Cervelo / BBRight Bottom Bracket

[Roadrocket]

Good idea about pinned BB thread.

About my problem, if I won´t find Morgan Blue Paste I´ll finally use teflon grease. It´s quite possible I won´t find Morgan Paste, is there any alternative?


I summarized what some bb manufacturers say:

WheelsMFG: Do not use carbon assembly paste, compound or gripper paste for bottom bracket installs. Usage with a press-fit bottom bracket cup can damage your carbon frame. Do not use glues, epoxies or any other compound that will permanently bond to the BB cups or your frame.

C-Bear: Use anti-seize paste to install C-bear bottom bracket. Do not dry install.

Hambini: It is advisable to use retaining compound. On carbon frames, the use of Activator is required otherwise the retaining compound will not stick. (Loctite activator 7649, Loctite Medium Strength retaining compound 641).

Kogel: Grease is your friend. Use a lot of it! The best stuff we have found is Morgan Blue Aqua Proof Paste.

Rotor: Apply a thin coat of medium strength removable retaining compound (Loctite 641 or similar) to the 46mm outside cup diameter.

Chris King: Apply a generous coating of anti-seize to the inside of the BB shell on the bicycle frame.

[bikeboy1tr]

If you shop online Chain Reaction Cycles in the UK carry the Morgan Blue and its not terribly expensive and likely last a long time. Order online and they will ship it right to your door.

[Roadrocket]

That´s exactly what I did yesterday.
I gave up and ordered Morgan Blue from CRC, I was tired from seeking the right stuff.

[1415chris]

I like this summary above. In case anyone would like to come to any cleare conclusion, have a fun

[uraqt]

uh,

I don't know why this keeps coming up.. it's very simple..... Loctite 609/641

NO GREASE OR ANYTHING ELSE ....

http://bbright.net/BBrightTM-Press-Fit-Instructions.pdf

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/ ... ent=safari

C

PS I do know why.... both sytems fail when there is an outboard bearing only suported on one side or frame out of spec... if you support both bearings with someting like Hambini, WheelsMFG or BBInfinite with one structure should be fine... the down side is that you add back all the weight saved over old school square taper...

[hambini]

I can't really speak for the other manufacturers but from my end...

The reason I advocate retaining compound is primarily because bottom bracket holes are rarely round so you end up with a gap at some areas of the circumference, if you don't have anything in there to take up the gap, you open it up for corrosion and fretting. Small gaps cause capillary action. The retaining compound takes up the gap and will not be washed off by water. It doubles up as a good lubricant to aid installation. On a carbon frame, you need the activator otherwise the retaining compound will not stick, In henkel speak it is "inert".

The use of grease to act as a corrosion inhibitor is somewhat questionable because the dissimilar metals you have around the bottom bracket act like a battery and will cause galvanic corrosion. The grease may well repel water but it will do nothing for galvanic.

HTH
Hambini

[Calnago]

^ I’d agree with all that. @Hambini: do you know by chance what is in Morgan Blue AquaProof Paste that prevents galvanic corrosion etc. I have been using this in place of retaining compound plus primer for awhile (which is pretty foolproof by the way) with great success. Like 100%, but my sample size is admittedly small. And I check tolerances first to satisfy myself that the concentricity is relatively ok. But so far as my successes have been with Morgan Blue, I wonder if say, a copper based antiseize may still be better for things like titanium etc. When in doubt I always use what I know for sure works, but so far I’m liking the Aquaproof Paste for the pressfit applications since it makes it somewhat easier to remove down the road. And it’s easy and cleans up well. Like me.

[hambini]

^^^ As far as I am aware, you can't put anything in the grease to prevent galvanic corrosion unless you physically separate the surfaces or electrically insulate between surfaces.

Hambini

[Calnago]

Well, I guess for preventing the oxidation that ultimately leads to corrosion, I am really liking the Morgan Blue product. For instance, I'd have no problem going with a dry install of two anodized surfaces with good tolerances, such as a Campy pressfit cups inside Colnago Threadfit cups. The tolerances are very good on both sides of that equation. Colnago recommends a dry install. Campy recommends retaining compound. Which way do you go... I have no problem with using retaining compounds (plus primer) as it has worked for me 100% of the time. And I guess the only reason I used the Morgan Blue Aquaproof Paste is for it's antioxidation properties, especially since I live in a wet climate, and it is so far really the best stuff I've found for it's ability to adhere to whatever surface it's on in the presence of water etc., the prime element of destruction here in the PNW. But also, it's supposed to be really good for salt water as well, which... is basically sweat in the summer, and road grime in the winter. It's just become a product I really like. You certainly want to keep it away from any moving bearings for sure, it's not a grease in that sense of use. But if I do use it in a pressfit bottom bracket install, and I hear the slightest creak or one develops, then that install is getting redone with retaining compound (loctite 609). But so far, knock on wood, I've had zero cases where I've had to do that. Case by case basis.

[Roadrocket]

@Calnago
my Morgan Blue paste just arrived. I´ll grease the bb shell and I hope C-Bear bb will run sleeky. If not, I´ll use 641 with primer.

Btw. do you use it on the headset too? My Cervélo S5 has the bearings pressed directly in the frame. I´m not sure if the Morgan Aquaproof may touch the bearings directly.

[Calnago]

Sounds like a fair plan. I use it in pressfit headsets and cups, like older style Chris King headsets, or the interface between the cups of the Acros Headset cups for Colnagos and the frame. But your Cervelo is not a pressfit, right... just a couple of bearings that slip into the molded carbon headtube like most these days. No, I don’t use it there, just because it might work it’s way into the bearings themselves. I doubt it would do much harm but you don’t want something with high adhesion properties in your bearings. Normal grease there.

[Roadrocket]

You´re right there are just bearings slipped into headtube I didn´t describe it correctly. But Morgan Blue´s label says ,,seattube, headset and screwthread´´ so I was hoping I may use thin layer in the headtube as well since the headset bearings have dust covers.
But this thread is not about headset, I´ll be more than satisfied when the BB will sit in the frame shell silently.

[Calnago]

You could use it if you like, for sure, it’s not like if a little bit gets in the headset bearings your bike will break or you will lose control. I just don’t really like the idea of something so tenacious around my bearings. But I did test it out once between the bearings of A Campy SR crank and the cups they slide into. Left it for several months. All was fine, but then cleaned it out and used just the plain Morgan Blue Campa Competition Grease instead. Just felt better about it in that application. Perhaps if it was for muddy cyclocross I might be more inclined to use it for the better protection against water etc. Case by case.

[Roadrocket]

I will email Morgan Blue about using the Aquaproof around bearings.

About BBright, anyone noticed there is some improvement ar at least change? I´ve had Gen 1 S5 and the shell was moulded directly into the frame but now there is some carbon shell molded separately and glued into frame. To me it looks better than previous solution.
Maybe this caused the creaking is not so common yet and for example C-Bear is working great only with grease in most of BBrights..

[hambini]

If you are using grease to silence a bottom bracket, there is a more underlying problem.

Noise is created by movement, that is either through a poor fit or more commonly misalignment. Grease is an effective way to silence the movement but nevertheless, the movement is still there. It's a treatment for the symptom. You might find that you silently make the issue worse because of fretting.

Hambini