Road Tubeless & Air Compressors

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
kode54
Posts: 1634
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm

by kode54

It probably has to do with ones initial experience with tubeless. When I first tried tubeless, I used Schwalbe Ones with Stans sealant. I had 2 leaks on different days...both of which didn't seem to seal the punctures and also had initial problems with rim tape. On my Moots, I have Hutchinson Sector 28mm on it with Orange sealant mainly because I'm using an Enve 4.5AR rim that is hookless...so, tubeless specific. Different experience entirely. Not sure if its the tire, sealant or rim tape, but so much better than my initial experience.
- Factor 02 Disc + DA9170 + Enve 4.5AR CK CL hubs
- Moots Vamoots Disc RSL Titanium + DA9170 + Enve 3.4AR CK CL hubs
- Parlee Altum + DA9150 + Enve SES 4.5 Ene carbon hubs
- Argonaut Spacebike 2.0 + DA9170 + Enve SES 5.6 DT Swiss 240 CL hubs

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ms6073
Posts: 2787
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2004 8:24 pm
Location: Houston, Texas

by ms6073

petert123 wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 1:20 pm
I still get punctures and by the number of threads on WW it's plain unreliable - don't see any threads about mounting tyres and tubes here?
I don't think anyone is advocating tubeless as a be all, end all solution as I still get punctures as well. The difference is that most of the time, I only find out after we finish a ride and I notice Orange Seal reside on the back of the seat tube, and on the occasion where I have to stop, I stab the tire with a dynaplug and 30-seconds later, we are once again rolling down the road. Sure setup is a bit more tedious but I am getting 3x the life with out of a set of 700x25 Schwalbe Pro One tires versus the Vittoria Corsa and latex tubes we used to ride. As for not threads on conventional clinchers, I am guessing you missed the recent Proper latex innertube mounting thread. :beerchug:
Michael - The Anaerobic Threshold is neither...

by Weenie


petert123
Posts: 60
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:02 pm

by petert123

ms6073 wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 2:57 pm
As for not threads on conventional clinchers, I am guessing you missed the recent Proper latex innertube mounting thread. :beerchug:
I probably should have said "not nearly as many threads...." :-). I really did try to like tubeless but in the end it is just unreliable for road - I know people are going to say it's great and I'm at fault, that's fine it must be me - my experience is it does not work with the amount of hassle it is also.

petert123
Posts: 60
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:02 pm

by petert123

kode54 wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 2:40 pm
It probably has to do with ones initial experience with tubeless. When I first tried tubeless, I used Schwalbe Ones with Stans sealant. I had 2 leaks on different days...both of which didn't seem to seal the punctures and also had initial problems with rim tape. On my Moots, I have Hutchinson Sector 28mm on it with Orange sealant mainly because I'm using an Enve 4.5AR rim that is hookless...so, tubeless specific. Different experience entirely. Not sure if its the tire, sealant or rim tape, but so much better than my initial experience.
I tend to agree, problem is you have to hit upon the setup that works for you - in the broad sense it's not so hit and miss with tyres and tubes, and has never been.

jfranci3
Posts: 729
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:21 pm

by jfranci3

CO2 cartridge. Just buy a box of them from amazon for $20. EDIT: this turns out to be bad advice as the CO2 freezes and clumps the goo, then leaves air so dry that the OK goo dries out quicker. If you put the good in, let it drain to the other side of the tire, then inflate from 12 o’clock position, you’re OK.

Also, note that some tubeless valves suck. E13 makes a nice looking one, but it is small diameter inside.
Last edited by jfranci3 on Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

sockpuppet
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:38 pm

by sockpuppet

My experience with the specialized sworks tubeless tires - ultra loose fitting bead, I'm able to install them on my Roval CL50 wheels with ease, no tools required. This makes for a painful tubeless setup, where I've had to use my large car shop compressor to help seat them, sometimes with no luck. Eventually I removed them both due to being fed up with sealant blowing everywhere, inconsistentcy in setting up, etc. My bike shop was able to warranty them for me, and I got my money back. I went back to my favorite Schwable Pro 1 25mm tubeless tire, and have no complaints so far. The Pro 1's are a b*tch to get onto the rim, but I can do it with the help of a Pedro's tire lever. They seat up without sealant, I still use the shop compressor since its easy and available, then I push sealant into the tire via injector.

For the price (~$45/tire USD) on Merlin Cycles, the Schwalbe's are hard to beat. Fast, easy to set up, and are wider than stated (27.5mm on my rims). I can run 75-85psi (I'm 85kg) and it delivers a great ride. I have no complaints, but would love to try the new Conti GP5000 TL.

AJS914
Posts: 3550
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

I'm thinking about trying the GP5000TL next but I keep hesitating because GP4000s with tubes have worked really really well for me. I hardly ever get flats - like one every 3,000 miles.

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ms6073
Posts: 2787
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2004 8:24 pm
Location: Houston, Texas

by ms6073

sockpuppet wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:02 pm
The Pro 1's are a b*tch to get onto the rim, but I can do it with the help of a Pedro's tire lever.
I am able to mount 700 x 25 Pro Ones on Nox Composites Falcor 36D wheels with relatively ease, but mounting G-One All-Around (700 x 40) on our Nox Citico disc gravel wheels with one layer of Schwalbe tape, still requires a tire jack, but pops instantly with our 25-gallon compressor and Milkit valves with cores installed.
Michael - The Anaerobic Threshold is neither...

dim
Posts: 540
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:25 am
Location: Cambridge UK

by dim

I don't quite understand all the neg comments about tubeless

it's dead easy .... fit the tyre /// add sealant and off you go ...

takes a bit longer to set them up (at first), but once they have been fitted, and sealant added .... your on the road

get a puncture.... 9 out of 10 times, the puncture seals from the latex..... if not, use a dynaplug (50 seconds), a few pumps and your off again

if it does not work .... add a tube and it takes the same time to sort as if you were using clinchers

the latex is not sticky and washes off with plain water

every 6 weeks add a bit of latex sealant

it's a no brainer .... get tubeless (thats why all the new top end bikes are being sold with tubeless ready wheels .... plus you can choose to ride with any tubeless tyres or any clincher tyres
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AJS914
Posts: 3550
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

It's obviously not that dead easy and simple. Lots of people have had issues. There is no standard with wheel diameter and the tire bead size. You get a wide variation from loose fitting to impossible to mount tires.

petert123
Posts: 60
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:02 pm

by petert123

AJS914 wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:44 am
It's obviously not that dead easy and simple. Lots of people have had issues. There is no standard with wheel diameter and the tire bead size. You get a wide variation from loose fitting to impossible to mount tires.
Yep - Josh from Silca admitted on the Cycling Tips podcast this week that the tubeless hassle factor is about the same as tubular, but in nearly all cases a tubular is still faster and isn't going to come off the rim if it goes down, so the pro's aren't going there yet fulltime. I'm not advocating tubular, for most clinchers are easier to live with, perhaps when there is a tubeless standard things will be better, we're all still going to get punctures, so there is always some luck involved.

I didn't have too many issues with the mounting and sealing, it's just that for me a puncture on the road never ever sealed - again it must just be me. I'd love to have seen someone plug one of my punctures quick enough that they could have just got riding again.

spartan
Posts: 1293
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 2:52 am

by spartan

the facts are tubulars are slower than clincher and clinchers are slower than tubeless tires. a tubular will not seal vs tubeless tire.
it is very hard for a tubeless tire to unseat from a hooked rim if it punctures and the sealant fails.

too much fake news . look at the data on bicyclerolling site.
Current Rides:

2018 Madone SLR DISC DI2 9XXX
2017 Giant TCR Advanced SL 0 DI2 9150

spartan
Posts: 1293
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 2:52 am

by spartan

Current Rides:

2018 Madone SLR DISC DI2 9XXX
2017 Giant TCR Advanced SL 0 DI2 9150

petert123
Posts: 60
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:02 pm

by petert123

spartan wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:49 pm
the facts are tubulars are slower than clincher and clinchers are slower than tubeless tires. a tubular will not seal vs tubeless tire.
it is very hard for a tubeless tire to unseat from a hooked rim if it punctures and the sealant fails.

too much fake news . look at the data on bicyclerolling site.
oh boy, nobody said a tubular would seal did they. looking at all the posts about different fitting experiences of tubeless tyres right now, I wouldn't want to say that a tubeless tyre isn't going to come off, would you?

by Weenie


AJS914
Posts: 3550
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

petert123 wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 12:30 pm
Yep - Josh from Silca admitted on the Cycling Tips podcast this week that the tubeless hassle factor is about the same as tubular, but in nearly all cases a tubular is still faster and isn't going to come off the rim if it goes down, so the pro's aren't going there yet fulltime.
One thing he glossed over was a tubular being 100 grams ligher than a tubeless tire plus sealeant and a tubular rim being 100 grams lighter than a clincher rim.

With most pro bikes I guess they could take 200 grams from somewhere else.

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