the one you own, but plastic)

So you use your Cyclus adapter + adapter to remove the Colnago. Then inception time because you add the top adapter to install the CS. Or you just use the socket driver of course.
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Calnago
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by Calnago

Ok, so they are supplying the Threadfit tool, albeit plastic. Not sure I like the idea of plastic at all for this application, especially if you're trying to apply a specific torque to it, but I guess they assume it's a one use event, and only to remove the Threadfit cups so you can install the Ceramic Speed option in it's place. I don't think Ceramic Speed supplied the Threadfit tool when they first introduced the T45 stuff, so good to know they do now. I suppose the Ceramic Speed option might be a nice upgrade for SRAM or Shimano users, at a price of course. Still, I think I'd rather just use whatever adapters fit into the Threadfit cups directly (BB86) versus messing with the Threadfit cups themselves. They are really providing a barrier of durability between the pressfit adaptors of your choice and the shell itself, which ensures the longevity of your frame, unlike most any other pressfit BB shell I can think of these days.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

moonoi
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by moonoi

Calnago wrote:
Mon Jul 22, 2019 9:34 pm
Ok, so they are supplying the Threadfit tool, albeit plastic. Not sure I like the idea of plastic at all for this application, especially if you're trying to apply a specific torque to it, but I guess they assume it's a one use event, and only to remove the Threadfit cups so you can install the Ceramic Speed option in it's place. I don't think Ceramic Speed supplied the Threadfit tool when they first introduced the T45 stuff, so good to know they do now. I suppose the Ceramic Speed option might be a nice upgrade for SRAM or Shimano users, at a price of course. Still, I think I'd rather just use whatever adapters fit into the Threadfit cups directly (BB86) versus messing with the Threadfit cups themselves. They are really providing a barrier of durability between the pressfit adaptors of your choice and the shell itself, which ensures the longevity of your frame, unlike most any other pressfit BB shell I can think of these days.
Apologies for late reply, I'm on the opposite side of the planet to you (Thailand) 8)

I bought mine as soon as it was announced early 2018 and available to buy on the CS Webstore, it came with the tool to remove the Colnago TF cups, so I believe its always been supplied. Not sure if it is the same if you buy the Colnago branded CS T45 BB though.

The plastic tool is suprisingly robust and doesn't damage the cups on installing, don't see any wear or warping on it from torquing it up correctly, then again it also isn't something I'd expect to use often, so don't know how it would hold up to repeated usage.

To be honest the only reason I can see for swapping out the Colnago TF cups is if you want to install a BB30 crankset for whatever reason, otherwise it's better to just press in a PF BB for whatever group/crankset you're using, and it will remain creak free.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

moonoi wrote:To be honest the only reason I can see for swapping out the Colnago TF cups is if you want to install a BB30 crankset for whatever reason, otherwise it's better to just press in a PF BB for whatever group/crankset you're using, and it will remain creak free.
Agreed, using the T45 options for 30mm spindles would allow for proper size bearings. But I’d never opt for the T45 over say, a Campy Super Record install using the $30 cups. The CULT bearings, with the treated races, I believe are simply superior and come with the crank anyway, so why spend another $400 or so to use the T45.

And then someone else was looking to do a SRAM DUB install which you could go with the T45 solutions as well, but I thought DUB has a BB86 option? If that’s the case, I’d just leave the Threadfit cups and use the BB86 DUB solution.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

moonoi
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by moonoi

Yeah, DUB has a PF/BB86 option, so again best to go with pressing those in the existing cups as you say.

Foxman50
Posts: 28
Joined: Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:40 pm

by Foxman50

Many thanks for the replies above, this really helps. From what i see and read the C60 frame comes with a bonded to the frame threaded section, which is not the norm.

Into this there are threaded cups which have a smooth inner section to which you put press fit bearings, and within this is the spindle.

So reading above, it would seem best not to remove the threadfit cups and just replace the press fit bearings and spindle. Is that correct. Only thing is all i see available are the complete BB assemblies. Would one of you kindly post a link to just the bearings and spindle.

Also does the BB86 relate to just the spindle which I believe is 24mm? On the Ultegra that i have that is.

Would the bearings in the ceramicspeed T45 fit straight into the Colnago thread fit cups.

alcatraz
Posts: 2153
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Inspect the original bearings and their dust covers. If you attempt to replace only the bearings make sure they are compatible with the old dust covers. Some dust covers have a lip that integrates with a special non standard bearing design.

A trick I learned to ensure proper dust covers and high quality bearings (no fakes) is to get the "wrong" but cheap original bb and extract the bearings.

A bb90 gxp bb costs 5 times much as a bb86 gxp bb. All you need to do is extract the bearings from the bb86 and install them into the bb90 frame. Careful though, it needs to be investigated well beforehand to ensure compatibility.

by Weenie


moonoi
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Location: Earth

by moonoi

Foxman50 wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:33 am
Many thanks for the replies above, this really helps. From what i see and read the C60 frame comes with a bonded to the frame threaded section, which is not the norm.

Into this there are threaded cups which have a smooth inner section to which you put press fit bearings, and within this is the spindle.

So reading above, it would seem best not to remove the threadfit cups and just replace the press fit bearings and spindle. Is that correct. Only thing is all i see available are the complete BB assemblies. Would one of you kindly post a link to just the bearings and spindle.

Also does the BB86 relate to just the spindle which I believe is 24mm? On the Ultegra that i have that is.

Would the bearings in the ceramicspeed T45 fit straight into the Colnago thread fit cups.
The spindle is part of your crankset not the BB in this application. For Ultegra just fit one of these in to the existing Colnago ThreadFit cups https://www.competitivecyclist.com/shim ... om-bracket

That's it, you might want to install with some Morgans Blue Aquaproof paste, as per Calnagos guidelines in his many very useful build threads.

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