Is it too late to purchase a Colnago C60?

Discuss light weight issues concerning road bikes & parts.

Is it too late to purchase a Colnago C60

Poll runs till Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:00 am

Yes, the C60 is nearing the end of its life and it is not a good time to buy
15
16%
No, the C60 will be for sale at least through 2018 and it is a great time to buy
58
64%
The C59 is better than the C60 because it is the last flagship Colnago with a BSA bottom bracket
18
20%
 
Total votes: 91

c60rider
Posts: 350
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2017 11:12 pm

by c60rider

For me too many manufacturers keep bringing out a new so-called flagship frame every year. They claim all sorts of improvements over the old one yet in reality there's probably very little difference. Colnago just don't do that they only bring out a new frame if they can significantly improve it over the old one so current models often remain current for 5 years. The people that buy Colnago's probably know that already and buy a bike to keep rather than getting rid of it every year and buying the latest. I doubt I'll ever sell my C60 and the only way it will go is if it gets broken somehow! :cry:

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mpulsiv
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by mpulsiv

hannawald wrote:Don´t take it please as a flame attempt, I may be just a lack of my knowledge. But C60 is a classic frame. There is nearly nothing to improve..The industry is going disc, aero, cable integration. None of it is an issue for classic C60..the only thing they may improve is tyre clearance I think. Is it important for you?


As a matter of fact, tire clearance is utterly important. C60 is a fine machine but 25mm max clearance a deal breaker. Take 28mm Compass, Panaracer or S-Works cotton ‘Hell of the North’ tires for a spin to see what I’m talking about.
Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

:arrow: CBA = Chronic Bike Addiction
:arrow: OCD = Obsessive Cycling Disorder

by Weenie


BikeKingV1r
Posts: 29
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:55 pm

by BikeKingV1r

All the new C60’s should have clearance for a 28 with no issues. Also keep in mind that you can special order a DM version that will for sure give you more room than a 28mm tire which they will be using in the Roubaix this coming season I was told

stormur
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Location: FIN

by stormur

mpulsiv wrote:
hannawald wrote:Don´t take it please as a flame attempt, I may be just a lack of my knowledge. But C60 is a classic frame. There is nearly nothing to improve..The industry is going disc, aero, cable integration. None of it is an issue for classic C60..the only thing they may improve is tyre clearance I think. Is it important for you?


As a matter of fact, tire clearance is utterly important. C60 is a fine machine but 25mm max clearance a deal breaker. Take 28mm Compass, Panaracer or S-Works cotton ‘Hell of the North’ tires for a spin to see what I’m talking about.



I agree that 25mm clearance is not enough, however why someone should ride such tires like Panaracer or Specialized on Colnago... (?) ..... i don't get it :mrgreen:
Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company.
Mark Twain


I can be wrong, and have plenty of examples for that ;)

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mpulsiv
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by mpulsiv

stormur wrote:
mpulsiv wrote:
hannawald wrote:Don´t take it please as a flame attempt, I may be just a lack of my knowledge. But C60 is a classic frame. There is nearly nothing to improve..The industry is going disc, aero, cable integration. None of it is an issue for classic C60..the only thing they may improve is tyre clearance I think. Is it important for you?


As a matter of fact, tire clearance is utterly important. C60 is a fine machine but 25mm max clearance a deal breaker. Take 28mm Compass, Panaracer or S-Works cotton ‘Hell of the North’ tires for a spin to see what I’m talking about.



I agree that 25mm clearance is not enough, however why someone should ride such tires like Panaracer or Specialized on Colnago... (?) ..... i don't get it :mrgreen:


Wait, it's OK for people to slap Shimano and SRAM on Colnago but not OK to ride fine tires? Is there a specific tire that C60 needs to be dressed up for besides 25mm Veloflex Master and 25mm Challenge Strada?

Have you ridden any of these tires?
http://www.compasscycle.com/shop/compon ... inook-pass
http://www.panaracer.com/lineup/road.html
http://www.specialized.com/us/en/turbo- ... 209-133458
Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

:arrow: CBA = Chronic Bike Addiction
:arrow: OCD = Obsessive Cycling Disorder

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TonyM
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Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:11 pm

by TonyM

28mm is necessary??...no wait another year and then 30mm will be necessary or maybe better to switch to 32mm right now...

I am happy with my 25mm (Vittoria Open Corsa or Veloflex Corsa) but honestly they are not that different to the 23mm on my C60. I also tried 28mm on my other bike but it just feel like a city bike then.

I suppose if you ride some „hard“ tires (like the Conti GP4k) and weigh >180 lbs and ride on bad roads and not on a C60 then yes you need 25mm or more.

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mpulsiv
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by mpulsiv

TonyM wrote:28mm is necessary??...no wait another year and then 30mm will be necessary or maybe better to switch to 32mm right now...

I am happy with my 25mm (Vittoria Open Corsa or Veloflex Corsa) but honestly they are not that different to the 23mm on my C60. I also tried 28mm on my other bike but it just feel like a city bike then.

I suppose if you ride some „hard“ tires (like the Conti GP4k) and weigh >180 lbs and ride on bad roads and not on a C60 then yes you need 25mm or more.


You mentioned that you tried 28mm tires on your other bike and it felt like a city bike. Which tire would this be? It’s all in your head. I raced crits on Panaracer, which measure ~30mm and the only thing that was slowing me down is my legs! Don’t blame the equipment, blame the rider. Yes, Conti 4000S is a harsh tire, even the 28mm hence the reason I mention some of the finer tires along with cotton. My go-to race tire is Veloflex Master 25mm. I’m waiting for a day for them to release 28mm version and I will be all over it.

I fail to understand what is penalty for manufacturers to widen and increase height of fork, seatstays and brake bridge by ~ 3mm. Please don’t tell me that it will exhibit aero penalty and a rider won’t stand on a podium because of this.

One more time - don’t blame the equipment, blame the rider!
Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

:arrow: CBA = Chronic Bike Addiction
:arrow: OCD = Obsessive Cycling Disorder

stormur
Posts: 1182
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:50 pm
Location: FIN

by stormur

mpulsiv wrote:
stormur wrote:
mpulsiv wrote:
hannawald wrote:Don´t take it please as a flame attempt, I may be just a lack of my knowledge. But C60 is a classic frame. There is nearly nothing to improve..The industry is going disc, aero, cable integration. None of it is an issue for classic C60..the only thing they may improve is tyre clearance I think. Is it important for you?


As a matter of fact, tire clearance is utterly important. C60 is a fine machine but 25mm max clearance a deal breaker. Take 28mm Compass, Panaracer or S-Works cotton ‘Hell of the North’ tires for a spin to see what I’m talking about.



I agree that 25mm clearance is not enough, however why someone should ride such tires like Panaracer or Specialized on Colnago... (?) ..... i don't get it :mrgreen:


Wait, it's OK for people to slap Shimano and SRAM on Colnago but not OK to ride fine tires? Is there a specific tire that C60 needs to be dressed up for besides 25mm Veloflex Master and 25mm Challenge Strada?

Have you ridden any of these tires?
http://www.compasscycle.com/shop/compon ... inook-pass
http://www.panaracer.com/lineup/road.html
http://www.specialized.com/us/en/turbo- ... 209-133458


"fine" means obviously different for me than for you ;) it's not about "proprietary" tire brand for Italian bike ( however dressing Maserati in Goodridge tires instead of Pirelli sounds insane,, isn't it ? ) . It's about all else what make tire "fine" or... not.

Answering your Q : Compass: not. Panaracer was quiet fine until had to turn across painted sign on wet road... it was last day of these on my rims. Specialized : had enough looking at few fresh sets - ridden by colleagues -which literally cracked in less than a month ( rotten rubber ).

Another thing is, being European why should I feed "foreign". brands instead of "local" like Pirelli, Vittoria, Veloflex or Challenge ??? Can't see ANY reason for that ! Specially they do not give me more than I have now... .

( those brands I use exclusively with exception for 1 pair of Conti for commuting, but also... European )
Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company.
Mark Twain


I can be wrong, and have plenty of examples for that ;)

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TonyM
Posts: 2621
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:11 pm

by TonyM

mpulsiv wrote:
TonyM wrote:28mm is necessary??...no wait another year and then 30mm will be necessary or maybe better to switch to 32mm right now...

I am happy with my 25mm (Vittoria Open Corsa or Veloflex Corsa) but honestly they are not that different to the 23mm on my C60. I also tried 28mm on my other bike but it just feel like a city bike then.

I suppose if you ride some „hard“ tires (like the Conti GP4k) and weigh >180 lbs and ride on bad roads and not on a C60 then yes you need 25mm or more.


You mentioned that you tried 28mm tires on your other bike and it felt like a city bike. Which tire would this be? It’s all in your head. I raced crits on Panaracer, which measure ~30mm and the only thing that was slowing me down is my legs! Don’t blame the equipment, blame the rider. Yes, Conti 4000S is a harsh tire, even the 28mm hence the reason I mention some of the finer tires along with cotton. My go-to race tire is Veloflex Master 25mm. I’m waiting for a day for them to release 28mm version and I will be all over it.

I fail to understand what is penalty for manufacturers to widen and increase height of fork, seatstays and brake bridge by ~ 3mm. Please don’t tell me that it will exhibit aero penalty and a rider won’t stand on a podium because of this.

One more time - don’t blame the equipment, blame the rider!


HUH? I don't blame the equipment. We all here have better equipment than our legs/ lungs etc....

And the manufacturers will definitely increase the tire clearance of their bikes. That's I am sure....
I just don't think that everybody needs 25mm or more....

But as I said...
- How much do you weigh?
- How bad/good are the roads you ride on?
- Which frame/ bike do you ride?

nestornnk
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2014 3:44 pm
Contact:

by nestornnk

The replacement of the C60 will come next summer.
The good thing is that you can still order a C60 with a custom paint job for around 300euros extra.Unfortunately Colnago will have to approve your design...

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mpulsiv
Posts: 1208
Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:17 pm

by mpulsiv

TonyM wrote:
mpulsiv wrote:
TonyM wrote:28mm is necessary??...no wait another year and then 30mm will be necessary or maybe better to switch to 32mm right now...

I am happy with my 25mm (Vittoria Open Corsa or Veloflex Corsa) but honestly they are not that different to the 23mm on my C60. I also tried 28mm on my other bike but it just feel like a city bike then.

I suppose if you ride some „hard“ tires (like the Conti GP4k) and weigh >180 lbs and ride on bad roads and not on a C60 then yes you need 25mm or more.


You mentioned that you tried 28mm tires on your other bike and it felt like a city bike. Which tire would this be? It’s all in your head. I raced crits on Panaracer, which measure ~30mm and the only thing that was slowing me down is my legs! Don’t blame the equipment, blame the rider. Yes, Conti 4000S is a harsh tire, even the 28mm hence the reason I mention some of the finer tires along with cotton. My go-to race tire is Veloflex Master 25mm. I’m waiting for a day for them to release 28mm version and I will be all over it.

I fail to understand what is penalty for manufacturers to widen and increase height of fork, seatstays and brake bridge by ~ 3mm. Please don’t tell me that it will exhibit aero penalty and a rider won’t stand on a podium because of this.

One more time - don’t blame the equipment, blame the rider!


HUH? I don't blame the equipment. We all here have better equipment than our legs/ lungs etc....

And the manufacturers will definitely increase the tire clearance of their bikes. That's I am sure....
I just don't think that everybody needs 25mm or more....

But as I said...
- How much do you weigh?
- How bad/good are the roads you ride on?
- Which frame/ bike do you ride?


@TonyM I'm still curious as to which 28mm tire felt like a city bike to you?

I weigh 73kg but puzzled as to how my weight is even relevant to tire width. To put this into perspective, if rider X is ~10kg heaver then rider Y, it doesn't mean you need to over inflate the tires and/or run wider tires (e.g. 28+mm)

I train on steel frame and race on aluminum Allez. Tires and pressure is the pivotal point of ride quality, frame material not so much.

Tarmac is fairly smooth with occasional bumps. Road races are chipseal, so the tarmic exhibit a lot of vibration!

Image
Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

:arrow: CBA = Chronic Bike Addiction
:arrow: OCD = Obsessive Cycling Disorder

AJS914
Posts: 2261
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:52 pm

by AJS914

I tried 25mm Conti GP4000s (measure 28mm) and they felt a bit sloppy compared to the 23s (measure 25mm) I usually use so I switched back. There wasn't a huge amount of extra comfort with 3 more millimeters of width.
Last edited by AJS914 on Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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TonyM
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by TonyM

mpulsiv wrote:@TonyM I'm still curious as to which 28mm tire felt like a city bike to you?

I weigh 73kg but puzzled as to how my weight is even relevant to tire width. To put this into perspective, if rider X is ~10kg heaver then rider Y, it doesn't mean you need to over inflate the tires and/or run wider tires (e.g. 28+mm)

I train on steel frame and race on aluminum Allez. Tires and pressure is the pivotal point of ride quality, frame material not so much.

Tarmac is fairly smooth with occasional bumps. Road races are chipseal, so the tarmic exhibit a lot of vibration!



I used Vittoria Rubino 28mm and Conti 4K 28mm. Both felt too big for my taste. The Conti on top too stiff.
I weigh almost 5 kg less than you. The roads are here are quite good (although it's all relativ).
Bikes are a C60 and a BMC Roadmachine. On my C60 I usually run Vittoria Open Corsa or Veloflex Corsa 23/25 with 90/95 psi.
I have a long stem and a carbon handlebar.

You will see many bikers (also here in WW) weighing 120-140 lbs and going back from 25mm to 23mm (f/r).

At the end the whole package - rider, frame, geometry, wheels, tarmac, targets, personal preferences - will determine which tire size and pressure is the best.

So yes for you being almost 75kg and with a steel/aluminum frame I can believe that the 28mm may be better than 25mm.
I also used to bike on a Aluminum Colnago the ride war quite harsh because of the frame.

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Calnago
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by Calnago

Good rebuttal @TonyM. At the end of the day it really is about personal preference and the conditions you ride. I’m over 90kg and ride on 25mm Arrenbergs tubulars on my nicest road bikes. Or even 24mm (older Veloflex Roubaixs but wouldn’t mind trying the newer 24mm Specialized Turbo Cottons). I’ve got a set of Veloflex Vlanderen (27mm) tubulars on a set of Boras and they’re great tires but unless I’m on really really bad roads I much prefer the feel of 25’s. And especially for climbing, the larger tire (27mm) just feels sluggish compared to the 24mm tire. And it is. Pressures in the Vlanderens at my weight would be in the neighborhood of 80R/75F. Whereas with the 24mm Veloflex my optimal pressure is in the 112R/105F range.
Years before the wider tire trend started I did some major touring. My loaded touring bike is in the 95lb/43kg range and I run 700c rims. It’s been a lot of places in the world, on good roads and rocky gravel paths. I initially put 37mm tires on it. But for the vast majority, no, make that all of the touring I was doing I ultimately settled on the 32mm version. It was perfect. Kept me from pinch flats but still provided a solid feel and precise handling on the road.

Oh, way sidetracked here... but it’s never too late to buy a C60, unless you can’t find one. But if you really want to run fat tires on your road bike then the current C60’s won’t really accommodate that.
Last edited by Calnago on Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by Weenie


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mpulsiv
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Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:17 pm

by mpulsiv

AJS914 wrote:I tried 25mm Conti GP4000s (measure 28mm) and they felt a bit sloppy compared to the 23s (measure 25mm) I usually use so I switched back. There wasn't a huge amount of extra comfort with 3 more millimeters of width.


Conti GP4000S is harsh tire, period. Increasing width, doesn't increase comfort. My 28mm, measure ~30mm and at 60 PSI they still don't provide the comfort of finer tires. My 25mm Veloflex Master cotton tire, which is 5mm more narrower, perform better in every aspect. Moral of the story - don't be afraid to experience with better tires and lower tire pressure.
Racing is a three-dimensional high-speed chess game, involving hundreds of pieces on the board.

:arrow: CBA = Chronic Bike Addiction
:arrow: OCD = Obsessive Cycling Disorder

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