Campagnolo Long Cage RD-SR002M and Jockey Wheels Compatibility...

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3Pio
Posts: 1257
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:13 pm

by 3Pio

Im taking a look of some Campy parts and curios about compatibility between models...

1 .Pulley Wheels

For Record and 2018 SpareParts catalogue Part number of Record Pulleys is: RD-RE900

For Super Record in 2017 part number is: RD-SR600

In 2017 and 2015 catalogue part number for Record and Super Record Pulleys is: RD-SR500 (Both Record and Super Record share the same part number)

So are those all compatible with my Campagnolo Record Short Cage RD from 2015?

What are the difference between RD-SR600, RD-SR500 and RD-RE900? (ok, i know RD-SR600 have ceramic bearings.. But does RD-SR500 have them?)

And i can see part number for Chorus RD-CH500 and cant see the difference vs RD-RE900.. What is the difference here?


2. RD Cage

2018 Record: Short Cage RD-SR002S
Long Cage RD-RE102M

2018 SuperRecord: Short Cage RD-SR002S
Long Cage RD-SR002M

I guess difference between Record and SuperRecod here are included pulley Wheels (RD-SR600 for Super Record and RD-RE900 for Record)

2017 and 2015 Record and Super Record RD-SR202


So can i install cages with part numbers from 2018 to my 2015 RD?

Im thinking to upgrade to LongCage Super Record (RD-SR002M) (that way i'll upgrade my pulley wheels to SuperRecord and improve shifting i guess with LongCage ) So would this work? Should i order ?



Thanks

3Pio
Posts: 1257
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:13 pm

by 3Pio

Ok, since no reply hope some at least answer me this:

Is it worth to upgrade from Record RD-RE900 Wheel Pulleys (i guess bashings in lower pulley), to Record SR-600 where there is bearings... Is there any real world (reliability, i dont believe in saving watts here) benefit?

If yes, then maybe best to buy whole long cage (RD-SR002M) with included SR-600 pulleys, since there is not so big difference..

This way i'll have better Wheels Pulleys, and chance to ride 32 cassette in the future having a longer cage (and hoping that this cage is compatible with my Record 2015 RD)

by Weenie


morrisond
Posts: 946
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 8:34 pm

by morrisond

Hi - Although you can use the longer Cage on a 2015 RD (I have done it) - Campy would say that that puts too much stress on a non-HO RD. Campy Reinforced the Knuckle to take the additional stress - they do look different. I think as long as you don't cross chain you should be fine.

In regards to Pulley wheels - I believe even the SR wheels/pulleys have bushings in the upper wheel. I recently decided to upgrade an Potenza RD and instead of using SR pulleys - I bought some C-Bear Ceramics which have bearings on both Pulleys - plus they were cheaper than SR pulleys.

3Pio
Posts: 1257
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:13 pm

by 3Pio

morrisond wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 4:22 pm
Hi - Although you can use the longer Cage on a 2015 RD (I have done it) - Campy would say that that puts too much stress on a non-HO RD. Campy Reinforced the Knuckle to take the additional stress - they do look different. I think as long as you don't cross chain you should be fine.

In regards to Pulley wheels - I believe even the SR wheels/pulleys have bushings in the upper wheel. I recently decided to upgrade an Potenza RD and instead of using SR pulleys - I bought some C-Bear Ceramics which have bearings on both Pulleys - plus they were cheaper than SR pulleys.

Thanks morrisond..

What cassette geraring u ride? And why did u get long cage? To be able to clear 32 tooth cassette, or because of better performance even with smaller cassetes gearing?

I try to avoid cross chain, but sometimes on some rolling hills i can ride shortly 52/29 or 36/12 (not too often, but sometimes can happened)

So since i dont plan to use bigger cassete then 29 for now, probably better to stick with short cage or just to get pulleys..

About wheels/pulleys.. Do u actually feel any improvmenet regarding bearings vs bashings?

And do u maybe know if new part number RD-RE900 (record) and RD-SR600 (Superrecord), will be compatible with my RD from 2015 (including original short cage i have)

Attermann
Posts: 384
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:04 pm
Location: Denmark

by Attermann

The newest part number, aren’t those for 12 speed? I believe that they are 12t instead of 11t

3Pio
Posts: 1257
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:13 pm

by 3Pio

Attermann wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 8:41 pm
The newest part number, aren’t those for 12 speed? I believe that they are 12t instead of 11t
No.. It's 11S but probably this is HO version of deral. And i have 2015+ regular version of Record RD. For 2019 and 12s there is different part numbers..


https://www.campagnolo.com/media/files/ ... part_A.pdf

Check page number 14 and part number RD-SR002M.

Image

And still dont know if the pulleys wheels are cross compatible between 2018 (HO version), and 2015 (Non HO version)




This is 2015 part numbers/diagram.. Cant notice some big difference regarding attaching cage/pulley dimensions or some reinformencet at least visible on diagrams, so i guess they are cross compatible regarding cage/pulleys?

Image

graeme_f_k
Shop Owner / Manufacturer
Posts: 387
Joined: Mon May 26, 2008 12:21 pm
Location: UK
Contact:

by graeme_f_k

3Pio wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 5:01 pm
morrisond wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 4:22 pm
Hi - Although you can use the longer Cage on a 2015 RD (I have done it) - Campy would say that that puts too much stress on a non-HO RD. Campy Reinforced the Knuckle to take the additional stress - they do look different. I think as long as you don't cross chain you should be fine.

In regards to Pulley wheels - I believe even the SR wheels/pulleys have bushings in the upper wheel. I recently decided to upgrade an Potenza RD and instead of using SR pulleys - I bought some C-Bear Ceramics which have bearings on both Pulleys - plus they were cheaper than SR pulleys.
Thanks morrisond..

What cassette geraring u ride? And why did u get long cage? To be able to clear 32 tooth cassette, or because of better performance even with smaller cassetes gearing?

I try to avoid cross chain, but sometimes on some rolling hills i can ride shortly 52/29 or 36/12 (not too often, but sometimes can happened)

So since i dont plan to use bigger cassete then 29 for now, probably better to stick with short cage or just to get pulleys..

About wheels/pulleys.. Do u actually feel any improvmenet regarding bearings vs bashings?

And do u maybe know if new part number RD-RE900 (record) and RD-SR600 (Superrecord), will be compatible with my RD from 2015 (including original short cage i have)
Morrisond is correct, he's seen my earlier post on this question - the revison to the upper knuckle on the HO RD was in part to increase the resistance to torsion from the longer cage that is designed to fit the HO RDs - the pre-HO RDs are not suitably reinforced and we absolutely do not recommend this mod of a pre HO RD. The shaping was also changed to increase the clearance to the rear axle for bolt-through hubs.

The change in shape is obvious when you put the two versions of the RD next to each other - the lay-up is also changed.

The medium cage on the earlier RDs is also noticeably noisier in many cases.

HO pulleys are different to the earlier iterations - the upper pulley has taller teeth to improve shift performance esp. on wider range cassettes and the lower pulley has a bigger chamfer on the teeth to cope with the chain release angle increase that comes from the modified chainline where a 135mm rear end is in use for disc brake. These pulleys are reverse-compatible with all 11s RDs and are a recommended modification for users with frames where the rear derailleur hanger is *only just* in spec against Campagnolo spec - Colnago C60 and C64 being good examples.

Chorus, Record and Super Record 11s pulleys are completely interchangeable with each other, we recommend that they are used in pairs (i.e.HO pulleys with HO pulleys, non-HO with non-HO), remember that the upper and lower pulleys are different to each other and that the lower pully is directional.
A Tech-Reps work is never done ...
Head Tech, Campagnolo main UK ASC

by Weenie


3Pio
Posts: 1257
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:13 pm

by 3Pio

graeme_f_k wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 1:47 am
3Pio wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 5:01 pm
morrisond wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 4:22 pm
Hi - Although you can use the longer Cage on a 2015 RD (I have done it) - Campy would say that that puts too much stress on a non-HO RD. Campy Reinforced the Knuckle to take the additional stress - they do look different. I think as long as you don't cross chain you should be fine.

In regards to Pulley wheels - I believe even the SR wheels/pulleys have bushings in the upper wheel. I recently decided to upgrade an Potenza RD and instead of using SR pulleys - I bought some C-Bear Ceramics which have bearings on both Pulleys - plus they were cheaper than SR pulleys.
Thanks morrisond..

What cassette geraring u ride? And why did u get long cage? To be able to clear 32 tooth cassette, or because of better performance even with smaller cassetes gearing?

I try to avoid cross chain, but sometimes on some rolling hills i can ride shortly 52/29 or 36/12 (not too often, but sometimes can happened)

So since i dont plan to use bigger cassete then 29 for now, probably better to stick with short cage or just to get pulleys..

About wheels/pulleys.. Do u actually feel any improvmenet regarding bearings vs bashings?

And do u maybe know if new part number RD-RE900 (record) and RD-SR600 (Superrecord), will be compatible with my RD from 2015 (including original short cage i have)
Morrisond is correct, he's seen my earlier post on this question - the revison to the upper knuckle on the HO RD was in part to increase the resistance to torsion from the longer cage that is designed to fit the HO RDs - the pre-HO RDs are not suitably reinforced and we absolutely do not recommend this mod of a pre HO RD. The shaping was also changed to increase the clearance to the rear axle for bolt-through hubs.

The change in shape is obvious when you put the two versions of the RD next to each other - the lay-up is also changed.

The medium cage on the earlier RDs is also noticeably noisier in many cases.

HO pulleys are different to the earlier iterations - the upper pulley has taller teeth to improve shift performance esp. on wider range cassettes and the lower pulley has a bigger chamfer on the teeth to cope with the chain release angle increase that comes from the modified chainline where a 135mm rear end is in use for disc brake. These pulleys are reverse-compatible with all 11s RDs and are a recommended modification for users with frames where the rear derailleur hanger is *only just* in spec against Campagnolo spec - Colnago C60 and C64 being good examples.

Chorus, Record and Super Record 11s pulleys are completely interchangeable with each other, we recommend that they are used in pairs (i.e.HO pulleys with HO pulleys, non-HO with non-HO), remember that the upper and lower pulleys are different to each other and that the lower pully is directional.

Thanks graeme_f_k

This answer everything i want to know about upgradeing cage on my RD and i'll definetely stay on short one (since i wont use 32 cassette soon).

I noticed another change between Record RD i have from 2015, and Record RD i just bought brand new from my lbs (i guess it's 2017 model). And ill post about this just to be as info if someone else is interested...

THe tooths on older version are lets say 180 deg location, and on new almost 360.. There is 80% more teeth so that the lower cage had more adjustment for frames that wouldn’t allow the upper pulley to get close enough.

There is some pictures of this revision in my build thread: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/foru ... 5#p1455324

And also revised short cage version part number is RD-SR002S which include more tooth and updated pulleys and compatible with 2015 RD's (this info i just got from Campagnolo on email support.. Kudos to their support really)

Now the last question since i never had a chance to try Super Record pulleys with ceramic bearing in lower pulley..

@graeme_f_k (and other who have exact experience). Is there any real world benefit because of that bearing ? Worth it to pay three times more for RD-SR600 vs RD-RE900 pulleys?

Options i think about

1. Just to order RD-RE900 pulleys and use old non revised short cage (from 2015)

2. Just to order RD-SR600 pulleys, and use old non revised short cage (from 2015)

3. If it's worth to pay more for RD-SR600 vs RD-RE900, Since there is not so big difference in price from RD-SR600 to whole new short revised cage (RD-SR002S), to order RD-SR002S, that way i'll upgrade my pulleys also will have revised cage in term of more tooth for adjustment (both of my bikes have short chainstay 405mm and are on limit for Campy specs)

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