Madone Disc Spotted

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
CAAD8FRED
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:52 pm

by CAAD8FRED

sennder wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:57 pm
CAAD8FRED wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:13 pm
hlvd wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 5:26 pm
The current Madone 9.0 seems a bargain with 600 OCLV compared to the new SL with 500.
How does each level of Trek carbon stack up against each other? Basically, is 600 that much more valuable than 500?
Madone 9.0 with OCLV 600 seems to be 390 grams lighter than the new Madone SL 6 with OCLV 500. The bikes are otherwise identical (except for a slightly lighter saddle in the older Madone 9.0). That's a pretty big difference.
Besides weight are there structural differences like stiffness?

by Weenie


Hexsense
Posts: 483
Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:41 am

by Hexsense

smartyiak wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:33 pm
Why do aero bikes EVER come with a 50/34....ever?!?!?!?! :noidea: :x

+1 goes to the new Venge!!!
Why?
Does aero bike means the rider will be incapable of using high cadence?
With all the extra weight, compact is good. If your average cadence is below 89rpm or max cadence is below 129rpm, improve it.
If you spin out 110RPM+ frequently, you are too good to use factory spec bike.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 1532
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

wingguy wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:36 pm
TobinHatesYou wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:50 pm
Velonews is wrong.

Trek’s claim is the disc bike is 15g of drag faster. It’s definitely not a lighter bike, just a more slippery one.
Velonews is right (pinch me, I must be dreaming!) :lol:

Trek's whitepaper does claim the disc frame is lighter. Coincidentally, by 15g - though the fork is 33g heavier. Couldn't be bothered to trawl through the small parts but their list is exceptionally detailed. Kudos to Trek.
There’s something very odd about their whitepaper values of 870g/885g. Even considering no paint, that is an extremely light aero frame.

Here was what CyclingTips quoted:
“Claimed weight for the new rim-brake Madone SLR frame and fork are 1,112g and 378g, respectively, while the disc-brake version is slightly heavier still at 1,131g and 421g”

mag
Posts: 150
Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 12:23 pm

by mag

it just seems that the cyclingtips article operates with the total weight - bare frame, isospeed hardware, derailleur hanger, seatmast etc.

wingguy
Posts: 4042
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:43 pm

by wingguy

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:27 pm
There’s something very odd about their whitepaper values of 870g/885g. Even considering no paint, that is an extremely light aero frame.
It looks like 'frame' means mainframe and not any of the other isospeed parts. So the L shaped leafspring/seatmast part that hinges on the Isospeed bearing is listed as 'seatmast' at 151g (not including the seatpost either, that's close to another 250g inc clamps), which already pushes the frame over 1kg. Adding the other Isospeed parts and RD hanger gets you approx 1120g on the rim, and 1105g on the disc.

I would say CyclingTips have mixed up the frames and just assumed the heavier frame goes with the heavier fork - when actually a disc frame should be lighter because it doesn't need a reinforced brake bridge and rim brake forks should be lighter because it doesn't need a reinforced leg.

PS; Trek have done themselves out of a 16g saving on the total bike weights because they counted the chaincatcher twice.

PPS; The bike is stunning and the paintwork is phenomenal. Absolutely class leading among the big manufacturers and I wish the other guys would wake up and develop a similar custom program.
Last edited by wingguy on Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

mag
Posts: 150
Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 12:23 pm

by mag

Yep, and here are videos of those ICON paints (if this hasn't been already posted): https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/project-one-icon/
There's one (Prismatic Pearl) which isn't yet available.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 1532
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

mag wrote:
Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:02 am
Yep, and here are videos of those ICON paints (if this hasn't been already posted): https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/project-one-icon/
There's one (Prismatic Pearl) which isn't yet available.

The CyclingTips article has good shots of the Prismatic Pearl. I’m a big fan of the Refliptive...I’d need to see the Prismatic Pearl in person I think. Black Gold looks ghastly from afar, but has a cool undulating effect up close


@wingguy, the Emonda SLR Disc frame is 25g heavier than the rim-brake version, so there is still a bit of reinforcement needed in the NDS chainstay as well as weight consideration of the flat-mount itself. The NDS chainstay on my Emonda is noticeably larger...it looks like a polio victim... Maybe the Madone’s squared chainstays require bolstering on both sides and the difference is minimal.

wingguy
Posts: 4042
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:43 pm

by wingguy

I'm genuinely blown away by this thing.

I don't even want an aero frame, but I can't remember being this impressed by the look of a bike since the Soloist SLC dropped. And I was much younger and more impressionable then! :P

Tobin, I know the Cervelo R5 and R3 are both now claimed as lighter mainframes in the disc variant. I thought the Tarmac was as well but can't find anything on a quick search. Maybe Spesh deleted their weight claim again or maybe my brain's making it up.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 1532
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

It's like there's a weird role-reversal going on with Specialized and Trek this time around. Normally Trek has the most drab paint options imaginable and Specialized offers several chameleon/pearl themes. This time Specialized has a single black bike and a kinda gross looking Sagan Collection option and Trek well... PRISMATIC PEARL WOW. On the other hand it must have something like 3 coats on top of primer and weigh a ton.

NiFTY
Posts: 1173
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 11:26 pm

by NiFTY

As someone who is looking at an aero bike purchase but not keen on a disc bike this new madone is ticking all the boxes. Or it might just push down the prices of the old madone and make a second hand purchase even cheaper.
Evo 5.02kg SL3 6.77 Slice RS 8.89 viewtopic.php?f=10&t=110579" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

spartan
Posts: 1150
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 2:52 am

by spartan

one big negative. trek closed down production of the oclv700 madone production in wiscosin moved production to china. did the price go down. no. it went up. LOL
Current Rides:

2017 Giant TCR Advanced SL 0 DI2 9150

hlvd
Posts: 154
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2016 4:54 pm

by hlvd

As I'll never be in the financial position to buy an SLR I was holding on to see what the SL version would be like rather than buying the 9.0.
Major disappointment as it's gone from 9.0 600 ocvl to SL 500 oclv, heavier and costs £100 more
The SL still has the flappy wings and I'm not even sure if has the new design frame as well, just the original.

sychen
Posts: 293
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:06 pm

by sychen

those prisamtic/metalic flake paint jobs looks amazing even in photos (which doesn't do them justice), the one I saw in the shop was the most boring grey unfortunately.

https://www.bikeradar.com/road/gear/art ... int-52537/

smartyiak
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:20 pm

by smartyiak

Hexsense wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:24 pm
smartyiak wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:33 pm
Why do aero bikes EVER come with a 50/34....ever?!?!?!?! :noidea: :x

+1 goes to the new Venge!!!
Why?
Does aero bike means the rider will be incapable of using high cadence?
With all the extra weight, compact is good. If your average cadence is below 89rpm or max cadence is below 129rpm, improve it.
If you spin out 110RPM+ frequently, you are too good to use factory spec bike.
This whole time I didn’t realize the 53/39 and 52/36 don’t allow a rider to spin a high cadence. I stand corrected.

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tymon_tm
Posts: 2474
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2006 4:35 pm

by tymon_tm

wingguy wrote:
Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:36 am
I'm genuinely blown away by this thing.

I don't even want an aero frame, but I can't remember being this impressed by the look of a bike since the Soloist SLC dropped. And I was much younger and more impressionable then! :P

Tobin, I know the Cervelo R5 and R3 are both now claimed as lighter mainframes in the disc variant. I thought the Tarmac was as well but can't find anything on a quick search. Maybe Spesh deleted their weight claim again or maybe my brain's making it up.
same here. yesterday I saw the new Sagan Collection Venge, and simply fell in love, wondering if it's time to buy a Spec after all? today I click on Trekbikes to compare geometry and see all those SLRs... I've struggled with the notion of buying Madone like a whole year, but now just can't help myself - they look too good, and just by looking at them I already feel how freakin faster they gonna make me go 8)
kkibbler wrote: WW remembers.

by Weenie


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