Fastest tire - Vittoria Corsa Speed (open TLR)

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
Multebear
Posts: 1105
Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

So according to bicycle rolling resistance, this is the fastest tire at only 7,7 watts per tire. And it's mentioned, it's a tubeless tire. Does anyone have real world experience with this tire? And do you ride it on road or TT? Did you try to mount it on a disc wheel? How much sealant do you use? 20 ml?

I've seen it mentioned in other topics, but merely as a sidenote. Haven't found any topics specifically about this tire.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 1701
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

I have a pair in my backlog but am afraid to use them. They have very little tread and will surely last less than 1000mi. I’m also unsure if they are actually faster rolling than the revised 25mm Fusion 5 Galactik TLRs, which weigh around 220g (lighter than 23mm Corsa Speeds.)

20mL would be the bare minimum for running tubeless. I weigh out about 30g in a paper cup on a kitchen scale. Between the sealant that gets left behind in the cup and in the syringe, I’d say about 25g worth of sealant makes it into the tire.

Using less sealant results in your sealant drying up much more quickly. The relationship between volume and surface area... For most people I recommend just dumping about 40g worth of sealant into each tire, but this is WW.
Last edited by TobinHatesYou on Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

by Weenie


2lo8
Posts: 446
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2016 10:32 am

by 2lo8

Surely you must be running around 1000 times as much sealant as you say? 30mg must be around 1 drop of the stuff.
[6.6kg of no carbon fiber]
[2lo8.wordpress.com]
Your one-stop source for information and reviews on cheap eBay bike junk.

Multebear
Posts: 1105
Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

I get your point of low milage with these tires. I was thinking using them for racing only. Or TT races only.

For training I use 4seasons anyway which is something completely different, and generates far more watts. But I was wondering if they'd fitt on my disc wheel for TT's...

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 1701
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

2lo8 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:03 pm
Surely you must be running around 1000 times as much sealant as you say? 30mg must be around 1 drop of the stuff.
Err... I meant grams, yes.

alcatraz
Posts: 1142
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Turbo cotton are not far off from Corsa speed if you adjust for tube rr. All tubes used are 100gr conti which consume like 1.5-2.5w. So Turbo cotton not being tubeless is 10.4w minus maybe up to 2.5w which places it just next to the corsa speeds.

What I'm trying to say is the list looks different for people who us tubes and for people who use latex tubes. The differences between the tires change.

Monkeyfudger
Posts: 154
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:26 pm

by Monkeyfudger

I use tubeless Vittoria Speeds on one set of wheels between 2 race bikes, TBH I don’t really ride outside much apart from racing so I don’t really care about tyre wear, FWIW I’d estimate a rear last between 2-3000 miles.

I’ve never punctured one but I pray to god I don’t because getting them on and off my Vittoria wheels is enough to make baby Jesus cry... I honestly don’t think I’d get a tube in there if I did puncture.

They’re awesome though, feel lovely and they’re also bloody fast. I don’t think there’s currently anything else out there that can compare?

alcatraz
Posts: 1142
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Monkeyfudger wrote:
Thu Jun 14, 2018 1:33 am
I use tubeless Vittoria Speeds on one set of wheels between 2 race bikes, TBH I don’t really ride outside much apart from racing so I don’t really care about tyre wear, FWIW I’d estimate a rear last between 2-3000 miles.

I’ve never punctured one but I pray to god I don’t because getting them on and off my Vittoria wheels is enough to make baby Jesus cry... I honestly don’t think I’d get a tube in there if I did puncture.

They’re awesome though, feel lovely and they’re also bloody fast. I don’t think there’s currently anything else out there that can compare?
Have you noticed after riding that the sealant fixed a few punctures? You can see by the change in color where the sealant has been busy.

How much do you weigh?

I used a corsa speed + latex tube on my front wheel when racing and it held. I don't quite dare to use it in the rear. There I have a gp4k for a bit more puncture protection. I weigh 65kg.

Monkeyfudger
Posts: 154
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:26 pm

by Monkeyfudger

The sealant looked as clean as when it went in so I don’t believe it’s done any work but I could well be wrong, it’s difficult to say.

I weigh around 61kg, sometimes less.

See the attachments for how my last rear looked :D
Attachments
691A7C76-3B49-4DCB-B628-A655056A944F.jpeg

alcatraz
Posts: 1142
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Your weight and the kind of roads you ride on has a lot to do with being able to use these tires. Congratulations!

Coop pic. That takes some balls to use all the time and keep wearing them down without issues.

My 95kg friend bought the tires I use, he had two punctures on their maiden voyage, took them off and later gave them to me, his skinny friend. :lol:

iwantone
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:23 am

by iwantone

I currently ride the 23mm TLR as my daily set (i know i know... i ran out of tires, had these laying around and didnt want to buy new ones).
I've ran many sets of Hutchinson Sector 28s and a pair of Schwalbe Pro One 25.
I dont put too many miles on them as my commute is VERY short. But I do ride in rain/dirt/whatever i need to in the PNW.

Experience with the tires:
Currently have about 500miles on the 23mm tires with normal signs of tread wear (but remember these are very thin tread).
Sidewalls are a bit fragile. The smallest cuts look very deep on these thin tires.
The bead on the tire is a bit small, so it does not seal against tubeless rims as nicely as other tires. Some cases require extra layers of rim tape to build up the rim to seal the tire (my Reynolds Attack needed 7 layers, HED Belgium+ only needed standard 2 layers).
Would really suggest extra sealant in these tires (more than the standard 20ml) because the poor seal against the rims.

Are they fast? Absolutely! Definitely the fastest tires that i've ridden.

I also currently own the 25mm version of this tire on my road bike. VERY nice. Still fast, but more comfortable.

CrankAddictsRich
Posts: 1226
Joined: Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:39 pm
Contact:

by CrankAddictsRich

It seems that I may have the most experience with these tires... at least so far in this thread. My experience has some positives and negatives. I've been Time Trial racing for the last 2.5 seasons. The first season, I was on my road bike and used the S-Works Cotton Turbo, first with butyl tubes and then with latex tubes, probably 6 races on each setup. I was running both tires on a set of Yoeleo C88 carbon clinchers that are marketed as tubeless ready and have a completely sealed carbon bed inside. I feel that the latex tubes were definitely faster, but hard to quantify just how much effect as I was also changing other aspects... skinsuit, helmet, etc. The second season, I was again on my road bike and started with the S-Works cottons w/ latex tubes. I had been using the Vittoria Corsa G+ for normal road roads and liked it, so when I saw that Vittoria had announced the Corsa Speed and it was reportedly even faster than the S-Works Cotton, I had to jump on board and try. I made the switch in about May of last year. First and formeost, as others have mentioned, these tires are VERY tight to mount. When I first tried to mount them, I could barely get one side of the tire on and the other was very far from mounting. I tried and tried and broke two tire levers. I ultimately took them to my local shop and the head emchanic was able to mount them but commented that they were the HARDEST tires he's ever had to mount. He suggested that if I get any replacement tires, I should mount them on an old aluminum rim first witha tube and pump them to 130 psi and let them sit for a week. When I was first running them, I was using latex tubes. My immediate reaction was that these tires were fast, but they are very thin. I was definitely worried about punctures. Looking at the data, I saw speed inceases at almost every race I did, compared to my previous season on the S-Works Cottons. In some cases, average speeds were up by more than 1mph. I can't pinpoint if it was 100% tire though, because I also switched TT helmets from one season to the next and I was defnitely better at maintaining my position. The fastest speed I recorded was a right at 27 mph.

Image

This season, I began racing on my TT rig, a Specialized Shiv TT. It's been a bit of a learning curve, but obviously the new setup is faster. I am using my 88 front wheel from the Venge set up and I got a Carbon clincher disc from them for the rear (also tubeless ready). I picked up a 3rd Corsa Speed and mounted it on an aluminum rim as suggested by the mechanic. It sat for weeks over the winter and seemed to go onto the disc easier (perhaps) but it was still by no means easy. I can mount most tires by hand, but not these. I raced for 4 races on this set up, with latex tubes, but ultimately decided I'd give tubeless a try to see what all the fuss was about and see if it really was faster. I picked up tubeless valves from Silca as they were the only company that had an easy option for fitting a valve in the 88mm front wheel. I had to run an 80mm valve with 40mm extender. Because the tires were already mounted with tubes, I simply pulled one side off, put the valves in place and remounted the other side of the tire. The bead on ne side stayed in place. I got the valves in and tires back on, put some sealant in and pumped them up. It took 2 or 3 times of re-pumping and spinning the wheels, but they sealed up. The tire on the front had a little issue though. As I had been using it for most of last season and some of this season, with tubes, at somepoint, it must've gotten a tiny slit, nothing serious enough to puncture the tube, but serious enough that, now tubeless, it was leaking and pushing sealant out. It did seal, though. I showed it to the guys at my local shop and they weren't sure if I should trust it or not. It was sealed, but had a slight bulge. The rear tire, on the disc, had only been used for 4 races, so it was fine.

Image

The first race on the tubeless set up, felt FAST and it was in horrible conditions. The front tire did hold.... at least for the race. On my way home from the race, with the bike in the back of my SUV, the sealant gave out and the tire went flat. I was able to pump it and spin it and t sealed again when i got home, but I was worried this would happen during a race, so I figured I'd get a new tire.... this was when the trouble started.

My LBS ordered me a new tire and when it came in, I threw it on the aluminum rim for a few days. There was a small lull in the season right now, with 4 weeks between races, so I had some time to spare. Last week, I mounted the new tire. It was even harder to get mounted, despite being on the aluminum wheel at 130 psi with a tube. Eventually, I was able to mount it. I thought I had sealed it right away, saw some sealant around the bead and it seemed ot be holding air for a day.. Two days later, I come down to the basement and find it flat. I pump it up again, and this time really spending time spinning and twuirling the wheel, hoping to get sealant around as much of the bead as I can. It seems to seal. This seal, not sealed battle goes on for a day or two. Finally, when I think its sealed, I take the bike out for a test ride... and I can hear a "knock, knock, knock" aound as I roll around. I realize that the sound I'm hearing is actually the sound of the carbon on the side of the 88mm wheel flexing... it almost has like a dimple in it that pops in and out as I roll (imagine squeezing a soda can). I get off the bike, worried that the wheel is being damaged. I immediately take the pressure out of the tire and end up dismounting the tire. The dimple goes away. I clean up the wheel from all of the sealant and throw on an old S-Works Cotton with tube... no dimple. With a race coming this weekend (tomorrow) I decided I dind't want to deal with this and swapped on a brand new set of S-Works cottons. The Corsa Speeds did feel great and were perhaps faster, but I can't say for sure by how much. I will not better tomorrow after I do a full race effort on the TT bike with the S-Works. They were extremely hard to munt though and I'm convinced that the 2nd tire that went on the front was SO tight that it was some how distorting the wheel. Some may say that its the result of chinese cabon wheels, but I have literally thousands and thousands of miles on chinese carbon with no issues... and probably 1000 miles on these particular 88's with no issues, other than with this 1 tire. I've seen stories, particularly a GCN video about tubeless tire/wheel manufacturers purposely leaning toward being on the tight side of the spectrum so that wheels and tires seal. They don't want to be the manufacturer known as having loose tires or wheels that won't seal.... but if you combine a company building slightly big wheels and a tire company building slightly tight tires and those tolerances get skewed a little more in the wrong direction, there can be issues.

IMO, the tires are fast... I'd like to keep running them, but not at the risk of headcahes and trying to solve more problems. If they came out with a non-tubless, superspeed for latex tubes, I'd be all over them... especially in the natural gum wall color.
2016 Pactimo Brand Ambassador
http://www.Crankaddicts.cc
2017 Specialized S-Works Tarmac SL5
2015 Specialized S-Works Allez
2014 Specialized S-Works Shiv TT
2015 Specialized Venge Pro (Retired)

alcatraz
Posts: 1142
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Have you tried turning the tire around? Is the dimple on the other side?

What about swapping rear/front.

Have you tried soap on the bead to try and get it evenly seated before putting in the sealant.

zefs
Posts: 99
Joined: Sat Aug 05, 2017 8:40 pm

by zefs

Seems like a known issue with Yoeleo wheels: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeBAQr-1ShM
There was another owner that pressed the side walls of the wheels and it was bulging but can't find the video.

by Weenie


User avatar
IrrelevantD
Posts: 342
Joined: Sun Nov 29, 2015 5:47 pm
Location: Near DFW Airport

by IrrelevantD

So anyone have any comparison on the tread life vs. the Schwalbe Pro One? I know Vittoria claims the graphine in the G+ makes it a longer lasting tire, which might explain the thinner tread, but how long does it actually last.

At 90-95kg I'm not a small guy, and I generally get about 2-3,000mi out of a Pro One rear, about double that for the front. With Vittoria offering this in a 25c now, I'm considering trying it.

I loved the Open Corsa CX when I was using tubes and have been really curious as to how these compare.
* There is a 70% chance that what you have just read has a peppering of cynicism or sarcasm and generally should not be taken seriously.
I'll leave it up to you to figure out the other 30%. If you are in any way offended, that's on you.

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post