SR 11 vs 12 for custom Ti build

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.

Which drive train for my bike

Super Record 11
11
26%
Super Record 12
31
74%
 
Total votes: 42

wintershade
Posts: 104
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:12 pm

by wintershade

A few months ago, I placed an order for my dream bike — a money is no object custom Titanium build. It’s an endurance-race geometry for Sportives, Haute Route, etc. I selected a mechanical SR 11 drive train because I prefer the feel of mechical to EPS (so let’s not debate that here) and I wanted the bike to have a modern classic feel (similar to a Singer 911).

Should I ask the builder to switch to SR 12 (he already ordered SR11 stuff). I don’t care about cost difference or waiting a few months for parts to show up. Part of me feels like a dummy, dropping this kind of money for my “perfect” bike only to spec it with an outdated drive train. On the other hand, 11 speed does have some advantages: such as being able to more easily share wheels between my other bikes (or get a wheel off support vehicles on multi day sportives, etc), being able to drop on my direct drive trainer, being able to find parts if I break down in the Alps, etc.

Main draw of 12 is newness/bling factor, and obviously the extra gear given I live in very hilly area with some steep climbs and intend to take this bike to Alps, Dolomites, etc. Some of the ergonomic changes also sound appealing. I’m undecided on which Group aesthetically looks better.

Help!

by Weenie


AJS914
Posts: 2259
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

11 speed looks way better.
12 speed is on preorder right now so I'm not sure when it ships.
If you are really doing events like Haute Route I'd stick with 11 speed.
You can order 11 speed with an 11-32. It's a one cog difference in the end.

keaton
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 7:03 pm

by keaton

Go for 12. Make your new bike as modern as possible. I was not a fan of the look of 12 when it first dropped, but it has already grown on me tremendously. I think I will lik,e and want it more as we see it on more builds.

Love the singer 911 idea.

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TonyM
Posts: 2621
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:11 pm

by TonyM

wintershade wrote: Part of me feels like a dummy, dropping this kind of money for my “perfect” bike only to spec it with an outdated drive train.
The 12 speed will also be outdated at some point.

Classic is never outdated in the other side, 8, 9, 10 or 11 speed.

If you are fine with the 11speed cassettes and spec then go for it.


morrisond
Posts: 780
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 8:34 pm

by morrisond

Also I would make sure your builder uses a Dropout that has a replaceable Hangar, that accepts a normal Road dropout or the Shimano/Campy Road DM standard.

If you go 12sp you'll want to get rid of that ugly little link on the RD - it will help the looks.

You need something like one of these http://www.paragonmachineworks.com/cldr ... 12-mm.html

That can take a Paragon B4080 or B4083

They also make similar parts for Rim dropouts if you are not going disc.

DJT21
Posts: 215
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 7:35 pm

by DJT21

11 for sure.

It's cheaper,
lighter,
looks better,
is compatible with Shimano and SRAM cassettes,
drivetrain is likely to be more durable,
likely less finnicky to set up and maintain,
chains are more widely available

I'd never be an early adopter though.

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Calnago
Posts: 6551
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

I would go for the 12sp. Just make sure your builder really understands where that rear derailleur needs to be positioned in space. If it has a removeable “link” like the newest Shimano derailleurs it would be better if your builder could factor that in to the new hanger so you wouldn’t have the extra piece in there and potential for more flex. On the other hand, it would kind of tie the bike into the 12sp derailleur only. That is something you might consider if the builder is making the hanger an integrated part of the dropout.
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

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Miller
Posts: 1370
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2006 8:54 pm
Location: Reading, UK

by Miller

Come on, this HAS to be 12. The bling factor alone will be off the scale!

RyanH
Moderator
Posts: 2194
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 4:01 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Contact:

by RyanH

If you're doing a lot of sportives with neutral wheel support (like Haute Route) then I'd stick with 11s. Plus, 11s Campy SR is quite possibly the most gorgeous groupset ever designed and 12s was designed by Stevie Wonder...

Butcher
Shop Owner
Posts: 851
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:58 am

by Butcher

TonyM wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 3:51 pm
Classic is never outdated in the other side, 8, 9, 10 or 11 speed.
The 12 is not even out yet and the 11 speed is now a 'classic'. Usually it gets old before it becomes a classic.

Go with the 12 [SEAHAWKS!]. If you are building a new bike with 11 speed, it will be out dated in a few months.

Hats off to you for having a project where money is not an object.
Last edited by Butcher on Sat Apr 21, 2018 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Butcher
Shop Owner
Posts: 851
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:58 am

by Butcher

deleted

XCProMD
Posts: 624
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:25 am
Location: Cantabria

by XCProMD

Just back from a test ride on a 12s SR. Do yourself a favour and get the best deal you can on a 12s Campag, doesn’t matter if SR or R.

It’s THAT good.


Inviato dal mio iPhone utilizzando Tapatalk

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Calnago
Posts: 6551
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:14 pm

by Calnago

Damn you @XCProMd! Just Damn you. Lol
Hey, you might know the answer to this... how compatible are the front chainrings and/or spacing of the front chainrings? For example, can you put 12sp rings on the current four arm cranks? Are the rings actually any different... I was wondering if they had to make things narrower for the new chain, etc. You’d think so, but maybe not? Basically I’m looking for all the info I can get on the new chainrings, their spacing, and compatibility (if any), with the previous 4 arm cranks.
Also, what can you say about the new brakes... as good a build quality as current SR skeleton brakes? The existing Direct Mount brakes were really just a stop gap product till these were released I presume. Are the Direct Mount and single Center Mount now essentially the same, except for the mounting option?... much like the Dura-Ace 9100 DM and Standard Mount calipers?
Colnago C64 - The Naked Build; Colnago C60 - PR99; Trek Koppenberg - Where Emonda and Domane Meet;
Unlinked Builds (searchable): Colnago C59 - 5 Years Later; Trek Emonda SL Campagnolo SR; Special Colnago EPQ

wintershade
Posts: 104
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:12 pm

by wintershade

Thanks all for your input.

The direction I’m leaning at the moment is:
1) Sticking with SR 11 for this Ti bike — my sportive/endurance bike. Primarily for aesthetic reasons, serviciblity, and ability to pick up neutral support wheels.
2) Down the line, selling my Canyon Ultimate SLX 9 Pro (Record 11) for a Dogma 10 SR12 EPS (once that’s released) race bike.

Then I’ll have something “classic” and something ultra-modern. But I could be talked out of this....

I’m also not that fast, so there is the duche bag factor of SR 12 I’d rather avoid, even though for me this is more about respecting engineering and design excellence than about being faster.

by Weenie


morrisond
Posts: 780
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 8:34 pm

by morrisond

Calnago wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:33 pm
I would go for the 12sp. Just make sure your builder really understands where that rear derailleur needs to be positioned in space. If it has a removeable “link” like the newest Shimano derailleurs it would be better if your builder could factor that in to the new hanger so you wouldn’t have the extra piece in there and potential for more flex. On the other hand, it would kind of tie the bike into the 12sp derailleur only. That is something you might consider if the builder is making the hanger an integrated part of the dropout.
Did you miss my post above? Paragon has dropouts with replaceable hangars just for this issue.

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