Carbon handlebars - indentations from stem clamp
Moderator: robbosmans
My ergonova ltd looked the same right after they were put on, used fsa (pink color) carbon paste and torqued to 4nm on a zipp sl stem with 4 bolt face plate. It looks like its the paint because when I first noticed it I removed them and picked off the paint a little and the carbon looked fine under the paint. On my cross bike I have the newer easton ec90 bars and they also have similiar marks just not as bad as the 3t.
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This video shows 3T Ergonova Team with similar clamp indentations. The guy even cuts the bars open for a better look.
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wheelsONfire
- Posts: 6294
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
- Location: NorthEU
I have not seen this on any bar except 3T (both team and Ltd).
Currently at home, FSA K-wing, Ritchey Superlogic 2 carbon, MCFK, Easton EC90 Aero (old version).
None of these have any marks from stem or shifter clamp. Stems tested/ used are too many to mention.
Now i see many brands listed here, which kind of worries me.
I would try to use warranty on a bar with indentations and i also would not use this model (or even brand) any more.
Question is, Ergonova (which i also had and it also had bite marks), which has been updated to Superergo.
Does Superergo also suffer from this syndrome?
Currently at home, FSA K-wing, Ritchey Superlogic 2 carbon, MCFK, Easton EC90 Aero (old version).
None of these have any marks from stem or shifter clamp. Stems tested/ used are too many to mention.
Now i see many brands listed here, which kind of worries me.
I would try to use warranty on a bar with indentations and i also would not use this model (or even brand) any more.
Question is, Ergonova (which i also had and it also had bite marks), which has been updated to Superergo.
Does Superergo also suffer from this syndrome?
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
My 3t Aeronova bars did exactly the same thing. only ever tightened them with my Teng Tools torque wrench set to 5Nm. i read of other people having similar issues so i kept ridin gthem for a couple years before they got relegated to the reserve bike. i jsut had to remove them and saw similar intetations at eh shifter clamps so have decided to only use them on the turbo trainer. ive heard some people say its "normal" but ive never seen carbon indent like this on other bars or on seatpost clamps for exampl. so it still makes me worry a bit.
I think its due to manufacturers wanting to sell "light weight" for more money, but of course they can just turn around and tell us its our fault since we cant prove its not. but to be fair maybe i shoudl have contacted 3T about it
I think its due to manufacturers wanting to sell "light weight" for more money, but of course they can just turn around and tell us its our fault since we cant prove its not. but to be fair maybe i shoudl have contacted 3T about it
I have a set of ENVE SES aero road bars that did the same thing- Zipp Service Course SL aluminum stem (1 piece faceplate).
Just another data point. I'm planning on either sending them back for a discount on new (half off, they're out of warranty) or bonding them to a yet to be purchased carbon stem.
I thought it was odd as it was also assembled with torque wrench, carbon paste, and enve seems to have quite a good reputation.
Just another data point. I'm planning on either sending them back for a discount on new (half off, they're out of warranty) or bonding them to a yet to be purchased carbon stem.
I thought it was odd as it was also assembled with torque wrench, carbon paste, and enve seems to have quite a good reputation.
Hate that i have to post in this thread my self.. Just month ago i bought Deda Superleggera bar and put that one on my Colnago C60, while the old Easton EC90SLX3 installed on my second bike CAAD12...
After initial frustration from internal routing install (and almost returned back because of that), i decided to keep it, and even to order yesterday Deda Superleggero Stem for aestethic match..
On Both bikes and both bars i have Fizik Cyrano R1 stems (which i use them few years now)
After some test rides i realized that Deda Superleggera is perfect match for Campagnolo i use and i realized that i really love the shape, comfort, look.. I liked that much that i decide yesterday to order another one to have exactly the same on both of my bikes (i switch between them constantly so i prefer to have same setup)
But after i process the order yesterday, and while measuring the reach (to be able to copy on second bike with same bar which made me ordering new Deda Zero 115mm stem from ebay also yesterday), i realized identation from the stem and something like cracked laquere or clear coat...
Im using Park Tool Torque Wrench https://www.parktool.com/product/torque-wrench-tw-1 and choosed this version since it not need to be send for recalibration, and also checked torque specs few times against LBS Torque Wrench.
Also have this Torque Wrench for at least 4-5 years without any trouble until now, and also have experience with Carbon Bars or components (Mentioned Easton EC90SLX3 bar, and also another Carbon bar on my MTB, or carbon seatposts on few bikes)
While installing the bar i slowly and constantly torque bolt by bolt in cross way (diagonal way), to dont overstress one area.. In Deda Manual http://www.dedaelementi.com/wp-content/ ... web-EN.pdf torque specs are 4nm to 5 nm
"
With the 4-bolt faceplates, tighten the bolts alternately in a 1-2-3-4 cross pattern,
until a torque of 4 N•m is reached.
If your bike is equipped with a 2-collar faceplate tighten the bolts alternately in a
1-2 left/1-2 right pattern, until a torque of 4 N•m is reached.
Check the symmetry and equality of all the distances between faceplate, body,
handlebar stem, if necessary, further tighten up to 5 N•m.
Check if the handlebar is secure on the handlebar stem. Please make sure that
the handlebar is tight enough so that you can't twist it."
I followed this and my max torque at the end is about 4.5 nm
Im sending the pictures of that identation and laquere or clear coat line crack i noticed.. I tried to sand that line a little bit using fine sand paper, but stopped to dont void warranty.. Also done coin test, except identation cant notice change in sound.. I most worried about lines that look like laquere or clear coat crack...
Quick google show me that this problem is not isolated in my case (even with torque of 3 nm, and risking of rotate the bar and damage from that)
viewtopic.php?t=135956
https://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewto ... t=12953121
Should i continue riding like this? I dont mind if it's cosmetic, since i really like the bar a lot (as i mentioned put me in perfect riding position on tops, hoods, drops, and much better then Easton i have). Also would really hate if i need to return back since that will produce in new cabling frustration, and also need to buy new cableset (and i just installed new cables and tape (Fizik SuperLight) with the bar)
Cosmetic or Danger?
Thanks
After initial frustration from internal routing install (and almost returned back because of that), i decided to keep it, and even to order yesterday Deda Superleggero Stem for aestethic match..
On Both bikes and both bars i have Fizik Cyrano R1 stems (which i use them few years now)
After some test rides i realized that Deda Superleggera is perfect match for Campagnolo i use and i realized that i really love the shape, comfort, look.. I liked that much that i decide yesterday to order another one to have exactly the same on both of my bikes (i switch between them constantly so i prefer to have same setup)
But after i process the order yesterday, and while measuring the reach (to be able to copy on second bike with same bar which made me ordering new Deda Zero 115mm stem from ebay also yesterday), i realized identation from the stem and something like cracked laquere or clear coat...
Im using Park Tool Torque Wrench https://www.parktool.com/product/torque-wrench-tw-1 and choosed this version since it not need to be send for recalibration, and also checked torque specs few times against LBS Torque Wrench.
Also have this Torque Wrench for at least 4-5 years without any trouble until now, and also have experience with Carbon Bars or components (Mentioned Easton EC90SLX3 bar, and also another Carbon bar on my MTB, or carbon seatposts on few bikes)
While installing the bar i slowly and constantly torque bolt by bolt in cross way (diagonal way), to dont overstress one area.. In Deda Manual http://www.dedaelementi.com/wp-content/ ... web-EN.pdf torque specs are 4nm to 5 nm
"
With the 4-bolt faceplates, tighten the bolts alternately in a 1-2-3-4 cross pattern,
until a torque of 4 N•m is reached.
If your bike is equipped with a 2-collar faceplate tighten the bolts alternately in a
1-2 left/1-2 right pattern, until a torque of 4 N•m is reached.
Check the symmetry and equality of all the distances between faceplate, body,
handlebar stem, if necessary, further tighten up to 5 N•m.
Check if the handlebar is secure on the handlebar stem. Please make sure that
the handlebar is tight enough so that you can't twist it."
I followed this and my max torque at the end is about 4.5 nm
Im sending the pictures of that identation and laquere or clear coat line crack i noticed.. I tried to sand that line a little bit using fine sand paper, but stopped to dont void warranty.. Also done coin test, except identation cant notice change in sound.. I most worried about lines that look like laquere or clear coat crack...
Quick google show me that this problem is not isolated in my case (even with torque of 3 nm, and risking of rotate the bar and damage from that)
viewtopic.php?t=135956
https://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewto ... t=12953121
Should i continue riding like this? I dont mind if it's cosmetic, since i really like the bar a lot (as i mentioned put me in perfect riding position on tops, hoods, drops, and much better then Easton i have). Also would really hate if i need to return back since that will produce in new cabling frustration, and also need to buy new cableset (and i just installed new cables and tape (Fizik SuperLight) with the bar)
Cosmetic or Danger?
Thanks
My 3t bars and my stock 2014 trek seat post did that. To my eye, there’s a superficial outer layer of UD carbon and a gel coat finish that applied after curing of the core bar that hides the “messy” layups of the structural layer , allows the same basic product to be rebranded as needed, protects the structural layer, and allows for some grip on installation.
I’d use that bar, which you sent back, without worry. The outer layer will splinter like a shell rather than cracking the core bar. The failure will be very visual as only the outter layer out delaminate.
Interestingly, my new Trek 500 series frame doesn’t hide the carbon layup on the bits of exposed carbon.
I’d use that bar, which you sent back, without worry. The outer layer will splinter like a shell rather than cracking the core bar. The failure will be very visual as only the outter layer out delaminate.
Interestingly, my new Trek 500 series frame doesn’t hide the carbon layup on the bits of exposed carbon.
I have 3t ergonova bars with exact same indentations and i have stopped using them,shall i bin them or are they still ok?
Colnago arabesque campagnolo super record 12
Colnago c64
Cinelli zydeco grx di2
Colnago c64
Cinelli zydeco grx di2
Instead of binning it, send it over to me. I will pick up postage cost 
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wheelsONfire
- Posts: 6294
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
- Location: NorthEU
I have a new Haero Carbon H145 RR SL (size 44), weight 153 g.
No indents at all. Actually, the only handlebar i have had with this kind of problem is a 3T Ergonova team.
I threw it in the waste bin without regrets. I would worry it would crack one day.
No indents at all. Actually, the only handlebar i have had with this kind of problem is a 3T Ergonova team.
I threw it in the waste bin without regrets. I would worry it would crack one day.
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
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PrinceEdward
- Posts: 96
- Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 3:20 pm
Old factor O2 integrated handlebar to replace the broken xxx due to park and crash, simply is a same module
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我從使用 Tapatalk 的 Pixel 發送
-
wheelsONfire
- Posts: 6294
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
- Location: NorthEU
Why not just ride with this bar and if you're nervous, check it from time to time to see if it has changed?
I understand it's not funny to a point it aches in the brain, but if you'd buy a new bar (same), it would most likely end up the same way.
Try to think a bit,... rock n' roll (or something like that)!
If annoys you to the point of no return, buy a new bar,.. but for sure not the same!
I understand it's not funny to a point it aches in the brain, but if you'd buy a new bar (same), it would most likely end up the same way.
Try to think a bit,... rock n' roll (or something like that)!
If annoys you to the point of no return, buy a new bar,.. but for sure not the same!
Bikes:
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)
Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.
Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓ Broad Selection ✓ Worldwide Delivery ✓
www.starbike.com
Just resurrecting this thread to ask a question..
It seems (from the above and elsewhere) that these sorts of indents on the clampinng areas of carbon bars are very common. But how common are actual bar failures in use, i.e. not as the result of a crash?
On a quick google I can't easily find any examples. The ultimate test of whether carbon bars are safe is whether they fail or not, are there any statistics on this? Googling would suggest that this hardly ever happens (steerer failures seem to be more common, but still rare).
There have been 100s of thousands of people riding carbon bars for years now, if these indents are a problem, and they are as common as they seem to be, there should be a fair number of reported failures. Do these just not exist or are they somehow hushed up if they do? I'd like to be able to believe that real world experience shows carbon bars to be safe.
It seems (from the above and elsewhere) that these sorts of indents on the clampinng areas of carbon bars are very common. But how common are actual bar failures in use, i.e. not as the result of a crash?
On a quick google I can't easily find any examples. The ultimate test of whether carbon bars are safe is whether they fail or not, are there any statistics on this? Googling would suggest that this hardly ever happens (steerer failures seem to be more common, but still rare).
There have been 100s of thousands of people riding carbon bars for years now, if these indents are a problem, and they are as common as they seem to be, there should be a fair number of reported failures. Do these just not exist or are they somehow hushed up if they do? I'd like to be able to believe that real world experience shows carbon bars to be safe.
