Help me upgrade to 11 (or 12?)

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.
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gitsome
Posts: 715
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:03 am
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by gitsome

Hello

Please help me figure out how to upgrade a LOOK 595 thats been running campy 10R to something more modern, bearings and all are wearing out, rather than spending $ on that, thoughy maybe its worth investing in newer components, would like to stay w campagnolo, but so confused as to what components to use, already have brakes (m8); like the looks of new Rotor 3d cranks, so prob not interested in full grouppo but rather piece by piece. Like to spin larger cassettes so is HO something to consider? And pref to stay mech for this one. If anyone feels up to it any advice on compatibility, etc is much appreciated, looking for something that will have decent long term value, 10 sp has been terrific in that respect.
Thanks

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by Weenie


AJS914
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by AJS914

Compatibility is no problem for your frameset. What are you confused about.

HO just means "hydraulic optimization". You can ignore that. If you buy a short cage rear derailleur you can use up to a 29 rear cog. If you get a medium cage you can can use up to a 32.

I would get a Campagnolo crankset simply because they are gorgeous and are the centerpiece of the grouppo. Rotor cranks are just a bit industrial looking. Of course, you choose in the end whatever you like.

gitsome
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Location: nyc

by gitsome

AJS914 wrote:Compatibility is no problem for your frameset. What are you confused about.

HO just means "hydraulic optimization". You can ignore that. If you buy a short cage rear derailleur you can use up to a 29 rear cog. If you get a medium cage you can can use up to a 32.

I would get a Campagnolo crankset simply because they are gorgeous and are the centerpiece of the grouppo. Rotor cranks are just a bit industrial looking. Of course, you choose in the end whatever you like.
Thanks, i guess the HO was most confusing, researching i guess its comp for disc but retro for everything else too?

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AJS914
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by AJS914

Yes on that regarding HO. I guess they tweeked the rear derailleur to work both with 130mm quick release, 135mm QR, and 142 thru-axel frames.

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Miller
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2006 8:54 pm
Location: Reading, UK

by Miller

Depends how much you want to spend. Centaur has just been relaunched as 11 speed so that's the value group. Chorus is much loved on this forum for a winning mix of top level function without being too spendy. Then there's Record and SR if you want red logos on your carbon.

gitsome
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by gitsome

Thanks, so then do all components need to be HO for inter-compatibility in the group? Im seeing HO Crankset etc...aside from fitting wider any other advantage? I dont mind spending more for record or sr as its been 9 yrs or so...tho the 10sp still runs perfectly, but bearings, cassettes, chains wearing out im wondering if worth the $ to restore or spend more and upgrade to modernest components because theyll shift better, be forwards compatible w wheels, larger cassettes, etc...like an investment in the future kind of thing.


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sawyer
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by sawyer

Are you running the old style ergos?

If you are, I'd say get the current shape ergos certainly. These days you can only get new full carbon ergos in 11s. They used to do Centaur in 10S in the revised shape, but AFAIK that is discontinued. You can actually get the internals backwards converted - so it would be possible to buy 11s ergos and convert them into 10s - but might seem an odd and expensive thing to do if you are looking to upgrade.

So ... assuming you're going to 11S, then buy some carbon ergos (Record/SR), an 11S cassette, an 11S chain, and an 11S RD are you are good to go. IME 10S chainsets and FDs work fine with 11S ergos, though no doubt it isn't to manufacturer's spec.

TBH 10S, if you have the newer ergo shape is IMO as good as anything. Slightly more tolerant than 11S on rear adjustment. Maybe the new 4 arm crank in some way feels a bit better, but the data suggests it's pretty much the same. Front shifting with the new FD, ergos, and chainset is a bit better it is true
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gitsome
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Location: nyc

by gitsome

Thanks, yes the 10 is prob the ergos you speak of and has been flawless over 2000+ miles/year. Im not rushing to let it go either just looking around and thinking....might wait until cassette and/or front rings are worn down to make any changes. Running a vuma quad which has been great to albeit flexy on the big ring, i imagine that would be considerable imprivement.
So no need to keep everything HO ? Ok to mix and match?
Bikeshops here dont like campy due to its business policies so hard to get any advice that way. Even "authorized dealers" shy away from anything other than ordering a full groupset at full price.

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kwakekeham
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by kwakekeham

Nothing wrong with what you're doing. Sad that you're experience with shops seems to be poor.

So all post 2015 Campagnolo have the same pull ratios , so to do the upgrade you'll need FD, RD, Ergo's, Cassette, Chain, Crankset (I'd consider at least a brake pad replacement now too, the new compounds have improved so much if you haven't already). But I think you already know this.

The HO crankset has a different chainline at the crank. It's more a disc thing. The Rear derailleur just updated to work "better" with this new chainline, but still works with the old one.

So spin a bigger cassette -- If a 32 then I'd go for

FD = Chorus
RD = Chorus medium (will be labeled HO but no worries, the 2018 catalog literally has the same wording in the rim setup)
Ergos = Chorus if you want to stick with Ultra-shift (which I think you do based on comments)
Chain = 11sp Campagnolo chain (or chorus, or whatever the non series is 3 grams lighter according to the catalog)
Crankset = your choice, rotor like you said, or get a deal on the 2015 Chorus crankset (and bb) since I've seen some online drops in price.
Cassette = Campagnolo 11 (non series) 11-32 or Chorus in 12-29

Most of this is marginally more expensive than Potenza for components. The geometry is the same as the higher end stuff, just more carbon, ceramic bearings, and titanium at super record level. So that's your choice. The RD's are going to be listed as HO and right now the HO and H11 cranksets are more expensive, but if you're not running disc you don't need those -- In fact I don't think you'd want those. Record full = 2026g, Chorus = 2143g. I haven't looked up prices, but I recall there is quite the jump to Record and SR.

gitsome
Posts: 715
Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:03 am
Location: nyc

by gitsome

Thank you so much for this detailed reply. I guess it makes sense to use campy crank as well, i think i will wear out current gears then decide, maybe next year. Also found out my 2012 404 are not 11 sp compatible so that would require new hubs (rotor revolvr?) Or new wheels alltogether...which maybe is not worth the $$ in toto. Not sure....

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by Weenie


AJS914
Posts: 2199
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

Campy can last virtually forever. It would be a lot cheaper to replace bearings and refurbish your 10 speed drivetrain.

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