I find it more interesting that stock bikes are now more expensive than if bought by components where one can pick exactly what it wants.wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 2:41 pmI just checked the prices for new DA, absurd!
They seem to run more expensive than Campagnolo?
Dura-Ace R9200
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- MrCurrieinahurry
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What are they like?wheelsONfire wrote:I just checked the prices for new DA, absurd!
They seem to run more expensive than Campagnolo?
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you have to pay the assembler ..................pmprego wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 2:53 pmI find it more interesting that stock bikes are now more expensive than if bought by components where one can pick exactly what it wants.wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 2:41 pmI just checked the prices for new DA, absurd!
They seem to run more expensive than Campagnolo?
I was not disconsidering the labor cost from the bike shop.Ritxis wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:16 pmyou have to pay the assembler ..................pmprego wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 2:53 pmI find it more interesting that stock bikes are now more expensive than if bought by components where one can pick exactly what it wants.wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 2:41 pmI just checked the prices for new DA, absurd!
They seem to run more expensive than Campagnolo?
It's particularly relevant as there is no stock bike that comes exactly how I want it.
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Nah, stock bikes always have components you want/ need to change.
I also wonder, for you who have integrated bar/ stems on your bikes. Since you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
I also wonder, for you who have integrated bar/ stems on your bikes. Since you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
you race/pedal what you get. you can't be pickywheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:44 pmNah, stock bikes always have components you want/ need to change.
I also wonder, for you who have integrated bar/ stems on your bikes. Since you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
Today bicycles are "bought" to show them on Instagram and forums .... not to ride with them .........wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:44 pmNah, stock bikes always have components you want/ need to change.
I also wonder, for you who have integrated bar/ stems on your bikes. Since you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
The downside is that you can't take the shortcut of angling the handlebar instead of moving the levers on the bar when you are too lazy to deal with the bar tape. Wonky bar angle doesn't mean "I wanted a different hoods angle", it means "I wanted a different hoods angle and I was lazy".wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:44 pmSince you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
(yes, nobody would want an integrated cockpit on a rental)
Just go say that to alaphilippe and his mechanics. Those lazy guys!!usr wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:18 pmThe downside is that you can't take the shortcut of angling the handlebar instead of moving the levers on the bar when you are too lazy to deal with the bar tape. Wonky bar angle doesn't mean "I wanted a different hoods angle", it means "I wanted a different hoods angle and I was lazy".wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:44 pmSince you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
(yes, nobody would want an integrated cockpit on a rental)
And the worst of all is that they just assembled a custom painted new bike and were lazy again as the handlebar is again shifted!!
- wheelsONfire
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- Location: NorthEU
Haha, one guy in one company told me what the most stupid innovations recently was, one of them was (is) integrated bar /stempmprego wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:36 pmJust go say that to alaphilippe and his mechanics. Those lazy guys!!usr wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:18 pmThe downside is that you can't take the shortcut of angling the handlebar instead of moving the levers on the bar when you are too lazy to deal with the bar tape. Wonky bar angle doesn't mean "I wanted a different hoods angle", it means "I wanted a different hoods angle and I was lazy".wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:44 pmSince you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
(yes, nobody would want an integrated cockpit on a rental)
And the worst of all is that they just assembled a custom painted new bike and were lazy again as the handlebar is again shifted!!
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
I don't even see the big advantage.wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 6:07 pmHaha, one guy in one company told me what the most stupid innovations recently was, one of them was (is) integrated bar /stempmprego wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:36 pmJust go say that to alaphilippe and his mechanics. Those lazy guys!!usr wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:18 pmThe downside is that you can't take the shortcut of angling the handlebar instead of moving the levers on the bar when you are too lazy to deal with the bar tape. Wonky bar angle doesn't mean "I wanted a different hoods angle", it means "I wanted a different hoods angle and I was lazy".wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:44 pmSince you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
(yes, nobody would want an integrated cockpit on a rental)
And the worst of all is that they just assembled a custom painted new bike and were lazy again as the handlebar is again shifted!!
As far as I can see there is no advantage in weight, probably more expensive. Is it aerodynamics?
Specialized SL7 - 7.1kg including Garmin mount, bottle cages and pedals
Got me. But make that "in 99 of 100 cases", happy now?pmprego wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:36 pmJust go say that to alaphilippe and his mechanics. Those lazy guys!!usr wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:18 pmThe downside is that you can't take the shortcut of angling the handlebar instead of moving the levers on the bar when you are too lazy to deal with the bar tape. Wonky bar angle doesn't mean "I wanted a different hoods angle", it means "I wanted a different hoods angle and I was lazy".wheelsONfire wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:44 pmSince you can't angle handlebar, have you never experienced the downside of this?
(yes, nobody would want an integrated cockpit on a rental)
And the worst of all is that they just assembled a custom painted new bike and were lazy again as the handlebar is again shifted!!
I'd say that for the large majority of "bar twisters", being forced by the integrated cockpit to skip the shortcut is an improvement, not a downside. (and I'd still prefer living in a world where the integrated cockpit fashion never happened, but not because I consider the lack of bar angle creativity a major loss)
Head tube angle come in a range of 71.2 degree to 73.5 degree on road bike. Then some people use same size tires and some use bigger(and taller tire) in the back. Some use the same tire pressure which result in rear tire compress to the ground more. Some use softer front tire. All that effect effective head tube angle.
Integrated bar assume certain bar orientation and bar orientation preference which might be in a ballpark for many people. But not every cases.
Integrated bar assume certain bar orientation and bar orientation preference which might be in a ballpark for many people. But not every cases.
Disagree, I and all my friends rotate the bar for how they feel in the drop and bar top (aero road flat surface top) first. Sometime this is before even fitting the shifters on. Then that bar rotation is set, we adjust hood angle later.usr wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 6:22 pmI'd say that for the large majority of "bar twisters", being forced by the integrated cockpit to skip the shortcut is an improvement, not a downside. (and I'd still prefer living in a world where the integrated cockpit fashion never happened, but not because I consider the lack of bar angle creativity a major loss)
Maybe I have the wrong friends then Bar angle seems to be well in the range of "just set it to something that doesn't look wrong", lever angle varies wildly by taste. Except when a wild lever angle was achieved by bar twisting. Certainly not on Alaphillipe's bike, he seems be be the rare exception of (slightly) stargazing levers on a (slightly) burrowing bar - with a far wider range of lever angles on Google image search than I would have expected.
What people very much do care about, in my perception, is drop shape. And inability to choose drop shape is something which I consider a far more pressing problem with integrated cockpits than inability to adjust bar angle. If you hate the drop, no amount of angling would fix it. This is particularly bad with cockpits that are not only integrating stem + handlebar but also include a proprietary steerer interface so that you can't go shopping for alternatives at all.
What people very much do care about, in my perception, is drop shape. And inability to choose drop shape is something which I consider a far more pressing problem with integrated cockpits than inability to adjust bar angle. If you hate the drop, no amount of angling would fix it. This is particularly bad with cockpits that are not only integrating stem + handlebar but also include a proprietary steerer interface so that you can't go shopping for alternatives at all.
Accounting for inflation they're basically the same as DA9100
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