Campagnolo 12-Speed

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
welchy
Posts: 323
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2015 4:04 pm

by welchy

Man, all I can say is you’re all fart and no poo.

Try riding it, then comment. I’ve ridden 11-25, 11-27, 12-27, 11-29 and 12-29 on 52/36 and now I’m rocking 11-32.

It’s just as useful around the UK as it is in the mountains, when you’re crawling at the end of a heavy CG back home or upping cadence on a super steep country lane on a 2hr ride. It works. As for extra weight, yeh it’s weight weenies and all but the additional cadence and saved energy and the Watts I can pump out being fresher make a bigger difference than the 40gs or whatever minimal weight I’ve saved sticking to 11spd.

There is no need to go to 12spd until you go to 12spd. I would’ve been happy with 11spd but new bike meant 12spd. For some it works, for you I doubt much will work if you didn’t come up with the idea :thumbup:

All joking aside though it is decent...

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mr_tim
Posts: 952
Joined: Sun May 31, 2009 8:47 pm
Location: durp durp durp

by mr_tim

I've ridden crap gear ranges already. 8 speed 11-28 etc. Don't want to go back.

The selling point of 11v was closer ratios

For people that don't need bail out gears 12v just takes away what was the good thing 11v brought ... along with a better ergo shape.

Waiting for 12v with a smaller range cassette. I hope campag listen.


AJS914
Posts: 4306
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

I like the 12-29. 52x12 is plenty of top gear. Both an 11 and a 32 will go unused so I'm not even considering an "upgrade". Maybe on the next new bike.

robertbb
Posts: 1599
Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:35 am
Location: Melbourne, Australia

by robertbb

neeb wrote:
Thu Jul 04, 2019 9:25 pm

The 11 speed 11-32 spacing is 11–12–13–14–15–17–19–22–25–28–32. That means that if you only need a 12-25 for the riding that you are doing, you are effectively downgrading from 11 speed to 8 speed by switching to an 11-32.. (12–13–14–15–17–19–22–25), or to 9 speed if you switch from an 11 speed 12-25 to a "12 speed" 11-32.. You get much bigger jumps between the gears, with the added bonus of carrying around a significant amount of extra weight.. :D

Even going from an 11sp 12-27 (12-13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-25-27) to a 12sp 11-29 (11-12-13-14-15-16-17-19-21-23-26-29) you are not gaining any more useful sprockets (arguably you are still losing one) while getting larger gaps at the dinner-plate end.

Obviously bigger sprockets are useful in the Pyrenees, but for me at least, if they aren't useful whatosever for 95%+ of my riding then I'd rather switch cassettes for trips to the mountains once every two years or so!

AND
mr_tim wrote:
Fri Jul 05, 2019 12:20 am
I've ridden crap gear ranges already. 8 speed 11-28 etc. Don't want to go back.

The selling point of 11v was closer ratios

For people that don't need bail out gears 12v just takes away what was the good thing 11v brought ... along with a better ergo shape.

Waiting for 12v with a smaller range cassette. I hope campag listen.
150%, unequivocally, every little bit and then some... THIS! :thumbup:

Sin2000
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2019 4:19 pm

by Sin2000

Agreed. I’m a big Campag fan, but I’m not interested in 12 speed until closer ratios are available. 12-27 for the UK please and 12-32 for European trips.

ghisallo2003
Posts: 693
Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:10 pm

by ghisallo2003

Also agreed. 12-13-14-15-16-17-18-19-21-23-25-27 for me would be ideal.

I know there is some clever geometry going on for the larger cogs, and I wonder whether the mech is actually not optimised for these smaller ones.

WorkonSunday
Posts: 224
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 4:39 pm

by WorkonSunday

toying with the next year's upgrade ideas. For next year, im planning to take on some triathlon events. currently using ultegra 6800 with Rotor Aldhu 52/36 on my Wilier Cento1 Air (flat course bike).

trying to see if i should go down the 1x route or stick with 2x when i upgrade to Chorus 12.

if 2x, then the chainset will stay, then Chorus 12 everything with 11-29.

if 1x, i will change the direct mount chain ring to 54T, then 11-34 at the back....

but the 1x aldhu chainring costs fair abit, in fact 1x route is probably more expensive. plus abit wasteful since the 52/36 still has quite alot of life left.

hmm... decision, decision.
Some say pour 10ml water out of your bottle to save that last bit of the weight. Sorry, i go one step further, i tend to the rider off my bikes. :thumbup:

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cveks
Posts: 178
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by cveks

Anyone here tested 12 speed groupset on bike against around same 11 speed bike of similar weight and configuration?

Is there any real benefit ?

On sprints ? On mountain climbs?

andreas
Posts: 194
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:21 pm

by andreas

It's 1 better :smartass:

Seedster
Posts: 611
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:05 pm

by Seedster

I upgraded my 11 speed 11-29 to 12 speed 11-29 and changed the rings to 52/36 from 53/39. while not apples to apples, I love the crisper shifting, greater ability to spin (attributable to mid-compact) and the hidden DTI Junction box. Havent sprinted with it yet.

XCProMD
Posts: 906
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:25 am
Location: Cantabria

by XCProMD

cveks wrote:Anyone here tested 12 speed groupset on bike against around same 11 speed bike of similar weight and configuration?

Is there any real benefit ?

On sprints ? On mountain climbs?
Yes. First the drawback:

- As many point out the Campag 12s system implies carrying all your sprocket quiver on the bike all the time. Which is more often than not unnecessary and therefore means useless weight and a lost opportunity to have a close cluster with as small gaps as possible. In my case I chose the 11-29 cassette in all three bikes, and still I very seldom use the 11 and the 29. To me a 12-26 would be spot on, so I’m tinkering with a local metalworks shop to make my own. The 11-29 would be left for the big days in the Alps where it’s ace.

The good:

- It is exactly there, in those days in which there’s plenty of climbing with long downhills and semi flat stints in between where one you get use to having 12 cogs there’s no turning back. The 11 comes handy going down, the 29 keeps you from smashing on the steeper places and still you have all gears there to make it through the connecting bits always at the right cadence, with one teeth difference.

- The shifting is even crisper in the mechanical groupsets as well as in EPS. Not that it was needed, but doesn’t hurt either!

-The ErgoPowers are also that slightly better than the already fantastic 11s version






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Butcher
Shop Owner
Posts: 1108
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:58 am

by Butcher

I would take a 12/26 or a 11/26. Still waiting for the EPS bits to be sorted out, but I hope when I bite the bullet, there is cassette that has something less than 29. I doubt if I would ever use that.

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ultimobici
in the industry
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by ultimobici

I find it amusing that so many people are bleating about not having a 11-25 or 11-27. Shimano still offers 11-25 yet, even though I work for a dealer in the SE of England where anything bigger is generally unnecessary, we only sell 11-27 in volume when they are in sale and rarely sell 11-25 ever. Looking at most pro set ups and one sees they almost exclusively use an 11-28 or 11-29. The days of hunting for the right gear died with 11 speed.


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neeb
Posts: 680
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:19 pm

by neeb

ultimobici wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:01 am
I find it amusing that so many people are bleating about not having a 11-25 or 11-27. Shimano still offers 11-25 yet, even though I work for a dealer in the SE of England where anything bigger is generally unnecessary, we only sell 11-27 in volume when they are in sale and rarely sell 11-25 ever. Looking at most pro set ups and one sees they almost exclusively use an 11-28 or 11-29. The days of hunting for the right gear died with 11 speed.


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I find it amusing that people “in the industry” continue to ignore logical arguments on the grounds of “what sells” or what the pros use.

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corky
Posts: 1538
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2006 5:53 pm
Location: The Surrey Hills

by corky

neeb wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:43 am
ultimobici wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:01 am
I find it amusing that so many people are bleating about not having a 11-25 or 11-27. Shimano still offers 11-25 yet, even though I work for a dealer in the SE of England where anything bigger is generally unnecessary, we only sell 11-27 in volume when they are in sale and rarely sell 11-25 ever. Looking at most pro set ups and one sees they almost exclusively use an 11-28 or 11-29. The days of hunting for the right gear died with 11 speed.


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I find it amusing that people “in the industry” continue to ignore logical arguments on the grounds of “what sells” or what the pros use.
What sells is a logical argument for the industry non?


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