Light aero bike - pointless or best of both worlds?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
User avatar
Lewn777
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

dim wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:28 am
get a light climbing bike such as a Scott Addict, or a Giant TCR, and upgrade the wheels to tubeless.
Already have. Fuji SL with DT Swiss RR21 Dicut and Panaracer Race A Evo tubeless.

User avatar
Lewn777
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

I think my own answer to this thread is N+1. :D :thumbup:

I'll make my climbing bike more climbing. I'll take the clip-ons off it and dedicate it purely to the job of going up and down mountains, if I lose a few minutes on the flats it doesn't matter.

Then I'll buy an aero bike, get a proper fit on it and put aero bars on it and fast tires. The rationale is lots of days I have half days and hot summer evenings where I can't get to the mountains and I ride fast flat straight roads.

Two bikes two different jobs. But should I buy and aero bike or a TT bike? :D :D :D

by Weenie


alcatraz
Posts: 1295
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

I was in the same situation. I went with tt because aero fit is more similar to road and I don't want a half fit. Aero frames are often much lighter than tt so this felt like the logical choice at first.

Cervelo S5 is a pretty flexible bike. I considered it for a while. The seat post can be had with the clamp in a forward position slot which you need to get comfy low over the bars/clipon's.

Choosing the wrong aero bike could kill your clip-on ambitions since most seat posts don't allow for a forward enough seat. There are rarely any seatposts that fit to fix this either.

My body shape aggravates this issue with forward seat because I'm long leg and short torso. High seat puts it far back. Need a steep seat tube angle.

That's why I went TT. That and I like bb30 bottom brackets and nice tube shapes of the tt frames. With an aero frame I won't know where my max is on strava. With TT I will perhaps. :D

/a

User avatar
Lewn777
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

alcatraz wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 9:18 am
I was in the same situation. I went with tt because aero fit is more similar to road and I don't want a half fit. Aero frames are often much lighter than tt so this felt like the logical choice at first.

Cervelo S5 is a pretty flexible bike. I considered it for a while. The seat post can be had with the clamp in a forward position slot which you need to get comfy low over the bars/clipon's.

Choosing the wrong aero bike could kill your clip-on ambitions since most seat posts don't allow for a forward enough seat. There are rarely any seatposts that fit to fix this either.

My body shape aggravates this issue with forward seat because I'm long leg and short torso. High seat puts it far back. Need a steep seat tube angle.

That's why I went TT. That and I like bb30 bottom brackets and nice tube shapes of the tt frames. With an aero frame I won't know where my max is on strava. With TT I will perhaps. :D

/a
Thanks, you're making me lean more towards a TT bike. Also in this area cycle-run duathlons are set to get pretty big next year.

alcatraz
Posts: 1295
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

I live in China and can get chinese frames for like 200-300usd.

If I were spending a lot I might not go the same route.

My climber is a Hongfu FM066SL and the TT frame I'm looking for is an older model that goes under many names. One of them is Polygon Helios 900TT. I don't like spending too much because I don't want my old lady to hate me. :D Besides if I do decide to sell one day I don't wanna lose a huge chunk and wait an eternity to get rid of it.

ichobi
Posts: 652
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:30 pm

by ichobi

This really simple. Modern breed of all around (climbing bikes) come with some form of aero tube shape. The new R5, the Tarmac Sl6, the Canyon Ulimate. 3 of these bikes are just nominally slower than full bred aero bikes. Slap on an aero handlebar and you get most of the benefit of aero bike with none of the down side. Descending on these 3 bikes is simply bliss. Slap on 60mm wheels on a flat and you are set.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

User avatar
TonyM
Posts: 2629
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:11 pm

by TonyM

Lewn777 wrote:I think my own answer to this thread is N+1. :D :thumbup:

I'll make my climbing bike more climbing. I'll take the clip-ons off it and dedicate it purely to the job of going up and down mountains, if I lose a few minutes on the flats it doesn't matter.

Then I'll buy an aero bike, get a proper fit on it and put aero bars on it and fast tires. The rationale is lots of days I have half days and hot summer evenings where I can't get to the mountains and I ride fast flat straight roads.

Two bikes two different jobs. But should I buy and aero bike or a TT bike? :D :D :D
Then go for a TT bike!

User avatar
Lelandjt
Posts: 451
Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2016 7:10 am

by Lelandjt

I had the same goals as you with my most recent bike so I settled on a 2016 Fuji Transonic SL frameset with a custom build. The complete bike would have been $5000 and 17.5lbs but I had some parts already and deals lined up so I saved some money and got it to 14.5lbs (size 61). I went with 50mm rear rim and 38mm front rim to balance aero with weight and handling in wind. I'm very happy with the bike and wouldn't trade it for anything in the price bracket. Given unlimited funds I'd be curious if the F10 or Aeroroad framesets are lighter but areo-wise I think it's close enough to the best to not matter and it's definitely lighter than the Madone and S5.

I'll echo the other comments that a clip on bar isn't beneficial on a drop bar bike that already has an optimal position cuz the clip-on position won't be optimal.

User avatar
Ringo
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2018 10:06 am

by Ringo

Go for the madone 9 H1.
Has the latest tech:isospeed for comfort, nice aero looks, low weight, sure it’ll motivate you to go faster.

Other than that don’t expect much. Gains from aero bikes are for laughs - see Tour test...
The biggest problem in cycling aerodynamics is the rider, not the bikes.
Ride aggressively on drops as much as you can, lose some weight and wear tighter clothes, shave you beard... there you go!

1,2 or 3 min at a 100km ride??! Who gives a f#ck?!

Buy something that motivates you

User avatar
Lewn777
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

Lelandjt wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:53 pm
I'll echo the other comments that a clip on bar isn't beneficial on a drop bar bike that already has an optimal position cuz the clip-on position won't be optimal.
I'm confused now :? , I always thought clip on bars always added a few kms and hour in average speed and I thought I could confirm this from my own data on Strava or it could just be my imagination! :shock: I thought you just gained less average speed than an optimised position you might find on a TT bike. That's why there are super long distance individual enduro events such as the Indian-Pacific wheel race where clip-on TT bars are considered essential. The reason why clip-on TT bars aren't on climbing bikes and aero bikes from new is that they're simply not legal in race rides, but it doesn't mean there is no benefit.

If you have any data that can prove me wrong or anyone else who thinks this is the case I'm happy to learn something new and gladly remove 300 grams from my bike that is actually of no real benefit. I'm not attacking you or your opinion, I come to forums to learn, if I'm wrong I'm happy to have my myths busted. :D
Last edited by Lewn777 on Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

alcatraz
Posts: 1295
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

Get the clipons that can be raised and where the pads are attached to the tube and not the clamp. That way you can make the best of it.

The remaining big issues won't be the bars but the seat tube angle and maybe the handling characteristics of the bike.

/a

User avatar
Lewn777
Posts: 363
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

alcatraz wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:47 pm
I live in China and can get chinese frames for like 200-300usd.

If I were spending a lot I might not go the same route.

My climber is a Hongfu FM066SL and the TT frame I'm looking for is an older model that goes under many names. One of them is Polygon Helios 900TT. I don't like spending too much because I don't want my old lady to hate me. :D Besides if I do decide to sell one day I don't wanna lose a huge chunk and wait an eternity to get rid of it.
I'm in China too!
What province are you in? I'm in Shandong, connect on Strava. https://www.strava.com/athletes/1865827

To be honest I'm not considering a Chinese frame even though I live in China. I bought a Java CX bike a few years ago, the fork imploded I could have been killed (just road rash luckily) and their idea of a warranty was to laugh in my face. :shock:I also used to ride motorcycles here and found that Chinese motorcycles just work poorly and have terrible resale value if you could even sell them at all. I've noticed things are changing though, there are some lovely carbon fiber parts, excellent CNC machined alloy and very good titanium parts available. They still seem wholly incapable of making a good bearing though. :roll:

So no, I'll stick with a western brand for frames and forks, one that's done their own research and development, sponsors riders and puts money back into the sport, if something goes wrong will do a recall and has customer service. Individual parts however, I'm open minded.

alcatraz
Posts: 1295
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:19 am

by alcatraz

I get it. Many chinese riders are pretty light weight too so if you get something then maybe pick something aimed at the western market. Then it's less likely to explode.

Following your strava, Aye sir!

If you get an S5 with the double slotted seat post (clamp), aero bars fully adjustable. Shorter cranks. Electrical groupset with shifters on the aero bars. It could be a killer hybrid bike. No fast switch but you would have the adjustability.

If I had to pick one bike it'd be something like this. Built under 7kg. Few gearing options for climbing and for flats. Mid cage derailleur. QXL rings.

I'm not so much in the drops so I'd probably go base bar and aero.

/a

User avatar
Noctiluxx
Posts: 429
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2017 7:17 pm
Location: Southern California

by Noctiluxx

Just add some aero wheels and bars to your current Fuji SL. Maybe an aero helmet too.
2018 Bianchi Oltre XR4, (Celeste Matt)
2018 De Rosa SK Pininfarina (Blu)
2019 Trek Madone SLR (Rage Red)
2019 Giant TCR Advanced SL (Chameleon Blue)
2016 Specialized Allez DSW Sprint (Gold)

User avatar
Lelandjt
Posts: 451
Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2016 7:10 am

by Lelandjt

Lewn777 wrote:
Sun Feb 04, 2018 1:05 am
Lelandjt wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:53 pm
I'll echo the other comments that a clip on bar isn't beneficial on a drop bar bike that already has an optimal position cuz the clip-on position won't be optimal.
I'm confused now :? , I always thought clip on bars always added a few kms and hour in average speed and I thought I could confirm this from my own data on Strava or it could just be my imagination! :shock: I thought you just gained less average speed than an optimised position you might find on a TT bike. That's why there are super long distance individual enduro events such as the Indian-Pacific wheel race where clip-on TT bars are considered essential. The reason why clip-on TT bars aren't on climbing bikes and aero bikes from new is that they're simply not legal in race rides, but it doesn't mean there is no benefit.

If you have any data that can prove me wrong or anyone else who thinks this is the case I'm happy to learn something new and gladly remove 300 grams from my bike that is actually of no real benefit. I'm not attacking you or your opinion, I come to forums to learn, if I'm wrong I'm happy to have my myths busted. :D
When my road bike had a slightly shorter reach, higher bar, and more adjustable clip-on aero bar I liked using the aero bar. When my handlebar got lower and farther forward my position in the drops got more aero while the position on the aero bar got less ideal. When I switched from a round top bar to and aero top bar that necessitated a less adjustable aero bar that clips onto the stem. This still worked while I had a spightly upward sloping (0°) stem but when I replaced it with a -6° stem the aero bar started to feel pretty precarious while my position in the drops had gotten so aero that the speed/aero difference was really minimized. At this point I was barely ever putting the clip-ons on the bike so I finally decided to get a lighter stem and stop using them at all.

The endurance guys you reference don't have anywhere near as aero a position in the drops and their bike is set up with a focus on the clip ons. If you want to build a bike with weight as a priority and an aero position in the drops you'll have a harder time getting a good position on the clip-ons. You'll have to find a clip on that works with an aero top handlebar, has a lot of adjustability, and doesn't weigh a ton. Hard to find.

by Weenie


Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post