Campagnolo 12-Speed

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
carbonazza
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:14 am

by carbonazza

FTPWhor wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 3:48 pm
Need help! I am buying Super Record 12 speed EPS Groupset. It comes with external junction box. I will most likely buy the Bar End Junction box for clean wiring. Do I need to buy addition specific wiring (like for Di2 bar end junction you nedd a Y connector)??
You only need the wires with the reference AC19-CAHEPS, if you search you'll find plenty of shops that sell it.

And for information about di2, since it is a bus wiring system, you can use normal wires to connect the two shifters together, with a 1400mm wire from one handlebar end to the bar end junction.
As explained in: https://youtu.be/WCnsKwLf9F8

jgpallero
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Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:13 pm

by jgpallero

Nefarious86 wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 8:34 pm
A 12 25 would be 1t steps till the 23.. Who actually needs that?

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Me. For me a 34x25/27 fits perfect, and, above all, I don't need a 11 teeth sprocket. Now, in my Campagnolo 11s I use a 50/34 chainring and a 12-25 cassette, so I would like a 12-27 in a hypothetical upgrade to 12s. I suppose I have to wait for the Miche version

AJS914
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by AJS914

Nefarious86 wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 8:34 pm
A 12 25 would be 1t steps till the 23.. Who actually needs that?
Nobody, but it would look cool. :D

Butcher
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by Butcher

Nefarious86 wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 8:34 pm
A 12 25 would be 1t steps till the 23.. Who actually needs that?
Everyone that has a 12-25 11sp now! I will jump to 12 eventually but my biggest hold back is that I do not want to go to 29. I'm happy with my 12/25 and I understand that most people do not get that. I'm not the only one I'm sure. I seriously doubt if I had to go with a 29, I would never use it. So basically I would have an 11sp which is what I got now.

As for 'needs' nobody needs 12sp. Heck, 11 is more than enough.

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ultimobici
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by ultimobici

FYI. Hell will freeze over before 12 speed 12-25 or even 11-27 cassettes will come out of Vicenza. There simply isn’t enough demand for it. 11 speed cassette sales confirmed what was already starting to happen with 10 speed. Bit by bit the lowest selling Record cassette ratios were culled until all that was left was 13-29. Centaur 10 even had 12-27 & 12-30 added at the same time smaller cassettes were dropped.

Shimano killed off 11-23 and moved to accommodate 11-30. Availability of 53 & 39 tooth 9000 rings is already difficult which is much sooner than it was with 7900.

Looking at the differences in ratio it seems that an 11-29 12 speed set up mated to a 53/39 gives a better progression of gears than an 11 speed 11-27. You get your magical 16, which was only really a useable gear when we used 42 inner rings.
Gear Comparison



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Kjetil
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by Kjetil

Except 16 is not magical but very very nice with the modern 52/36 and my old rev-concious legs. :)
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kervelo
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Location: Finland

by kervelo

Nefarious86 wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 8:34 pm
A 12 25 would be 1t steps till the 23.. Who actually needs that?
I use 12-25 with all my bikes and love it. Both with 53-39 and 52-36. But still only 11sp. :oops:

robertbb
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by robertbb

ultimobici wrote:
Sun Jan 19, 2020 8:31 pm
FYI. Hell will freeze over before 12 speed 12-25 or even 11-27 cassettes will come out of Vicenza. There simply isn’t enough demand for it. 11 speed cassette sales confirmed what was already starting to happen with 10 speed. Bit by bit the lowest selling Record cassette ratios were culled until all that was left was 13-29. Centaur 10 even had 12-27 & 12-30 added at the same time smaller cassettes were dropped.
Do you have any insight as to whether a 12-32 would be considered?

(as stated above, basically like the current 11 speed 12-29, but with a 32 tooth up top)

neeb
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Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:19 pm

by neeb

ultimobici wrote:
Sun Jan 19, 2020 8:31 pm
Looking at the differences in ratio it seems that an 11-29 12 speed set up mated to a 53/39 gives a better progression of gears than an 11 speed 11-27. You get your magical 16, which was only really a useable gear when we used 42 inner rings.
Gear Comparison
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I could live with those ratios - problem is that the weight penalty going to 12sp 53/39 + 11-29 is really very considerable compared with 11sp compact or semi-compact cranks and an 11sp Record 11-27.

Butcher
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by Butcher

I totally get that they will not make one. I totally get that a business needs to make money. I'm not the one that said they will make a closer cassette, it was Campagnolo. https://bikerumor.com/2018/04/09/campag ... groupsets/

How hard would it be to make the second portion of the cassette to go no more than 27? I'm assuming it can so it would not be that much. Yeah, I get there is more to the cost of the part other than the materials [marketing, parts, logistics, etc]. It is possible, that it cannot physically work because the spokes are in the way but Campagnolo surely did not mention that.

If there are at least 2 people on this forum that likes a 12-25 [with a 53/39] but I'm certain there are more out there. Everyone says that the larger gear ratios are so much better but they fail to understand that those ratios would never be used by people like me. I climb mountains fine with what I have but I will concede that having a 27 may be helpful at times. Certainly not a 29.

I want to go to 12 and as I stated, I probably will but I would already have it if they had something no more than 27.

Those that sell bikes for a living and wonder why no one buys close ratio cassettes may look outside and see where they live. I bet there are some bike shops that rarely sell anything above 25.

Campagnolo, if you are reading this, please make a 11-27.

Nefarious86
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by Nefarious86

"They may potentially work on a third pro-specific cluster with even tighter spacing (11-25 or 11-27) for especially flat racing. But so far, Campagnolo’s pro teams have been pleased with the small gearing jumps of the 11-29, which also weighs just a claimed 266g."

Even if they did it would have been pro only...

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tarkus
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by tarkus

just joined the club ;)
11/29 with 52/36 btw
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Nefarious86
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by Nefarious86

Has anyone actually tried 53/36 with the 12s crank/chainrings?

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Wingnut
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by Wingnut

Took my bike with Chorus 12 on its first ride today...

•Jeez it brakes well! So good I don't see a need for disc brakes.

•53/36 chainset is absolutely useless for where I live, spent most of the ride in the big ring.

•I have a 12-32 cassette and there's a gap in the gears I don't like. There's a jump between two gears where I'm too high then too low...
"It's not the destination...it's the ride!"

robertbb
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by robertbb

Wingnut wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 4:59 am
Took my bike with Chorus 12 on its first ride today...

•Jeez it brakes well! So good I don't see a need for disc brakes.
The Chorus brakes havn't changed at all since 11 speed (other than the font type to match the new logo style)... and yes, they are excellent. Better than (the old) R/SR brakes and I've been barking about this for years. In 12s rim brake, the only new brakes are for R/SR and the design part that made them worse than the lower tiered brakes was carried through so I would imagine they havn't improved much (other than in clearance)
Wingnut wrote:
Sun Jan 26, 2020 4:59 am

•I have a 12-32 cassette and there's a gap in the gears I don't like. There's a jump between two gears where I'm too high then too low...
The gradation on the 12-32 is: 11-12-13-14-15-16-17-19-22-25-28-32. Which is the jump you don't like?

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