Veloflex wider tires

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
cmoi
Posts: 45
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2009 8:38 pm
Location: France

by cmoi

@RyanH : As I explained I use to inflate between 0.5 and 1 bar less 28mm tires compared to 25mm tires and this will lead to higher contact patch and therefore better grip and braking capabilities. At least this is my belief.
@Romamoser , as you may understand it is impossible to evaluate rolling resistance during ride. I can ony say that I did not feel any speed difference on my reference trip. Aside these consideration I wonder were rolling improvment with wider tire stops, it is well known that widder contact patch reduce tire hysteresis losses and therefore improve rolling resistance and ith such consideration, the widder should be the better...
@NiFTY, I do not remember locking up my front wheel but I remember slipping and falling with smaller tires and till now, I never fall because of slip with 28mm tires. Hope it will continue, and indeed 28mm widder tires make me feeling more stable and safe, especially on bad roads.
And to conclude, one should take care about classical theory assumption like contact patch because such simple basis would not explain lower rolling resistance despite similar contact patch but differente shape.
My point is test it and you will make you own experience...and from my point of view they are more comfortable, more stable, with widder contact patch (because of lower pressure) so well suited for cyclist looking at these parameters and not too much focus on competition and responsivness without compromises.


nachetetm
Posts: 87
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2017 8:54 pm

by nachetetm

@cmoi,
You just explained perfectly my feelings, specially the part of the braking. It is truth that most of the braking is done with the front wheel but wider tires make more difficult to lock up the rear wheel and that is definitely and improvement in braking. With sudden braking or under complicated situations could be the difference between standing on the bike or kissing the tarmac.

Ruben58
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2017 7:08 pm

by Ruben58

Calnago wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:49 pm
Yes, but even at 100psi, I would argue that you’re still creating a “hard” bouncy beach ball effect at the road surface with those tires, in comparison with appropriately pressurized tires at say, a 25mm width. I put “hard” in quotes because it’s going to feel “soft” to the rider simply because of the volume of air between you and the road surface (at some point you can’t even feel the road) but it is hard for tires of this volume. It essentially is bringing back the hysteresis effect at the road level that the whole fat tire trend was intended to avoid.
Also, on slick roads I don’t at all feel that a larger volume tire at higher pressures is even all that more safe, particularly if riding a little aggressively. It is much easier to slide out on road tires in a lean on smooth pavement with the increased surface area distributing the force, especially if the tire is pumped to pressures making it harder to conform to the road during leans. Becomes kind of like the saucer effect that kids use to slide down snow banks with. I recall as kids in the summer time, my dad had a little small 7.5hp outboard motor in a little tiny boat he’d throw on top of the car to go to the lake with. We would make a circle out of plywood, varnish it smooth, and voila... the po’ families waterski boat. But the surface area had to be big enough to skim over the surface of the water easily under such limited pulling power. With water skis you would have just sunk. Similar premise with the bicycle tires and two wheels. The water skis could provide extreme precise control while the saucer just skimmed the surface, but damn we had a lot of fun on that thing.
In my mind we’ve reached and surpassed the optimal width for road tires on a bicycle. Yet one of the first questions someone will ask these days about a new bicycle is “how much clearance does it have?” I guess the best response to that is “Well, how much do you need for what you’re doing?” I don’t think a blanket “bigger is better” is always the correct answer.

cmoi
Posts: 45
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2009 8:38 pm
Location: France

by cmoi

Is "optimal width for road tires on a bicycle" universal ?
Any ajustment to cyclist profile, practise, expectation and bike design ?
Does above individual opinion cover all type of configuration, did he try these tires ? does "bouncing beach ball effec"t, with a given pressure, independant to the tire/tube design ? Any dependacy to casing flexibility, tube diameter and thickness ? Optimal Veloflex corsa 28mm tires pressure for my practise is 6,5-7 bars (90-100psi), while with other "harder casing" (continental, mavic...) my optimum is 0,5 bars less, same for tubular, optimal Veloflex raven pressure is 7 bars (100psi) while it is 6.5 bars (90psi) on most other brands.
I would appreciate that statement of optimal configuration comes from real road test with detailed report (as was done on blog post about veloflex new widder tires) and not personnal thinking.
In addition, rims are becoming widder, if you apply ETRTO standart , one should use at least 28mm tire width for a 19 C rim (about 25mm external width). But sure that smart cyclist will provide many theory claiming that widder rims are nonsense (or ETRTO standart just a recommendation computed in worst case configuration with no spoke holes in the rim bed, or other arguments....), but this is an other discussion.
Image

Marin
Posts: 3468
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:48 am
Location: Vienna Austria

by Marin

7 bar in a 28mm tire - if you're 110kg.

I just rode to the office on 27mm Open Pavés, with 4.2 bars in them. I weigh 77kgs.

Alexandrumarian
Posts: 402
Joined: Mon Mar 28, 2016 6:34 pm
Location: Romania

by Alexandrumarian

I have settled to 6 rear 5.2 front at 95kg. When riding I can see them deform to the road without feeling squirmy. At 7 they feel pretty hard to a thumb press.

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mpulsiv
Posts: 1297
Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:17 pm

by mpulsiv

I reached out to Veloflex. Next week they will announce 28mm Master. I can’t wait to replace my 25mm Master. Fantastic race tire, only 1 flat in 2 seasons that sealed right up with Orange Seal in my Vittoria latex tube. It put a smile on my face that I could ride home. Got home, pumped the tire, like nothing happened.
Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

:arrow: CBA = Chronic Bike Addiction
:arrow: OCD = Obsessive Cycling Disorder

cmoi
Posts: 45
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2009 8:38 pm
Location: France

by cmoi

nmx wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 7:36 pm
Zwischenablage01.jpg

Finally :D

-> Corsa + Master 28mm, 27mm Raven Tubular
Veloflex has just released a new website with all informations about the new widder tires and tubulars :thumbup:
http://www.veloflex.it/
Veloflex has also created a strava club and welcome every riders
https://www.strava.com/clubs/veloflex

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TonyM
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Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:11 pm

by TonyM

Too bad that they don’t offer the Raven as clincher.

RyanH
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by RyanH

Any word on when these are shipping?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


bilwit
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Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2016 5:49 am
Location: Seattle, WA

by bilwit

cmoi wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 10:30 pm
In addition, rims are becoming widder, if you apply ETRTO standart , one should use at least 28mm tire width for a 19 C rim (about 25mm external width). But sure that smart cyclist will provide many theory claiming that widder rims are nonsense (or ETRTO standart just a recommendation computed in worst case configuration with no spoke holes in the rim bed, or other arguments....), but this is an other discussion.
Image
I think Mavic is the only one that still cares about ETRTO and everyone else ignores it (which is why the new Mavic stuff has small inner width but very wide outer width). It makes a little more sense if you consider the "tire width" as "measured tire width" but is still kind of wonky. People run 23-25mm on 21mm external without problems but according to ETRTO you want to use 35mm tire on it lmao.

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mpulsiv
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Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:17 pm

by mpulsiv

RyanH wrote:
Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:43 pm
Any word on when these are shipping?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
Veloflex sold their first batch of Master 28mm. Belgium got them all.
www.merlincycles.com and www.probikekit.com have no plans of ordering these anytime soon. I'm quite dissapointed with their customer service crew.
Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

:arrow: CBA = Chronic Bike Addiction
:arrow: OCD = Obsessive Cycling Disorder

1415chris
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Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:59 am
Location: Surrey UK

by 1415chris

In stock on forum's host shop, but have to admit, price is a bit insane.

Marin
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Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:48 am
Location: Vienna Austria

by Marin

1415chris wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:04 am
In stock on forum's host shop, but have to admit, price is a bit insane.
Only compared to their own previous Master/Corsa prices, not when you look at the competition.

Svetty
Posts: 530
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 11:06 pm
Location: Yorkshire - God's Own Country

by Svetty

Given that the 23s and 25s measure pretty much as specified it will be interesting to see if the new 28s are also sized accurately


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