Would you like to see the mist around Road tubeless cleared? (help me!)

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.

Do you guys think you need a manual for setting up and understanding road tubeless?

Poll ended at Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:19 pm

Yes, PLEASE!
24
50%
Nah, already know it.
24
50%
 
Total votes: 48

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 4191
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

Just tried Muc-Off No Punctures sealant and it wouldn't even seal the area around the valve. Washed all the Muc-Off sealant out and remounted the tire...went back to Orange Seal and any leaks were gone within a few rotations of the wheel in a truing stand.

Muc-Off :roll:

jhalmar
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Aug 24, 2013 5:11 am

by jhalmar

Does anyone have road tubeless experience with Stans No Tubes Race Sealant? I have seen a lot of tests that say it is the best but it seems that the most used sealant is Orange Seal. At the moment I have used Orange Seal Endurance without problems but I was thinking if Stans Race will be safer choice for example Tour Transalp kind of race...

by Weenie


mattr
Posts: 4673
Joined: Fri May 25, 2007 6:43 pm
Location: The Grim North.

by mattr

Acquaintance of mine has been using stans race for ~3 years and the only time he ever takes his tyres off is to throw them away. Seems to have hit the perfect set up. The tyres last almost exactly as long as the initial fill of sealant. They usually come off after 3-4 months with a thin skin of still slightly liquid sealant on the inside and the outside pretty much f**ked. (He's a bigger guy and LOVES riding in the gutter for some reason)

dim
Posts: 534
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:25 am
Location: Cambridge UK

by dim

I don't have much experience with tubeless and I'm currently using the new GP5000TL tyres

Wheels are HED Belgium Plus and I've never needed tyre levers to mount any tyres (including IRC RBCC tubeless tyres) .... I do need a lever to get them off though

I have 2 layers of DT Swiss tape .... I'm not sure which valves they are as they were fitted to the wheels when I had them built by my LBS

The brake tracks are narrower than most on the Belgium Plus rims and they recomend that you use the Kool Stop Dura 2 pads as they are narrower .... so could it be that the overall diameter of the rims are smaller than most, making fitting tyres easier?

I've used a few sealants and am now using the Orange Seal (normal one not the endurance version which was recomended by some on this forum)

I've had a few punctures with the IRC tubeless and most self sealed, and with 2 I had to use a plug which worked perfectly

I've now bought the Dyna Plug Racer plugs but have not needed to use them yet

I don't have an airshot, and on all the tubeless tyres I have had to add sealant to the tyres before pumping with my track pump (I will be buying an Airshot soon)

I'm all for tubeless and will use them 12 months of the year for both commuting and weekend rides .... My next set of tyres may be the new Corsa tubeless which have just been released, but I will wait for reviews and rolling resistance data etc
Trek Emonda SL6
Miyata One Thousand

kode54
Posts: 1622
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm

by kode54

I've had a better experience with Orange Seal than Stan's No Tubes sealant. Never tried the Race version just the regular.

I wouldn't switch if you have had good experience with Orange. IMHO.
jhalmar wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:34 am
Does anyone have road tubeless experience with Stans No Tubes Race Sealant? I have seen a lot of tests that say it is the best but it seems that the most used sealant is Orange Seal. At the moment I have used Orange Seal Endurance without problems but I was thinking if Stans Race will be safer choice for example Tour Transalp kind of race...
- Factor 02 Disc + DA9170 + Enve 4.5AR CK CL hubs
- Moots Vamoots Disc RSL Titanium + DA9170 + Enve 3.4AR CK CL hubs
- Parlee Altum + DA9150 + Enve SES 4.5 Ene carbon hubs
- Argonaut Spacebike 2.0 + DA9170 + Enve SES 5.6 DT Swiss 240 CL hubs

dim
Posts: 534
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:25 am
Location: Cambridge UK

by dim

A sealant that I will avoid in future is the Slime STR Premium Sealant (the green stuff) ..... way too thick and I even struggled to get it out of the bottle through the spout

I had half a bottle of the Orange Endurance sealant and used that instead

what I have learned recently on this forum is that the Orange sealant (normal vervison not the endurance version) is better than the endurance version as it seals faster and seals holes twice as large as what the endurance version seals

only drawback is that you have to topup every 6 weeks
Trek Emonda SL6
Miyata One Thousand

User avatar
Calnago
Posts: 8533
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

Re the Regular Orange Seal, I only use it if/when I get a puncture on the road in a tubular. I only add 10-15ml and let it flow to the hole to seal it. But I know I’ve punctured a tire well after 6weeks of putting some in and it was still liquid. And if it isn’t, I’ll just add a bit more. I take about 50ml with me on every ride in an old Tufo sealant bottle. The Regular stuff definitely does seal better/quicker than the Endurance formula so it’s all I use. But whichever one works for you, that’s all that matters.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 4191
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

I use 30-40mL of the regular Orange Seal in 25-28mm tires and it normal lasts the life of the tread. I’m surprised you have to top off your sealant every 6 weeks, especially in your climate.

kode54
Posts: 1622
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm

by kode54

@Calnago...does the Orange sealant dry up in the Tufo squeeze bottle? I'm thinking about doing something similar and use a smaller 20 or 30mL squeeze bottle.
- Factor 02 Disc + DA9170 + Enve 4.5AR CK CL hubs
- Moots Vamoots Disc RSL Titanium + DA9170 + Enve 3.4AR CK CL hubs
- Parlee Altum + DA9150 + Enve SES 4.5 Ene carbon hubs
- Argonaut Spacebike 2.0 + DA9170 + Enve SES 5.6 DT Swiss 240 CL hubs

User avatar
Calnago
Posts: 8533
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

It’s never dried up on me yet. And it’s been in there for months. Just keep it fairly topped up, as opposed to having only 5-10ml in it. I rarely need it, but I never leave home without it. Same as a spare tire under my saddle. Never need that either, but the day I leave it behind is probably the day I’ll need it. It’s just a good feeling knowing you’re prepared for most things that might come up on the road. Of course, there’s always your phone.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

kode54
Posts: 1622
Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 pm

by kode54

thx. Going tubeless and still carrying a tube in addition to sealant? So no plug worms?

I suppose if you didn't carry them...you'll get stuck somewhere. I still have tubed wheels...so I'm trying to put together a separate 'tubed' and 'tubeless' kit depending on which bike I'm riding. I'm thinking about carrying the plug worms instead of a spare tube especially since I'm not sure I'll be able to get one side of the tubeless tire out to put the tube in. That's what I'm afraid of.
- Factor 02 Disc + DA9170 + Enve 4.5AR CK CL hubs
- Moots Vamoots Disc RSL Titanium + DA9170 + Enve 3.4AR CK CL hubs
- Parlee Altum + DA9150 + Enve SES 4.5 Ene carbon hubs
- Argonaut Spacebike 2.0 + DA9170 + Enve SES 5.6 DT Swiss 240 CL hubs

dim
Posts: 534
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:25 am
Location: Cambridge UK

by dim

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:21 pm
I use 30-40mL of the regular Orange Seal in 25-28mm tires and it normal lasts the life of the tread. I’m surprised you have to top off your sealant every 6 weeks, especially in your climate.
It's the 1st time that I'm using the regular orange sealant (I used the Orange Endurance previously) .... Orange website says you need to topup every 30-45 days:

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1700/ ... 1823713349

but saying that, I'm aiming for 400Km/week, and I start getting nervous when a tyre reaches 2000Km and end up replacing with new .... ( I commute daily with my 'best bike' aswell as use it for faster quality rides

so if I change tyres at 2000Km intervals, they will last approx 5 weeks so I won't need to 'top-up' as I will have new tyres and will end up starting afresh :P
Trek Emonda SL6
Miyata One Thousand

pjctyk
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2019 8:45 pm

by pjctyk

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:50 am
Just tried Muc-Off No Punctures sealant and it wouldn't even seal the area around the valve. Washed all the Muc-Off sealant out and remounted the tire...went back to Orange Seal and any leaks were gone within a few rotations of the wheel in a truing stand.

Muc-Off :roll:
Thanks for the feedback. Glad I didn't try it! I never rely on sealant to seal arond valve; just pump up without sealant. Also using Orange Seal.

User avatar
Calnago
Posts: 8533
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

kode54 wrote:thx. Going tubeless and still carrying a tube in addition to sealant? So no plug worms?

I suppose if you didn't carry them...you'll get stuck somewhere. I still have tubed wheels...so I'm trying to put together a separate 'tubed' and 'tubeless' kit depending on which bike I'm riding. I'm thinking about carrying the plug worms instead of a spare tube especially since I'm not sure I'll be able to get one side of the tubeless tire out to put the tube in. That's what I'm afraid of.
Maybe I wasn’t clear, or you are referring to someone else. I’m not running tubeless. I’m on tubulars. There’s a big difference. If I did have to change a tire on the road, it is mess free, and sure to work. I’ve watched guys trying to do as you fear, try to stuff a spare tube into a sealant filled tubeless tire when it won’t seal any other way, only to get sealant everywhere that it hasn’t sprayed already, and then find they can’t get the thing to seat properly. And when they finally do, there’s the joy of removing that sealant covered tube all over again when they get home. I’m seeing more and more early road tubeless converts questioning their choice. I’ll be curious to see which way they go on their next set of wheels. And with all these tight fitting tires out there, it’ll be a real joy to be a support person on the road for one of any number of “charity/fun” rides where people have difficulty changing a tire at the best of times, let alone with their fancy tubeless setups that they haven’t learned how to deal with since wheeling their new bike out of the bike shop.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

by Weenie


TobinHatesYou
Posts: 4191
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

This isn’t a thread for shitting on tubeless.

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