Sram and Dura Ace combo?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
DJT21
Posts: 209
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 7:35 pm

by DJT21

TBH, Rival 10 speed was one of the best groupsets ever made. Dirt cheap, very reliable, very light (for the price) and looked classier than anything. Only the front mech let it down really.

I'd probably swap the cassette for a 1090 Red. And maybe also the chainset for a Red Exogram if you wanted to save more weight.

by Weenie


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Lewn777
Posts: 308
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

joejack951 wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:11 pm
Lewn777 wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:56 pm
Never had a problem with this combo. In fact my Shimano 105 are set a fair distance off the rim and I still have no issue with running Force levers. People saying there is an 'issue' are talking out of their a***, there simply isn't one. How the hell would Shimano and SRAM levers both work with EE or other aftermarket calipers if there was an 'issue'? The lever bites and is fully engaged before it gets anywhere near the bar, in fact I'd say the pull is slightly shorter than Shimano/Shimano, and I prefer it. (similar to Shimano MTB disk brakes) Modulation fine. Power fine. Lever pull distance fine. Someone could easily accuse me of not knowing what I'm talking about, but I've got 25 years on motorcycles, 12 years on mountain bikes and three years on road bikes.
ee claims that they've 'fine-tuned' their calipers to work with all brands of levers. So they've picked something in between Shimano's SLR-EV pull ratio and SRAM/Campy/Super SLR (old Shimano) and it works well enough it seems. That doesn't mean that all brands' levers work the same. They simply don't, and I say this as someone who has developed a cable pull fix for TRP HY/RD calipers to make them usable with non-Shimano SLR-EV levers.

So I would be very surprised (as mathematically it's impossible) if your lever pull was shorter using SRAM levers and Shimano SLR-EV calipers. Which series 105 calipers are you using? And what style of handlebar? Ergo bars offer more lever travel before bottoming than classic round curve bars.
I'm not saying that all levers work exactly the same but the fact is that SRAM levers with Shimano rim calipers work perfectly fine, just as they do with EE brakes. Lots of people thinking they can't are being misled, and that's a shame because some people would be better off and really prefer the simplicity of Shimano calipers and (IMO superior shifting) SRAM levers.

What are you talking about the lever pull ratio being shorter being impossible?
Either the ratio is A. longer, B. Shorter.

Multebear
Posts: 1104
Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

Alolympic wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:41 am
Thanks for the replies. 😎
To answer the question about cassette choice, I am thinking Sram because I am using an 11-32 cassette. My rationale for this might be a bit amateur though....
I do quite a lot of hilly riding so like the flexibility of the lower gears. I also trnf to stay in the large front ring, as it minimises the number of gear changes involved when swapping front ring and then rear too. With a 32 cassette I can stay in the front ring 90% of the time. So, the most likely cross chaining scenario is actually large front and large rear.
I was even wondering about going 1x 11 but fear the larger gaps between gears.

My B.B. is GXP, so the weight difference between SRAM red and Dura Ace 9000 is marginal I believe.
I am not aware of the Campa alternative, thought they were all a bit heavier and more expensive?
I'm not the biggest fan of your project. First of all, if you're only doing minor WW'ing, then just quit mixing groupsets. Unless you really want to dig out many grams, just keep the complete groupset as is. It will look weird mixing Sram and Shimano. Both groupsets are pretty and should be left complete, unlesss it is a really serious WW project or if you have crank based PM or want lighter calipers and so on. No reason to switch from Sram to Shimano crankset.

Regarding stiffness, I'm pretty confident Srams crankset is plenty stiff for you with that gear ratio you're suggesting.

I don't understand your thoughts on riding in the big ring as much as possible. I know it was a big thing for Bjarne Riis in the 90's. But you'll have too much cross chaining which will stress the driveline unnecessarily. If you want to gain speed/save watts and don't want to overload the system, then focus on having a straight chainline. There is a reason behind designing a two chainring system for roadriding in that configuration (no offense to Srams 1x11 which I also am a big fan of). In other words, if you only want to ride with one chainring, then move to Srams 1x11, if not, then make use of the 2x10 or 2x11 in the intended way. Another solution might be to consider the size of you small chainring. Maybe 34 isn't right for you. Maybe what you need is a 50/36 or 52/36 system or maybe you need a 11-25 or 11-28 cassette - maybe not, just offering alternatives.

Regarding chainrub, I'm not too familiar with Sram. But I can tell you that chainrub is much more of an issue with Shimanos 11-speed than with their 10-speed. Shimano 11-speed mechanic front derailleur is a PITA to adjust due to the very small tolerances with 11 speed. I've watched countless youtube videos on how to adjust the 11 sp FD and worked on it for hours, including getting help from the top mechanics in my city. None of them were able to adjust the FD to my complete satisfaction. It works, and it works without chainrub most of the time. But it's not perfekt. 11 speed works best with electronic shifting. 10 speed is much easier to get right. IMHO they should have just kept 2x10 for mechanic groupsets. Both Shimanos and Campas 10 speed gruppos have very good shifting and easy adjustment.

joejack951
Posts: 427
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 6:50 pm
Location: Wilmington, DE

by joejack951

Lewn777 wrote:
Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:05 am
joejack951 wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:11 pm
Lewn777 wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:56 pm
Never had a problem with this combo. In fact my Shimano 105 are set a fair distance off the rim and I still have no issue with running Force levers. People saying there is an 'issue' are talking out of their a***, there simply isn't one. How the hell would Shimano and SRAM levers both work with EE or other aftermarket calipers if there was an 'issue'? The lever bites and is fully engaged before it gets anywhere near the bar, in fact I'd say the pull is slightly shorter than Shimano/Shimano, and I prefer it. (similar to Shimano MTB disk brakes) Modulation fine. Power fine. Lever pull distance fine. Someone could easily accuse me of not knowing what I'm talking about, but I've got 25 years on motorcycles, 12 years on mountain bikes and three years on road bikes.
ee claims that they've 'fine-tuned' their calipers to work with all brands of levers. So they've picked something in between Shimano's SLR-EV pull ratio and SRAM/Campy/Super SLR (old Shimano) and it works well enough it seems. That doesn't mean that all brands' levers work the same. They simply don't, and I say this as someone who has developed a cable pull fix for TRP HY/RD calipers to make them usable with non-Shimano SLR-EV levers.

So I would be very surprised (as mathematically it's impossible) if your lever pull was shorter using SRAM levers and Shimano SLR-EV calipers. Which series 105 calipers are you using? And what style of handlebar? Ergo bars offer more lever travel before bottoming than classic round curve bars.
I'm not saying that all levers work exactly the same but the fact is that SRAM levers with Shimano rim calipers work perfectly fine, just as they do with EE brakes. Lots of people thinking they can't are being misled, and that's a shame because some people would be better off and really prefer the simplicity of Shimano calipers and (IMO superior shifting) SRAM levers.

What are you talking about the lever pull ratio being shorter being impossible?
Either the ratio is A. longer, B. Shorter.
First, which series 105 calipers are you using? Shimano has made three different cable pull versions in the past ~10 years with 5600, 5700, and 5800 all using slightly varied pulls. The first two would be considered by most to be 'short pull' with 5800 being the long pull outlier. If you are using SRAM levers and either 5600 or 5700 calipers and think they work fine I would not be surprised because they should work fine together. I would be somewhat surprised if you are using 5800 calipers, though, but again some handlebars allow for more lever travel than others.

To your last question, I was saying that it would be impossible to have a shorter lever throw using SRAM levers with Shimano SLR-EV calipers than with using Shimano SLR-EV levers and the same calipers. But, if you are comparing SRAM levers to Super SLR or New Super SLR Shimano levers, you would be right.

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