Campagnolo 12-Speed

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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Calnago
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by Calnago

Tell your friend to step away from your bicycle and immediately remove all wrenches within his reach. Do it right or go home. Use a proper Campy pin that comes with the chain. Peen it properly.
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morrisond
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Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 8:34 pm

by morrisond

hannawald wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:23 pm
I will be new to Campy. My mate is using Sram quick link to connect his Campy chain. Not supported by Campagnolo but he says it works. What do you use for 12 speed? I dont wanna buy 150 euros chain tool from Campa..KMC quick link seems close in width to Campy narrow chain..
Thank you
Park tool makes one for $65 which you can use on all other Chains as well.

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Kjetil
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by Kjetil

hannawald wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:23 pm
I dont wanna buy 150 euros chain tool from Campa.
Sacrilege! :lol:
Anyway, that's what I use. It's a great tool.
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scb
Posts: 211
Joined: Wed May 27, 2009 4:16 pm

by scb

KMC 12 speed missing link is listed on their website as compatible with Campy 12 speed chain. I'm trying it now, and have had no issues. (I know it's blasphemy)

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ultimobici
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by ultimobici

scb wrote:KMC 12 speed missing link is listed on their website as compatible with Campy 12 speed chain. I'm trying it now, and have had no issues. (I know it's blasphemy)
If the top sprocket on 12 speed is anything like the 11 speed one, it isn’t blasphemy.....


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ghisallo2003
Posts: 653
Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:10 pm

by ghisallo2003

Not blasphemy, but every time I have seen a chain fail, it has been at the quick-link, and the consequences can include damage to rear mech, wheel and frame. I dont understand why anyone would take the risk when Campagnolo have purposefully designed a method of connection.

Pajaa76
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:01 am

by Pajaa76

ghisallo2003 wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 7:42 am
Not blasphemy, but every time I have seen a chain fail, it has been at the quick-link, and the consequences can include damage to rear mech, wheel and frame. I dont understand why anyone would take the risk when Campagnolo have purposefully designed a method of connection.
Because of waxing the chain? Using the riveting means you can`t wax the chain in hot wax. BTW I`m on Campy from 1996, almost 200.000km and I had 1 case that chain fail - due to wrong riveting (my job with Revolver :mrgreen: ). Last 10 years I`m using links on Campy C9 (SRAM) and C10 (KMC) without a problem (sprints over 1000W). I believe the same will be with C11 and C12. I`m waxing the chain after 600-800km and replacing the link after 5 use (aprox. 3500km) just for safety. 3 links per year.

:smartass: From engineering site. Campy chain - when you riveting, the pin and outer plate using press connection. It means a new outer plate of chain where you do riveting is deformed by pressing forces (yes is design for it). But when you use the missing link, Campy chain is not affected by any forces during connection. If the missing link is designed for Campy use (like KMC 10) then the chain is connected properly without any added strain/tensions and have right dimension to do not affect shifting performance. Plus easy to use. I think that this is the reason why even Shimano start to use it. And I believe that Campy will go for it too - but you know Campy, it will take some time :)

mattr
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by mattr

ghisallo2003 wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 7:42 am
Not blasphemy, but every time I have seen a chain fail, it has been at the quick-link, and the consequences can include damage to rear mech, wheel and frame. I dont understand why anyone would take the risk when Campagnolo have purposefully designed a method of connection.
Isn't it just a slight refinement of the 20 year old shimano OS rivet method. With a more expensive tool? I mean, that flaring of the pin I've done on shimano before now when the snap off piece hasn't snapped neatly.

And in ~30 years in a shop I'd guess that about 20% fail at a quick link, the rest either at a random pin or a joining pin.
The biggest issue with all methods is user error.
Mostly people using the old school methods to break and join a chain.

WorkonSunday
Posts: 118
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2018 4:39 pm

by WorkonSunday

im getting quite confused with all these 12 speeds designs. (sorry if i sound like hijacking the thread), so my understanding is:

Campy 12 speed, cog spacing is tighter than 11 speed, so chain plates have to be thinner. i.e. need new 12 speed chain.
Shimano MTB kept 11 speed cog spacing, but uses a micro-spline hub to effectively increase the length of freehub body. i.e. can still use 11 speed chain?
SRAM eagle/AXS 12 speed again kept the same 11 speed cog spacing but added the extra 50T cog on the hub side but 50T cog is so big it actually overhangs part of the hub. so 11 speed chain can still be used.
SRAM 12 speed road AXS is similar to eagle but the extra cog is added to XD-R driver which is a longer version of the XD driver. i.e. can still use 11 speed chain ?
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morrisond
Posts: 946
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 8:34 pm

by morrisond

I don't know about the others but Campy kept the Chain plates the same thickness - it just made the distance between them less - It should actually be stronger than 11sp chain.

AJS914
Posts: 3477
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

Why does it matter? Why would you buy a super expensive 12 speed group and then try and run an 11 speed chain?

Run the chain that the manufacturer recommends using their recommended installation / attachment method.

Tolerances are very tight on modern drivetrains. It makes no sense to monkey around or trying to use a 3rd party chain to save $20.



WorkonSunday wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 9:56 am
im getting quite confused with all these 12 speeds designs. (sorry if i sound like hijacking the thread), so my understanding is:

Campy 12 speed, cog spacing is tighter than 11 speed, so chain plates have to be thinner. i.e. need new 12 speed chain.
Shimano MTB kept 11 speed cog spacing, but uses a micro-spline hub to effectively increase the length of freehub body. i.e. can still use 11 speed chain?
SRAM eagle/AXS 12 speed again kept the same 11 speed cog spacing but added the extra 50T cog on the hub side but 50T cog is so big it actually overhangs part of the hub. so 11 speed chain can still be used.
SRAM 12 speed road AXS is similar to eagle but the extra cog is added to XD-R driver which is a longer version of the XD driver. i.e. can still use 11 speed chain ?

XCProMD
Posts: 800
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Location: Cantabria

by XCProMD

Campag 12s, the chains plates are the same as for 11s. Is the distance between those that has been reduced.


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flying
Posts: 1932
Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2005 9:16 am

by flying

ghisallo2003 wrote:
Wed May 01, 2019 7:42 am
Not blasphemy, but every time I have seen a chain fail, it has been at the quick-link, and the consequences can include damage to rear mech, wheel and frame. I dont understand why anyone would take the risk when Campagnolo have purposefully designed a method of connection.
I think the failed quick links were always the older type that were reused & did not close with a positive locking snap.
I too have seen those simple slide non-locking types come loose

But the new one use type that Shimano DurAce also uses I think is another story.
You need the pliers tool to open & close these & cannot see them failing.

Of course it remains to be seen but at this time I have never heard of one or seen one
of these fail...Has anyone ?


robertbb
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Location: Melbourne, Australia

by robertbb

I know it's considered taboo on the forums here and counter to Campy's own warranty, but honestly there is nothing wrong with the 11s KMC Quick Links on 11s Campy chains. You do need to be careful and look closely to ensure that they mate properly when first attaching and then are locked in fully (I use the park tool master link pliers). Once they're in, they're in and IMHO are totally reliable.

Flame away. :twisted:


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