Favero Assioma PowerMeter Pedals
Moderator: robbosmans
I think Favero is just going to have to bite the bullet and move their electronics inside the spindle (while getting rid of their pod).
Sure they could make their own shimano based pedal like Garmin, but I think this pod style is just going to limit them as far as what they can do going forward.
Sure they could make their own shimano based pedal like Garmin, but I think this pod style is just going to limit them as far as what they can do going forward.
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Add me to the massively disappointed crowd...
My wife is using the old X-Pedo version. The cleats just don't work as well as Shimano, and they don't last as long. She's never had any issues getting stuck with a little bit of dirt/gravely bits with Shimano, unlike with the Look cleats (couple of times she literally could not unclip--had to stop, take a foot out of the show and wrench the shoe out. This is with a pretty new set of cleats and some gravel stuck in there).
She has about 2mm of play left to move the shoe in, so this ends up being about 1cm per side. That's just way too much of a difference. And it will affect corning clearance in a crit, for sure.
My wife is using the old X-Pedo version. The cleats just don't work as well as Shimano, and they don't last as long. She's never had any issues getting stuck with a little bit of dirt/gravely bits with Shimano, unlike with the Look cleats (couple of times she literally could not unclip--had to stop, take a foot out of the show and wrench the shoe out. This is with a pretty new set of cleats and some gravel stuck in there).
She has about 2mm of play left to move the shoe in, so this ends up being about 1cm per side. That's just way too much of a difference. And it will affect corning clearance in a crit, for sure.
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Ride4Life wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:57 pmI think Favero is just going to have to bite the bullet and move their electronics inside the spindle (while getting rid of their pod).
Sure they could make their own shimano based pedal like Garmin, but I think this pod style is just going to limit them as far as what they can do going forward.
It's pretty hard to do rechargeable + strain gauge + electronics in spindle without going completely bespoke. On Garmin pedals, the battery board is in the pedal body and the disposable battery sits at the very outboard edge of the pedal body. The cartridge uses needle bearings inboard, allowing for a tapered/widened pedal spindle that holds the strain gauges and electronics/radio.
Favero would have to design their own bodies from the ground up instead of using Xpedo/Wellgo ones.
Given their success to date with the Assioma, I hope their R&D department are putting in the hard yards on something new. A redesigned pod/spindle would allow them to venture into SPD and proper SPD-SL...(not the "you deal with it" compromise people are buying into with these)TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 11:49 pmFavero would have to design their own bodies from the ground up instead of using Xpedo/Wellgo ones.
I'm using the +4mm wide bodied DA pedals but 13mm is an insane amount of q factor increase on each side.gplama wrote:Given their success to date with the Assioma, I hope their R&D department are putting in the hard yards on something new. A redesigned pod/spindle would allow them to venture into SPD and proper SPD-SL...(not the "you deal with it" compromise people are buying into with these)TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 11:49 pmFavero would have to design their own bodies from the ground up instead of using Xpedo/Wellgo ones.
As quoted in your video.. The knee issue is going to happen unless you are of a very wide build and needing such an extreme stance.
Seems like a desperate move to counteract Garmin's Rally range even though it is only suitable for an extreme end of the market.
This may even harm their reputation if people start getting hurt from this "feature".
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sychen wrote: ↑Tue Jul 20, 2021 1:13 amI'm using the +4mm wide bodied DA pedals but 13mm is an insane amount of q factor increase on each side.
As quoted in your video.. The knee issue is going to happen unless you are of a very wide build and needing such an extreme stance.
Seems like a desperate move to counteract Garmin's Rally range even though it is only suitable for an extreme end of the market.
This may even harm their reputation if people start getting hurt from this "feature".
I don't think there's very many people who must have SPD-SL at all costs, especially +13mm q-factor. Most will just stick to the Look-"compatible" Assiomas. If they care that deeply about SPD-SL, they'll eat the extra $400 and buy Rally RS pedals.
A normal sized person with bowed legs / varus knees might need about 65mm q-factor, but yeah, that's niche audience. I wouldn't call it a desperation move...just a stopgap solution while they work on the next generation.
This is like MTB stance width isn't it? Last I checked, there's no epidemic of knee injuries in mountain biking. Mountain biking isn't the same obviously, but there's still a fair amount of static, seated pedaling and, arguably, more grinding up climbs (at least in my neck of the woods). I fully acknowledge this stance width won't work for everyone, but fears of injury seem a little overblown.
Is that 2.5mm in both the left and right direction (Total of 5mm lateral adjustment)?TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:09 am
SPD-SL cleats allow a maximum of 5mm of lateral adjustment, so at best you’d still be +5mm…
So if I understand correctly, 65mm Q factor on these, combined with Shimano cleats, had a range of 62.5mm to 67.5mm??
I asked because I'm interested in how much I can decrease the q-factor.
Didn't you say that they have been working on this for over a year?gplama wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 11:54 pmGiven their success to date with the Assioma, I hope their R&D department are putting in the hard yards on something new. A redesigned pod/spindle would allow them to venture into SPD and proper SPD-SL...(not the "you deal with it" compromise people are buying into with these)TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 11:49 pmFavero would have to design their own bodies from the ground up instead of using Xpedo/Wellgo ones.
If that's true, I really can't see them coming out with their own cleat or modifying the pod/spindle for another year or two.
I think the different dynamics of mtb being in and out of saddle mitigates the q factor issue. The wider stance also has better control and stability.jch3n wrote:This is like MTB stance width isn't it? Last I checked, there's no epidemic of knee injuries in mountain biking. Mountain biking isn't the same obviously, but there's still a fair amount of static, seated pedaling and, arguably, more grinding up climbs (at least in my neck of the woods). I fully acknowledge this stance width won't work for everyone, but fears of injury seem a little overblown.
Road riding just by being in the same position all the time(with more distance and duration) exasperates repetitive motion injuries. Some people have more knee / ankle issues than others especially with injury history.
I know personally my right leg/ knee/ankle due to decades of football has very specific positions it likes and doesn't like.. My left leg isn't as specific.
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I've never used SPD-SL and instead use Look simply because when I bought my first road bike they guy threw in a set of Look pedals, but they don't seem significantly differnt than SPD-SL. Am I correct that while SPD-SL might be overall more popular than Look, a market for a power meter pedal utilizing SPD-SL that has some disadvantages (wider q-factor, self assmebly from existing pedals) may be limited. Unless you have bikes with SPD-SL pedals it seems like people would just change cleats from SPD-SL to Look Keo and use the standard Assioma pedals.
I'm guessing they don't offer an integrated pedal due to SPD-SL being still covered by Shimano patents and apparantly not paying royalties to Shimano, while Garmin agreed to pay?
I'm guessing they don't offer an integrated pedal due to SPD-SL being still covered by Shimano patents and apparantly not paying royalties to Shimano, while Garmin agreed to pay?
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Ride4Life wrote: ↑Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:56 am
Is that 2.5mm in both the left and right direction (Total of 5mm lateral adjustment)?
So if I understand correctly, 65mm Q factor on these, combined with Shimano cleats, had a range of 62.5mm to 67.5mm??
I asked because I'm interested in how much I can decrease the q-factor.
Correct.
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Q factor is the one thing my body can’t cope with: 5mm will really make my knees hurt. But 12mm?! Holy mother of god. Wow.gplama wrote:Yep. And it's a show stopper for me. I've thrown up my take on YouTube on these with footage of the difference in stance-width and cornering clearance. It's significant on a road bike and a change I won't be sticking with.
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I certainly can't speak for everyone, but I've had some pretty signficant knee tendonitis and hip pain when going between my MTB and road bike, and it didn't go away until I was able to mimic (or very close) my road Q and mtb Q, as well as crank length. Like you though, I'm doing a fair number of long (30-60 minute) climbs. For those that are pedaling less in a static position on the MTB, it may be less of an issue.jch3n wrote: ↑Tue Jul 20, 2021 2:52 amThis is like MTB stance width isn't it? Last I checked, there's no epidemic of knee injuries in mountain biking. Mountain biking isn't the same obviously, but there's still a fair amount of static, seated pedaling and, arguably, more grinding up climbs (at least in my neck of the woods). I fully acknowledge this stance width won't work for everyone, but fears of injury seem a little overblown.