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Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 1:18 pm
by ome rodriguez
I’m pretty sure the direct mount version has more clearance.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:56 pm
by Calnago
I’ve been waiting on some of these brakes. I use tubulars so a 27mm tire basically measures 27mm from my experience. What rim are those 25mm Michelin’s in the pic mounted on... and are they clinchers? I assume so. I’m just curious because if those tires are measuring 27mm, then that looks like decent clearance to me, at least for those tires.
I think the fat tire craze on a road bike has gotten a bit ridiculous. I could see going max 27-28mm on really really bad roads but anything bigger would be for non paved roads imo. And disc brakes.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:56 pm
by Weenie

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 4:01 pm
by Calnago
ome rodriguez wrote:I’m pretty sure the direct mount version has more clearance.
Not sure they do. For instance, the newest Shimano calipers have the same clearance (stated 28mm) regardless whether they are direct or standard mount. I still don’t see any advantage to the DM brakes. Hate torquing steel brake studs into alloy threaded holes in your frame.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 5:19 pm
by ome rodriguez
I don’t know my tarmac ul fork clearance, but the record dm brakes are flush to the fork’s underside. Btw, tires are mavic 25 tubular.

Image

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 5:21 pm
by Alexandrumarian
Previous page pics shows DT Swiss RR440 with Michelin Power Comp 25mm. After posting I also received new Boras (old broken in accident) and with dry mounted Vittoria Corsa 25 clearance looks OK, but the 27mm Vlaanderen (attached below) are a no go with this fork. Top clearance varies from almost nothing to 1mm, so about 1-2mm *less* than with the 2015 Record brakes which were totaly usable apart from ocassional noises when small stuff got caught in...

Compared to the old ones, they are a few grams lighter. Both bolts are a few mm loger, so for the fork I had to use a shorter nut than before. Upper parts of the arms are a bit stiffer (as their new look suggest) but the lower parts (where shoes are bolted) still flex a little so it is not exactly Shimano dead like. Spring looks the same but feels a bit stiffer/snappier, maybe old ones are a bit tired. Lever feel is nice and crisp. Will report in a few days once I giove them a proper test on the road.

Another big let down is the barrel adjuster. It is very hard and gritty to turn. I have to close the caliper to release tension, then it turns about OK, otherwise it is horrible. With the old Record (or Athenas) I could turn it nice and easy.

Looks are much stealthier than old ones, with several parts now in black instead of bare alu and darker logos.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 6:05 pm
by r4nd0mv4r14bl3
Calnago wrote:
Wed Jul 25, 2018 4:01 pm
ome rodriguez wrote:I’m pretty sure the direct mount version has more clearance.
Not sure they do. For instance, the newest Shimano calipers have the same clearance (stated 28mm) regardless whether they are direct or standard mount. I still don’t see any advantage to the DM brakes. Hate torquing steel brake studs into alloy threaded holes in your frame.
Photos of the new Campa non-series DM brakes. I think these come with 2019 code. Plenty of clearance with VF Arenberg.

Front

Image

Rear

Image

Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 6:07 pm
by Calnago
@Alexandrumarian: What fork is that? Standard mount brakes? What is the rear like?

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 6:16 pm
by Alexandrumarian
Fork is from a Simplon Pavo III bike. Actual fork clearance is OK but the hole is drilled low. The back has lots of space.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:35 pm
by Calnago
Alexandrumarian wrote:
Wed Jul 25, 2018 5:21 pm
Another big let down is the barrel adjuster. It is very hard and gritty to turn. I have to close the caliper to release tension, then it turns about OK, otherwise it is horrible. With the old Record (or Athenas) I could turn it nice and easy.
This I just don't get. What I suspect is causing that "grittiness" is probably the quality of finish of the cut brake housing end that enters the brake caliper stop. Is it finished flush and square with no burrs, or is it a rough cut with sharp burrs sticking out that will catch and scratch on the mating surface of the stop? In other words, does your finished housing end look like this...
Image


Or this....
Image

That's the only thing I can think of that would make turning the barrel adjuster feel rough and gritty.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:37 pm
by Alexandrumarian
Definitly like first pic, I square and smooth them on a very fancy tool/knife sharpening system... Both adjusters/cables worked well with the old brakes, I just swaped the new ones in. I'll take another look soon and maybe try to put in the old adjusters to make sure. Maybe the new ones need some grease on the threads, they turn like they have sand and glue in there. Anyway in the morning I hope to do a quick test ride on new AC3 wheels and report on the braking.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:42 pm
by Calnago
That’s weird. I need a group to experiment with. Can’t imagine why iit could be rough unless the threads are poorly cut?

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:06 pm
by themidge
Sometimes barrel adjusters are just a bit shit. The one on my 105 RD is softish plastic and unhelpfully notched, so it turns really badly.
If you still have your old brakes, and the threads are the same, you could try putting the old adjuster on the new brakes.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 11:00 pm
by wingguy
themidge wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:06 pm
Sometimes barrel adjusters are just a bit shit. The one on my 105 RD is softish plastic and unhelpfully notched, so it turns really badly.
The adjusters on derailleurs are a pretty different kettle of fish to brake adjusters. RD adjusters have a very fine range of movement and are intended to be relatively set and forget, whereas brake adjusters have a bigger range, bigger increments and have to be designed for quite regular use by comparison. All this lends itself to a sturdier unit that 'feels' better and smoother.

Also, bear in mind that when someone has a problem with a very expensive component, pointing out that a like for like cheap component also has a similar issue isn't often a helpful comparison. Sure, the cheap component shouldn't be bad, but the expensive component should be better :wink:

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2018 10:51 am
by Alexandrumarian
Yeah, and even so, I can turn my inline FD barrel one handed while riding very nicely. Anyway, i packed everything with grease and it seems to work ok now.

As for braking (to be clear, levers are 2015 SR) it seems similar to previous as far as i can tell from a short flat ride. I don't detect anything blatantly different than before. The AC3 surface is indeed grittier and noisier. Noise is not too bad but diamant was a bit more plesant if that makes sense.

I wonder if they changed the alloy pads. They are soft and sticky, no way I could slide them out to switch to reds. Even stuck the screwdriver (one used to lift the steel clip) in my hand. In the end I lifted them out by force and they popped with ease.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:19 pm
by 1llum4
Just saw the complete bike specs for Cervelo 2019 North America models and no campagnolo spec on any model. Everything is shimano except for a e-tap version of S5/R5.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:19 pm
by Weenie