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Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:45 am
by Shrike
TobinHatesYou wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:42 am
Shrike wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:38 am
Rarely surprised by anything much in cycling tech but Campag being first out with a road 12 speed?

Kudos 8)

Reminder that Campagnolo was first to 11-speed...
Yes, fair point. Should maybe give them more credit :P

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:46 am
by 2lo8
TobinHatesYou wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:42 am
Shrike wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:38 am
Rarely surprised by anything much in cycling tech but Campag being first out with a road 12 speed?

Kudos 8)

Reminder that Campagnolo was first to 11-speed...
And the first to 10-speed

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:46 am
by Weenie

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:00 am
by corky
Well kudos for keeping this under wraps Campagnolo...
12 speed was never on my must have list but since no new wheels are required I’m happy to try it.

Yay to no more skeleton brakes that rubbed me up the wrong way.........(see what I did there?)

Like the new shifters and again yay for reach adjustment.......

Negatives.......the graphics look cheap at first viewing, maybe I’ll get used to them. Really don’t see much point in Offering two group sets where really the only difference is a few aesthetic changes. Should have incorporated a quick link chain joining method as I see the pin peening as low tech,old fashioned, expensive never mind that it maybe good engineering.
The chainset though?.......eeewwww.......first pass is not feeling it.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:05 am
by TobinHatesYou
New freehubs were never going to be part of the equation. With disc brakes on 135mm spacing, bracing angles are at the lower limit. Now if Campy wants to bump down to 10t or 9t cogs, they might need their own version of XDr, but widths still won’t change.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:08 am
by RTW
TobinHatesYou wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:42 am
Reminder that Campagnolo was first to 11-speed...
Yes, but it was rubbish. It barely worked in 2009, and only with refinements (near rear mech) did it begin to work properly a year later.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:14 am
by mrlobber
What, no more tubular Boras???? :evil: :evil: :evil: At least, if they moved to carbon clinchers, they should have committed all the sins one day and offered the new Boras for disc brakes then.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:25 am
by Zakalwe
Only for the two new sizes under the WTO label, and one is a front wheel only

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:27 am
by TobinHatesYou
mrlobber wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:14 am
What, no more tubular Boras???? :evil: :evil: :evil: At least, if they moved to carbon clinchers, they should have committed all the sins one day and offered the new Boras for disc brakes then.
They have.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:39 am
by mrlobber
I meant no new ones in the future, which this release implies to a degree, especially the part of "tubulars are slow".

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:49 am
by g00se
mrlobber wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:39 am
I meant no new ones in the future, which this release implies to a degree, especially the part of "tubulars are slow".
I'm sure if the race teams want them, they'll make them. Most world pro teams are sponsored by or choose Shimano now, so I would doubt they'd do something that would risk alienating the others.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:54 am
by jlok
Those are leaning more towards TT applications. Seeking the lowest drag and rolling resistance makes sense. Campy actually not antique/traditionalist and is willing to face the reality to move forward. Good job. I think Campy should still make Bora 35 or 50 tubular to please WW crowd and race use.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:54 am
by TobinHatesYou
mrlobber wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:14 am
What, no more tubular Boras???? :evil: :evil: :evil: At least, if they moved to carbon clinchers, they should have committed all the sins one day and offered the new Boras for disc brakes then.

The disc versions will come when they announce the shallower rim depths. They’ll be wider too.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:10 am
by c60rider
RTW wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:08 am
TobinHatesYou wrote:
Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:42 am
Reminder that Campagnolo was first to 11-speed...
Yes, but it was rubbish. It barely worked in 2009, and only with refinements (near rear mech) did it begin to work properly a year later.
Bought super record when it first came out and still works as smoothly and slick as it did when new 9 years ago. The latest super record on my newest bike is only fractionally better and the sensitive front mech is a pain to get right.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:30 am
by vejnemojnen
Bulky chainset for sure. Record no longr has hollow crank arms, so, technically the new record is a chorus.

The brakes are very heavy. In fact, post-2011 centaur dual pivots were 310 grams in pairs, and even sram Rival weighs below 300 grams for fraction of a price.

The rear derailer for the record is incredibly bulky. Even 10spd chorus rears came out around 190 grams.

This is a bit disappointment. It looks like record have been degraded to chorus.

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:30 am
by Weenie

Re: Campagnolo 12-Speed

Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 12:13 pm
by TobinHatesYou
5.15mm between outer plates vs 5.25mm for SRAM Eagle.