Switching to a non cutout saddle?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
Hapsmo911
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by Hapsmo911

So my old Toupe is just about done. Since they changed the design I am looking at other options. I have never tried a saddle without a cutout. I had an old Aliante that came on a Giant I have since sold, but never used it. I decided to put it on and give it a try. I didn't kill me as I thought it would. It almost seemed like I was able to push harder. It felt like I was more planted, or solid in the saddle. The only real issue I had was my man bits sit on top of this saddle, whereas with the toupe it was more to the side prob tmi but whatever.

Now I am wondering if I even needed a cutout. I only rode three 20 miles rides. Maybe if I were to go further it may give me some issues. I also noticed many pros do not use cutouts. Anyone have good luck switching to a non cutout saddle?

by Weenie


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wheelbuilder
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by wheelbuilder

I am interested in responses to this post. I don't think I need one either, but have always used them. My MTB saddle does not have cut out, but road..........always.

bm0p700f
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by bm0p700f

tryt and see it is the only way to know. i use cut out and non cut out saddles on road and mtb. i find no difference in comfort.

dim
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by dim

Fizik Arione .... I found that very comfortable especially on long rides and it was fitted to my Specialized S-Works.... I will buy another if I get a bike that needs a new saddle

my current 2 main bikes have Brooks Cambium C17 Carved (with the cutouts).... I don't even think about a saddle whilst riding long distance
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Hapsmo911
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by Hapsmo911

dim wrote:Fizik Arione .... I found that very comfortable especially on long rides and it was fitted to my Specialized S-Works.... I will buy another if I get a bike that needs a new saddle

my current 2 main bikes have Brooks Cambium C17 Carved (with the cutouts).... I don't even think about a saddle whilst riding long distance


Yeah, My toupe was perfect. I didnt think about it at all. I would stick with one but they changed it completely.

I just found it odd that I never tried a non cutout saddle. After trying one it seemed like I was more stable, I dont know how else to describe it. Its not much to do with comfort, just the stability of my hips and arse.

Mr.Gib
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by Mr.Gib

Stability likely has more to do with other factors such as width and profile than it does with whether there is a cutout or not. Nice thing about no cutout is that pressure is distributed over a greater area. This can give a more "connected" feeling. Whether one's undercarriage can tolerate this pressure in the sensitive areas is the issue for most.

Wish I could ride without a cutout, I prefer the feel. I spent years riding a traditional saddle without a center channel, but for me like many of us, the body changes with time, so now my taint requires more freedom. Be aware that what is perfect now may not be so in a year or so.
wheelsONfire wrote: When we ride disc brakes the whole deal of braking is just like a leaving a fart. It happens and then it's over. Nothing planned and nothing to get nervous for.

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silvalis
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by silvalis

+1 profile.

If you found more stability on an aliante vs a toupe it's most likely a round vs flatter saddle profile thing, not a cutout vs no-cutout thing.
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Hapsmo911
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by Hapsmo911

Mr.Gib wrote:Stability likely has more to do with other factors such as width and profile than it does with whether there is a cutout or not. Nice thing about no cutout is that pressure is distributed over a greater area. This can give a more "connected" feeling. Whether one's undercarriage can tolerate this pressure in the sensitive areas is the issue for most.

Wish I could ride without a cutout, I prefer the feel. I spent years riding a traditional saddle without a center channel, but for me like many of us, the body changes with time, so now my taint requires more freedom. Be aware that what is perfect now may not be so in a year or so.



I made a mistake on the Fizik, it's actually an Arione.

I think what I was trying to describe is what you are referring to as connected. With the Fizik I am rolling my hips forward. I feel like I am better positioned.... connected? Odd how good the non cutout feels. The thing is, all the talk about blood flow and disfunction due to these types of saddles has me all freaked out. So I am unsure that if you ride a non cutout saddle and you do not get numb or pain is it all good, or are you somehow still jacking your body up? The last thing anyone wants is not to be "fully functional" you know what i mean...

There's a local company called Meld that makes custom saddles. I am seriously considering them at this point. I read that they can help provide their opinion on if you need a cutout or not through their custom process.

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silvalis
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by silvalis

You probably need to compare an arione against an arione VS then.
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Hapsmo911
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by Hapsmo911

silvalis wrote:You probably need to compare an arione against an arione VS then.


Yeah I think thats a good idea. Ill see if I can get one tomorrow. I think they have a loan program.

Mr.Gib
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by Mr.Gib

If a non-cutout saddle feels good than go for it. You won't damage yourself. If it's not right for you your body will tell you. Sometimes a saddle can feel good for a few weeks and then it sort of "catches up with you" and the pain starts. I have heard stories about guys who are perfectly comfortable when riding but then have boner problems. That might be something to watch for. Me, I am still trying to find a saddle that is comfortable to ride with a boner. :P
wheelsONfire wrote: When we ride disc brakes the whole deal of braking is just like a leaving a fart. It happens and then it's over. Nothing planned and nothing to get nervous for.

stax
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by stax

Hapsmo911 wrote:
Mr.Gib wrote:Stability likely has more to do with other factors such as width and profile than it does with whether there is a cutout or not. Nice thing about no cutout is that pressure is distributed over a greater area. This can give a more "connected" feeling. Whether one's undercarriage can tolerate this pressure in the sensitive areas is the issue for most.

Wish I could ride without a cutout, I prefer the feel. I spent years riding a traditional saddle without a center channel, but for me like many of us, the body changes with time, so now my taint requires more freedom. Be aware that what is perfect now may not be so in a year or so.



I made a mistake on the Fizik, it's actually an Arione.

I think what I was trying to describe is what you are referring to as connected. With the Fizik I am rolling my hips forward. I feel like I am better positioned.... connected? Odd how good the non cutout feels. The thing is, all the talk about blood flow and disfunction due to these types of saddles has me all freaked out. So I am unsure that if you ride a non cutout saddle and you do not get numb or pain is it all good, or are you somehow still jacking your body up? The last thing anyone wants is not to be "fully functional" you know what i mean...

There's a local company called Meld that makes custom saddles. I am seriously considering them at this point. I read that they can help provide their opinion on if you need a cutout or not through their custom process.


I am 3 rides in with my Meld saddle and am nearly convinced. I usually ride a Selle Italia SLR Kit Carbonio Flow and when ordering my Meld wanted a cut out with no channel as the only saddle with a channel I’d tried was the Toupe, which just didn’t work for me at all. Still have it- old shape- if you’re interested. Meld said the channel didn’t work for me as it didn’t fit correctly, but theirs would. First ride was great till I hit a climb and I got a lot of pain on the undercarriage about half way up an 8k. Got home to find the nose had dropped about 1.3 degrees which I think caused the problem. Rides 2 and 3 have been better but hampered by the sore so still not sure if this is the answer. It does feel amazing on flat ground but rubs on hills. And we have a lot of them around here...

Not that this answers your query, but an anecdotal Meld input that may help.

fromtrektocolnago
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by fromtrektocolnago

i found the cut-out helps on longer rides. You didn't indicate anything about ride duration. Seat preferences are personal and while I feel it works for me, I can't recall ever seeing any research that supports it, go with what feels good.
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TobinHatesYou
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by TobinHatesYou

The cutout helps riders who have good pelvic/hip flexibility and an extremely aggro body position. The more you roll your hips forward, the more your soft perineal tissue gets smashed into the nose of the saddle. I could never go back to a non-cutout saddle and have gone as far as switching from the S-Works Romin Evo and S-Works Power to an ISM PN 3.0. I don't miss the 3cm of extra nose the Power had. It served no purpose. I can still slide back and forth on the ISM...it actually has more usable length than any of my previous saddles when it comes to sitting on the pubic rami.

The only thing I ever used the nose of a saddle for was gripping it with my inner leg during descents. I just grip the top tube with my legs instead now.

If you sit upright with a back angle greater than, say, 50deg with your hands on the hoods, then a cutout saddle might not be absolutely necessary. Just keep in mind the middle of the saddle doesn't actually serve much purpose other than keeping your butt dry on a soggy ride.

Hapsmo911
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by Hapsmo911

Mr.Gib wrote:I am 3 rides in with my Meld saddle and am nearly convinced. I usually ride a Selle Italia SLR Kit Carbonio Flow and when ordering my Meld wanted a cut out with no channel as the only saddle with a channel I’d tried was the Toupe, which just didn’t work for me at all. Still have it- old shape- if you’re interested. Meld said the channel didn’t work for me as it didn’t fit correctly, but theirs would. First ride was great till I hit a climb and I got a lot of pain on the undercarriage about half way up an 8k. Got home to find the nose had dropped about 1.3 degrees which I think caused the problem. Rides 2 and 3 have been better but hampered by the sore so still not sure if this is the answer. It does feel amazing on flat ground but rubs on hills. And we have a lot of them around here...

Not that this answers your query, but an anecdotal Meld input that may help.


Would love to hear back from you after a few rides. When you think you might have decided whats working or not working..


fromtrektocolnago wrote:i found the cut-out helps on longer rides. You didn't indicate anything about ride duration. Seat preferences are personal and while I feel it works for me, I can't recall ever seeing any research that supports it, go with what feels good.


My after work rides are 20 miles on average 4-5 times a week. Weekend I get whatever I can in 40+ miles at least once a week. The discomfort of the Toupe I reckon is from the edges of the sharp cutout added with the huge amount of padding they added. I was fine with level 1 padding and the flexible shell. It seems you can only get level 1 padding in the power now. The Fizik just feels more solid to me. Just not sure if its a placebo. I have been switching back and forth from the Fizik to the Toupe attempting to figure it out. I need to leave the Fizik on for a couple weeks maybe. I am going to get a Fizik loaner from the shop today, one with some sort of cutout and try it. Most likely I will try their Antares just to see if I can get on with a more rounded shell.


TobinHatesYou wrote:If you sit upright with a back angle greater than, say, 50deg with your hands on the hoods, then a cutout saddle might not be absolutely necessary. Just keep in mind the middle of the saddle doesn't actually serve much purpose other than keeping your butt dry on a soggy ride.


Yes, sounds reasonable. Like I was saying, my problem started with the edges of the cutout. They are destroying my soft tissue. That's what started all this fuss. It maybe that the discomfort/pain from the cutout is forcing my body to react in a way that I am losing stability. But who knows I am no expert.

I am not a flexible person. I can get about 4" from touching the floor with my finger tips. Fizik puts me @ a Chameleon. I have never given a semi round saddle a chance. I have always run flat saddles. I would love another flat saddle with a more subtle transition to the cutout. Something where my bits wouldn't get smashed into the channel. One of the reasons for not trying a more rounded saddle is thinking that would just force the midsection of the saddle further into my soft parts, making things worse. But maybe I am wrong.

by Weenie


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