Silca Superpista Digital pump review.

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
MrMagura
Posts: 86
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:38 pm

by MrMagura

Let me take a wild guess here. The 100% test doesn't seem to test the chuck and the hose?
Else something like what I and Coresare see wouldn't be possible.
Rather the test is working as following:
The pump function is tested, using the same chuck and hose, for all the pumps tested.
Then the QC guy picks a new chuck and hose from the stock, and pack it.

Squeezing the hose around the handle, has no chance to work, as the hose is too stiff to straighten from the weight of the Hiro chuck.
We're not talking marginals here.....
It also doesn't help it much, that should the chuck actually get in the vicinity of the magnet, the chuck head keeps the tip from reaching the magnet.
Go pick up a pump and have a look at it, if you disagree with this!

Leaving the Hiro chuck in the open position also wasn't tested, as the wing interferes with the pump.

Again, claiming 18 month of testing on top levels of racing, and 100% end QC, yet delivering a product with that many fairly obvious issues.
I fail to see how it can go so wrong, if the above claims are correct.

by Weenie


mattr
Posts: 4673
Joined: Fri May 25, 2007 6:43 pm
Location: The Grim North.

by mattr

joshatsilca wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 12:47 pm
Hambini mentions that the hose side of the presta is always lower than the tire, this is true, the air flows into the tire with each stroke and then begins to backflow to equalize the entire system which is when the valve closes. We've measured this to be ~0.1-0.25psi difference.
Need to try it with a 2 year old valve on a tubeless MTB set up........ ;) More like 10-25 psi going by some of the ones i see.

RocketRacing
Posts: 832
Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

I can 110% say that my superpista digital has no magnet issues, and no docking issues with the magnet and hiro head. The connections is perfect, and strong. The position of the hiro lever does not effect it. Even if i am lazy, and just get the chuck to partly touch the magnet, i am still good.

I also have no issue with the hose reaching the magnet dock. I would call it snug, but easy to do. I would call the tube length “perfect”. Loop the hose under the hose catch at the bottom of the pump and you are good. No real stretch, no flappy hose.

I would be curious to compare to the above pump that is causing the poster grief.

RocketRacing
Posts: 832
Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

mattr wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 1:59 pm
Need to try it with a 2 year old valve on a tubeless MTB set up........ ;) More like 10-25 psi going by some of the ones i see.
Yeah, good point. Haha. Been there.

Thanks to hambini and others regarding the one way valve explenation. Makes sense. I had never really thought of the engineering till now.

In my view, the differences between true “in the tire pressure” vs “what the gauge sees” is not a big deal, as long as my gauge is consistent. Like psi or bar, the numbers are just placeholders. I don’t care what the real pressure is, as much as i want it to be repeatable to high accuracy.

No one knows what pressure is “the best” anyway, the key is generating consistent and repeatable numbers to work with to find what is best. Now, it would be more significant if the difference between tire and gauge pressure were significant, and/or very non-linear (i.e. the higher the tire pressure, the greater the difference between what your gauge sees and what is in the tire). But even then, as long as things are consistent and repeatable, and i know the level of drift, i am good.

That being said, we are splitting the hairs of hairs, and i love it.
Last edited by RocketRacing on Thu May 09, 2019 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

MrMagura
Posts: 86
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:38 pm

by MrMagura

As you can see in the pic, the tip of the Hiro chuck, is shorter than the edge around the magnet is tall.
So the tip will only connect to the magnet, if guided by hand, while bending the hose around the handle with the other hand.
So you have to crawl around on the ground to make it work.
.......the result of 18 month of testing on top levels of racing :roll:
Attachments
IMG_20190509_152321.jpg

kode54
Posts: 1608
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm

by kode54

MrMagura wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 12:38 pm
coresare wrote:
Wed May 08, 2019 8:10 pm
I have the Silca Superpista Ultimate with their Hiro chuck. Saying the action of pumping is smooth like butter is a bit of a stretch imo. Don't get me wrong. I don't regret getting it, but unless you had some super crappy pump, the smoothness of the stroke isn't that noticeable. Also when you lift the pump up past the last couple inches or so it catches a bit so I avoid lifting up all the way. My gauge is also stuck at 20 psi even when not attached to a bike, but luckily Silca is sending me out a replacement gauge. As far as the magnet being super strong I don't know if I got a dud, but I have to make sure the hose is very taut going over the handle and onto the dock for it to stay or it just pops off when using the regular presta chuck. I feel like they cut the hose a tad too short on mine. I'm not one to sugar coat things, but I've used some cheaper pumps like from Topeak and they work very well also including the chucks. How accurate they all are is something hard for most of us to actually ever be able to measure.
....The Hiro head also doesn't fit the magnet base, as the edge around the magnet, is taller than the tip of the chuck is protruding from the head, meaning that unless it's placed very accurately, the magnetic tip won't reach the magnet.
One would think that after, and I quote:

"18 months of testing, use and abuse at the top levels of racing"

.......that someone would have managed to iron out the most obvious design flaws. I'd be extremely curious to have a couple of names of the mechanics that were involved in this rigorious and long test, besides Stevie Wonder that is.
The magnet dock was original to the other chuck. I did try the Hiro on the Ultimate SuperPista and didn't like the way it docked with the shorter hose. i think a reoriented magnetic dock needs to be upgraded with this pump (verical instead of horizontal) like on the SuperPista Digital.
- Factor 02 Disc + DA9170 + Enve 4.5AR CK CL hubs
- Moots Vamoots Disc RSL Titanium + DA9170 + Enve 3.4AR CK CL hubs
- Parlee Altum + DA9150 + Enve SES 4.5 Ene carbon hubs
- Argonaut Spacebike 2.0 + DA9170 + Enve SES 5.6 DT Swiss 240 CL hubs

MrMagura
Posts: 86
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:38 pm

by MrMagura

Agreed.
The Hiro chuck simply doesn't fit. One would think that had been found out during 18 months of testing.
Just like it probably would have dawned on somebody, that red braided brake hose, probably is better saved for the intended purpose, despite the great looks.

I initially reached out to Silca customer support, but that has proven to be a complete waste of time.

Getting the runaround, ultimately getting offered an identical replacement hose (which in the first place is useless and would have to be replaced with a rubber hose to make the pump of any use) as a solution to the fact, that the design of the Hiro chuck, doesn't work with the design of the magnetic dock.

Somehow I think I'll pass on that offer :roll:

joshatsilca
Posts: 20
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2019 4:52 pm

by joshatsilca

MrMagura wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 5:18 pm
Agreed.
The Hiro chuck simply doesn't fit. One would think that had been found out during 18 months of testing.
Just like it probably would have dawned on somebody, that red braided brake hose, probably is better saved for the intended purpose, despite the great looks.

I initially reached out to Silca customer support, but that has proven to be a complete waste of time.

Getting the runaround, ultimately getting offered an identical replacement hose (which in the first place is useless and would have to be replaced with a rubber hose to make the pump of any use) as a solution to the fact, that the design of the Hiro chuck, doesn't work with the design of the magnetic dock.

Somehow I think I'll pass on that offer :roll:
Let me make sure we're all on the same page... you reached out to us with this issue and we offered replacement parts for the 'too short hose', but you don't want the replacement because the problem is more that the HIRO doesn't fit the dock? Not being difficult, just wanting to be clear as these would be totally separate issues, one is a QC/manufacturing problem which we as a company should own and make right for our customer and it sounds like that was attempted. The other issue would be a design problem or a much more significant manufacturing problem, and while it is 100% true that the chuck dock was originally designed for the bell shaped chuck, we designed the HIRO chuck specifically in a way that it works in this dock and the symmetric top and bottom edges of the HIRO clear the tapered sides of the dock and actually help align the chuck as it enters the dock. So again, it could be possible that there is some sort of manufacturing problem with one part or another as we have sold thousands of these things over the last few years and this is the fist time I've ever heard of anybody so frustrated and upset with this (or any other) feature of this pump.

Can you please get me a photo of your pump from the side so I can see the hose, and also some clear images of the chuck in the dock? We pride ourselves on top level customer service and the industry's best warranty and spare parts support, if there is a problem we will do what it takes to solve it even if I have to send you all new parts or replace the pump. You can post here or send to sales@silca.cc

Josh
Owner of SILCA
Check out my Tech Blog: https://blog.silca.cc
Stories of the Tech behind the Tech: https://marginalgainspodcast.cc

joshatsilca
Posts: 20
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2019 4:52 pm

by joshatsilca

Sorry, looks like our guys pulled this video in order to replace it with a new one.. but we haven't done the new video yet so I just reposted the original crappy video.. sorry for the poor production value!
Josh

https://youtu.be/RQS2mXyjUmA
Owner of SILCA
Check out my Tech Blog: https://blog.silca.cc
Stories of the Tech behind the Tech: https://marginalgainspodcast.cc

MrMagura
Posts: 86
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:38 pm

by MrMagura

Yes, it can work occasionally, when you have straightened the hose before trying to make it catch the dock.
In reality the hose is bent after each use, and will not return to straight by itself.
I have no account on Youtube, so you'll have to just take a look at the video already recorded and sent to your support. In that video, it's painfully obvious that it's not working.
Then take a chuck and measure the length of the tip, and see if it's shorter than the edge around the magnet is tall.

......and yes, I don't bother spending time replacing one hose that doesn't work, for another hose that also is unsuitable for the job, when the general issue is the fact that the dock doesn't fit the chuck.
That's simply waste of time.
If you should get around to actually fixing the design issues, you have my mail, drop me a line, but I'm not wasting more time on this.
Had I instead spent the time on fixing the issues, I would have had a working pump by now, but as I explained your support, I paid $450 for a pump in order not to have to fix it straight out of the box.

For the record, no, I'm not frustrated about the poor performance of the product, or the lack of quality control, but rather that I was dumb enough to buy into your marketing, actually believeing in you, telling it's a well tested and high quality product.
It honestly hurts my pride!

coresare
Posts: 104
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 8:19 am

by coresare

I uploaded a few videos of my Silca SuperPista Utlimate

First video is how you cant just push the Presta Chuck onto the dock. Only way for it to actually hold is if you pinch the tubing where it wraps around the handle.
https://youtu.be/DOwxH_75bqA

This video is docking the Hiro Chuck. Since it's longer, it docks fine. The previous poster said he had trouble docking it, but it works just fine.
https://youtu.be/P6LLTMXhLMw

This video is showing how the pump catches when you reach the top. Maybe Josh can chime in if this is just normal and to just not bring it up so high. Also the gauge is stuck at like 22 psi, but Silca has good customer service and is shipping out another gauge. It is taking a bit of time though. Original email was sent Sunday April 28 and it still hasn't left the post office yet. This was 9 working days ago. Tracking says the post office has received it as of 2 days ago, but is pending?
https://youtu.be/YW5CsxZHKGE

This is using the Presta Chuck which is superb. It goes on easily, has never blown off during pumping, and comes off easily. I do only pump it to 90 psi max though.
https://youtu.be/Fcp30y8F_ak

This one is just using the Silca Hiro chuck..
https://youtu.be/_eSw9zVsr8E
Last edited by coresare on Thu May 09, 2019 9:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

MrMagura
Posts: 86
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:38 pm

by MrMagura

coresare wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:41 pm


This video is docking the Hiro Chuck. Since it's longer, it docks fine. The previous poster said he had trouble docking it, but it works just fine.
https://youtu.be/P6LLTMXhLMw
I think your chuck is different, or the edge around the magnet is lower.
When you have the tip of the Hiro chuck resting on the magnet, it looks like you have space between the head of the chuck and the edge, also if the head is above the edge?

EDIT:
Just took the magnet assembly apart.
Surprise surprise, the edge around the magnet is 1.3mm taller than the tip of the chuck is long.
That can't possibly work, as the tip can't reach the surface of the magnet, unless it's dead center, which it obviously rarely is in reality.
So much for 100% end quality control :lol:

Js2
Posts: 109
Joined: Mon May 08, 2017 6:55 pm

by Js2

I have the Pista Ultimate Hiro edition like @coresare. I don't have any issues with the magnet or length to dock the hiro head to the magnetic base.

The only part where the hose bends is at the top of the handle where there is a little ridge for it to sit on. Hose length on mine is definitely just nice as it sits nice and secure once the head is attached to the magnetic base.

RocketRacing
Posts: 832
Joined: Thu May 10, 2018 2:43 am

by RocketRacing

If my hose were short, i would be pretty upset too.

Now back to pumps... sorry for that innuendo. Ha.

A quick fix would be to stack another magnet. Or put a spacer below it. Or bend over (your back for better accuracy to the magnet, and the hose at the handle). Damn, all these years i have been bending and using two hands to secure a pump hose in place... i must be getting soft.

joshatsilca
Posts: 20
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2019 4:52 pm

by joshatsilca

coresare wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 9:41 pm
I uploaded a few videos of my Silca SuperPista Utlimate

First video is how you cant just push the Presta Chuck onto the dock. Only way for it to actually hold is if you pinch the tubing where it wraps around the handle.
https://youtu.be/DOwxH_75bqA

This video is docking the Hiro Chuck. Since it's longer, it docks fine. The previous poster said he had trouble docking it, but it works just fine.
https://youtu.be/P6LLTMXhLMw

This video is showing how the pump catches when you reach the top. Maybe Josh can chime in if this is just normal and to just not bring it up so high. Also the gauge is stuck at like 22 psi, but Silca has good customer service and is shipping out another gauge. It is taking a bit of time though. Original email was sent Sunday April 28 and it still hasn't left the post office yet. This was 9 working days ago. Tracking says the post office has received it as of 2 days ago, but is pending?
https://youtu.be/YW5CsxZHKGE

This is using the Presta Chuck which is superb. It goes on easily, has never blown off during pumping, and comes off easily. I do only pump it to 90 psi max though.
https://youtu.be/Fcp30y8F_ak

This one is just using the Silca Hiro chuck..
https://youtu.be/_eSw9zVsr8E
Coresare,

So the gauge issue is from the first year or so of production of this pump and is related to the laboratory grade gauges.. they are 1% and all this other great stuff, but they just lacked the robustness to handle salty air and a few other real world conditions like that and we did a whole redesign. The current gauges of of equivalent accuracy/precision but have all of their internals dipped in a thin elastomer coating for added corrosion resistance.

As for the stickiness at the top, our mtn bike suspension fork piston is only 12mm thick and we use a single bump stop ring at the top. Most pumps use a 30mm thick plastic piston + bump stop, so what you are seeing/feeling is just the effects of tiny misalignments at the top of the stroke. This can be solved with additional bump stop which takes up stroke, but will keep the piston from moving beyond the point where it can misalign to the point of getting sticky.. the tradeoff is a little bit of stick for an extra 20mm of stroke or vice versa. Easy to solve and we can certainly send you some bump rings if you like.

Best
J
Owner of SILCA
Check out my Tech Blog: https://blog.silca.cc
Stories of the Tech behind the Tech: https://marginalgainspodcast.cc

by Weenie


Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post